[macmac]

Fink there must be a few beers flowing tonight!

[Sapphire Window Cleaning]

NO.

That will take the sam tm if it was acompany or one man band your missing the point that just cause you clean your self doesnt mean its all profit you have to work which is time which is an expense.

so say my company buys the work one man does in two weeks i pay him 300 a week plus running cost of 120 a week now you clean this your self you still have to include your time has an expense so it makes the same!! simples

So you dont pay employers NI? or EMPLOYERS liability insurance?
Companies usually pay more for van insurance, as they insure them for ANYONE to drive.
So overheads will be higher for a company than a self employed window cleaner.

[Window Washers]

This is why I wont buy a round, I wont even sell a round.
I am planning on building my business, so when I am ready for retirement I can sell the entire business. the buyer would have a complete working business including staff.
that way I would get the most amount for it.



Matt

How RUDE!!



Dream on LOL, you are contradicting yourself. 

[Sapphire Window Cleaning]

This is why I wont buy a round, I wont even sell a round.
I am planning on building my business, so when I am ready for retirement I can sell the entire business. the buyer would have a complete working business including staff.
that way I would get the most amount for it.



Matt

Dream on LOL, you are contradicting yourself. 

And why am I contradicting myself?
selling a round and selling a full working business with reliable fully trained staff is totally different Ewan!
If you have fully trained reliable staff that will increase the price for the business!
like a house with an extension! you get more money for it.

[mark dew]

I also think the way to maximise selling prices would be to present it as a business. The van, livery, stationary, business account etc.
Selling a round only that has been canvassed or worked by someone for years, i wouldn't value as highly.

[wizard]

If one applied the rule of thumb used in most business valuations if you employ only you’re self. Then you do not have a business to sell. You only have self employment. To value you have to take off what it would cost the employ some one do d the work, this is then an expense. This withal other expenses taken away from turnover is roughly your net profit. Two to 3 times this amount is +- the value of your business. A round is not a business it is potential but has no substance. Try going to a bank and say my round is my collateral and see if you could get a loan and that strength. This is based on my years as a business broker, it is a difficult one and window cleaning is not a normal run of the mill business type of business. Value is always what some one who is able a willing to pay, at the end of the day. So we can thing our businesses have value is the buys think differently them we have a problem.

[ronnie paton]

If one applied the rule of thumb used in most business valuations if you employ only you’re self. Then you do not have a business to sell. You only have self employment. To value you have to take off what it would cost the employ some one do d the work, this is then an expense. This withal other expenses taken away from turnover is roughly your net profit. Two to 3 times this amount is +- the value of your business. A round is not a business it is potential but has no substance. Try going to a bank and say my round is my collateral and see if you could get a loan and that strength. This is based on my years as a business broker, it is a difficult one and window cleaning is not a normal run of the mill business type of business. Value is always what some one who is able a willing to pay, at the end of the day. So we can thing our businesses have value is the buys think differently them we have a problem.

well thats funny i got a Business loan for a ROUND?


Whats not normal about window cleanin what makes it different to a cafe or a shop?

[wizard]

Ronny Paton is right you never buy or value a business based on turn over.You could have more out goings and there no prifit and you would be buying a bancrupt business. In that case the only value would be in the assets E G equipment.

[wizard]

Read back what I said not using the round a colateral.You borrowded on your goodwill at the bank.

[daniel worgan]

A legitimate professional window cleaning business should be valued the same as any other business and that is certainly not at 3 x the monthly turnover,that is a ridiculous figure that keeps the window cleaning business classed as a second rate business,which is how many percieve us.
You guys out there who run it properly know the true worth of you business and those that still believe theirs maybe only worth beer money well.....need i say any more.

[wizard]

The deference between a cafe and a shop is it’s a fixed asset it tangible. It has an address it’s difficult to con a person that it does exist. Where we under value a selves is when we under charge. For our services. The one man that does own a business IMO from what I can read and that’s only here say and there will be others is Dave Morris. It’s called a going concern. If we sell a round its not a business its only a part of. We keep all the assets E G the van poles etc

[wizard]

You could not sell a few chairs and plate a patron or 10 and call it a business its only part of one selling the total sum is a business. All business are not valued by the same formula. AS i said before Value is the amount of cash an able and willing buyer would be prepared to pay.The market will always deside how much you would get.

[wizard]

Sole trader are also business but of less value than one with staff simply because a not w/c could buy it as a going concern.Therefor there would be more buyer and the price would be higher.The man buying a sole trader will be taking a biger chance in his purchase of that business .I am also a sole trade but would like to build it up to more if I could handle the problems of getting it to that leavel.

[ronnie paton]

being a sole trader is a business but why if you have staff does it make your business more saleable??

scenario 1- soletrader making 40k profit a year on is own accounts to show this for 3 years say.one van and one WFP setup.website and stationary ect

Scenario 2-ltd company making 22k profit mainly staff run(on tools anyway) got accounts 2 vans and 2 systems and same as above.

are you saying the second has a greater vlue and if so what value do you put on the two?

[macmac]

being a sole trader is a business but why if you have staff does it make your business more saleable??

scenario 1- soletrader making 40k profit a year on is own accounts to show this for 3 years say.one van and one WFP setup.website and stationary ect

Scenario 2-ltd company making 22k profit mainly staff run(on tools anyway) got accounts 2 vans and 2 systems and same as above.

are you saying the second has a greater vlue and if so what value do you put on the two?

I'd take the 22k & sit on my bum all day!

[ronnie paton]

wizard i see your point with window cleaning has its easy to laudering money fabricating your turnover but you could do the same wih a cafe.

But if you were to buy a business surely we woud look at accounts look at the rounds and work check on the customers to make sure it all added up???

[ronnie paton]

but you dont end sat on your ass all the time trust me!

so value the two businesses please.

[macmac]

At the end of the day it's a window cleaning business & no matter how much wishfull thinking- it has a price as a "window cleaning business" & I don't see that changing any time soon.

Only a buyer who is already a w/c would see the real value in it, most others would view it "high risk" IMO.

[ronnie paton]

but why is that different than a shop??

like the first post said they are selling for 2x yearly profit almost.

 mac i listen to loads who say it not rcket science any one can do it any when can do a window cleaning business but why is it that so many people who come for my vancancy say they have had there own business??? but then come for a job with me earning sa 300 a week???

also just for example were is your business at(staff, ltd company?,equipment, commercial ?residential?rough turnover idea ect?) and how long has it took you to get there?

[ronnie paton]

im going to say window cleaning values have changed and there have been a few on here that have proved that when selling theirs.

I would want about 2 x yearly profit for my ltd company and i know id get it has any intrested parrty would look into it properly before forking out over 100k and they would see the VALUE.

Obviuosly this is my opinion an i can see many people dont agree.

A business idea has just come to mind