[davidsabishop]

In the new catalogue they are pushing "On site solutions"
This means:
"Don't employ a window cleaner who has just paid us loads of dosh for a wfp system when you can buy the gear from us and do it yourself!"

[Sapphire Window Cleaning]

shooting themselves in the foot there!
Most of their income comes from window cleaners!
Why would they force window cleaners out of business?
doesnt make sense.




Matt

[drwindows]

Some places wont have window cleaners come on site, they get their own staff to do it.  I tried to quote a college like that once, they said no thanks as they have their own maintenance team and only get contractors in for really specialist things (which window cleaning wasnt).

I guess it makes sense that they would buy a static system or something like it for their guys to use.

[Mike_G]

Yep a massive drawback of wfp that! I would imagine larger businesses would be interested and with the ionic training thrown in their gardener/ handyman would be an expert window cleaner in just a few hours, well for the outsides at least

[Gav Camm lammy 283]

n y not alls fair in love n war

[niceandclean]

We took on a multi sited school 2 years ago. They had their caretakers (now called maintenance men) clean the windows using the wfp, they had a static system, and filled up omni trolly's. They also cleaned the insides, it took 3 guys 2-3 months to do the clean, takes two of us long days a week to complete every 6 months. The school realised that it was more cost effective and less hassle, h&s ect to have a contractor come in.  

[Gav Camm lammy 283]

r they selling you the system they brought 

[niceandclean]

r they selling you the system they brought 

, no they still have it. They use the pure water for engineering and science lessons so im told.

[Gav Camm lammy 283]

damm that school 

[matt]

one of my bigger commercial contracts has had a visit from one the sales team selling a thermobore system with a free days training at school

makes me laugh, they sell a system to a window cleaner, they try and get the term " reach and wash" a household name, then they cut out the window cleaner and sell a system direct to the customer, the window cleaner has done the hard work by getting the name known ( with the van signage ) then they get sold out

its al about money

[Wizard]

Well boys we know what to do" GIVE THEM A  MISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!"

[drwindows]

I won't be giving them a miss.  I have an ionic thermo system and its the best piece of kit.  I'm going to have a look at their new swift poles too, according to the catalogue the 35 footer only weighs 2.9 kilos, which seems to be very light.

I couldnt care less if they sell to building owners, the only type of buildings that will buy their own systems are those that already have maintenance guys doing them by squeegee.

If you're seriously worried about ionic selling direct to building owners then you dont understand how commercial window cleaning works.  And besides, what do you expect them to do?  say "sorry no you cant have one of our systems, go away" I dont think so somehow.

[Wizard]

There are many indusries that have a closed house policy I dont see way not for window cleaner. It some talking for gardeners to get ecover TFR. They will not sell it to you direct. It is just good business practice not to compeat with your customers but to protect them.I have been in business of different fields for nearly 40 year and its common practice for suppliers to protect there clients business interests.

[matt]

one of my bigger commercial contracts has had a visit from one the sales team selling a thermobore system with a free days training at school

I couldnt care less if they sell to building owners, the only type of buildings that will buy their own systems are those that already have maintenance guys doing them by squeegee.

well thats WRONG as i am the window cleaner, they phoned up the facilities manager and booked in the demo, the sales pitch was that the maintance guy could do it in his spare time

[Wizard]

Looks as if they have burned out there market. So trying to sell to anybody, who will pay there high prices. feeling the pinch are they?

[simbo]

P*****g on there own doorstep as far as i am concerned!!! won't ever use a company that wants to now see me out of biz, albeit a small but lucrative part
paul

[AuRavelling79]

It does sound like Ionics are feeling the pinch - errr - expanding their user base -doesn't it? So they go out and sell a big piece of kit to say a University or a Town Council who employ an in house team. Doesn't bother me but some of the bigger w/c companies might not be too happy. Perhaps Ionics are sawing off the branch they are sat upon.

As a side note - there is a guy near me with his wraparound van, crippled man logo and British Window Cleaning Academy sticker and I had to give a wry smile.

He pulled up next to me today in a Renault/Vauxhall van with a 1000L un caged IBC tank in the back and proceeds to start on the next door neighbours house. This chap looked about half my age with muscles like Popeye and the poor sod pulls out half inch hose and a yellow pole that fully closed looked about 3" wide and 2 metres long.

The system was like a whitewashed grave - shiny on the outside but full of junk and rotten gear inside. Water dripping out the back of the van, no trip hazard cones either - but it looked the biz with the doors shut. Part way round he swears to himself, leans his pole against the house wall with the flow on full and he goes back to the van to get something.

When he came back I asked him whether he had a tap or a flow controller and he says "Naah, don't need it mate - I got a 1000L on board!"

 :

[drwindows]

well thats WRONG as i am the window cleaner, they phoned up the facilities manager and booked in the demo, the sales pitch was that the maintance guy could do it in his spare time

Sorry matt had to laugh there.

If I was a facilities guy, I would be thinking "Pay X every time I want to have window cleaner come along"

OR

Pay Y Once for a system and get maintenance people to do it as often as I want for no more money.

Not a difficult decision really.

Thats the way the college's fac manager explained it to me, and I couldnt really argue except to say that I would certainly do a better job than a maintence man, as its what I do all the time.

But I still think it will mostly be those who are already doing it with squeegees, because otherwise they may have to take on extra maintenance guys to do it, which would be more expensive than getting a contractor.

And Ionics "on-site" systems are not new i dont think, I remember seeing them in their catalogue when I was still a newbie.

[matt]

well thats WRONG as i am the window cleaner, they phoned up the facilities manager and booked in the demo, the sales pitch was that the maintance guy could do it in his spare time

Sorry matt had to laugh there.

If I was a facilities guy, I would be thinking "Pay X every time I want to have window cleaner come along"

OR

Pay Y Once for a system and get maintenance people to do it as often as I want for no more money.

Not a difficult decision really.

Thats the way the college's fac manager explained it to me, and I couldnt really argue except to say that I would certainly do a better job than a maintence man, as its what I do all the time.

But I still think it will mostly be those who are already doing it with squeegees, because otherwise they may have to take on extra maintenance guys to do it, which would be more expensive than getting a contractor.

And Ionics "on-site" systems are not new i dont think, I remember seeing them in their catalogue when I was still a newbie.

why laugh ? ? ?

you were wrong when you said "I couldnt care less if they sell to building owners, the only type of buildings that will buy their own systems are those that already have maintenance guys doing them by squeegee." as this simply isnt the case

i have allways said, when they run out of window cleaners to sell to, who will the next target be, yes the bigger commercial clients

i kept the job as the manager couldnt see the point in shelling out all the money when they could have it done by me ( without any stress on the quality of the job ,then just signing the invoice ), these were his words ( so sorry to disappoint you in the idea that because i have a DIY system, i must do a substandard job )

[drwindows]

I said I couldnt care less, and beleieve it or not, I know what I could care less about better than you, so I am not wrong.  I still couldnt care less. 

so sorry to disappoint you in the idea that because i have a DIY system, i must do a substandard job

I didnt say that, and i didnt even imply it.  sensitive for you this is eh? 

i kept the job as the manager couldnt see the point in shelling out all the money when they could have it done by me ( without any stress on the quality of the job ,then just signing the invoice

I'm not suprised at all, and thats exactly what I was saying.  That I think that mostly, building owners that would buy a system are already having their guys do the window cleaning by sqeegee.  I very much doubt anyone who isnt already having their staff do it would change, because they would probably have to employ extra people, thereby negating the cost benefit.