[Peter Sweeney]

Guys

Good post Simon. You really are opening peoples minds to all the possibilities.

I agree that the NCCA have been running 41 years and are in the best position to achieve what we all desire. 41 years?

Pete

[derek west]

all this negativity makes me feel quite sad really, theres some great carpet cleaning and business minds on this site and others, who could really benefit from getting together and banging heads, where theres a will theres a way, you find a stumbling block and work out how to get round it, step by step this can be done.

so many silly remarks about egotism when really its just mistaken for enthusiasm and the love of the job. something a lot of you vets had when you first started out.

shame, real shame.

but hey ho, forums only make up 2 or 3 % of the carpet cleaning work force and optimism is my middle name, well it isn't really but you catch my drift.

derek "not perturbed in the slightest" west

[clinton]

Derek

Your right about the 3 % of c cleaners that use the forums,and only the other day i was chating to a very succsessful c cleaner and he too didnt want to use a forums for many reasons :

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Remember this?

www.cleantalk.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=8181&highlight=simon+gerrard

Shaun

[Paul_Ashworth]

Some good posts from Shaun and Derek.

Clinton
If i spend the time i waste on these forums marketing my business where would i be now, Might not be a bad idea actually.


Paul

[clinton]

Paul

Me too

[Paul_Ashworth]

Clinton,
The problem is without the forums and friends i've made made on here like Shaun, Pete, Steve B, Doug, id still be charging low prices and not making much money, And id like just to thank everybody especially Shaun & Pete for all there Help and support.


Paul

[robert meldrum]

So welcome to the CIU carpet cleaners association Paul 

[Mike_Roper]

At the end of the day YOU are your own business,YOU will make the difference between success(whatever you deem that to be) or failure, YOU will either be liked or disliked by your clients ,hence whether you will be retained or recommended or not.
Surely the NCCA has never set out to be a work generating tool but an organisation to highlight and set some sort of standard in carpet cleaning which to a certain degree has (I know of some guys who have passed the exam etc ,become members and have not yet cleaned a carpet).
Maybe I have myown ideas of what I want from my own business and this will differ from others- I,m happy to work locally on my own ,let things grow 'organically' through repeat and referrals, not a fast buck and have a solid business.
I have been a member of NCCA for approx 15yrs and a founder member of woolsafe(10yrs) both help my business but its ME that makes it work.
Mike

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

Simon


What I can't understand is your negativity towards any new association.

Is it because you want it to fail, so you can say "I told you so" ? or are you in such a position now that you can afford to be apathetic towards it, because it doesn't matter one way or the other if it is successful.

You state that there is little interest, but you have posted this topic both on here and on truckmounters and have had approx 15 negative comments - and as we have already established the carpet cleaners that frequent these forums number a tiny percentage of cleaners in the industry.

I say lets wait and see and form an opinion based on results.

Steve

[Ian Gourlay]

The only real motive has to be MONEY  

 how can they be motivated by money? the amount of effort these sort of things take, they would make more money devoting the time to building thier own business.

if you look at what really motivate people you will find money very low
down on the list, ego, power and ambition rank a lot higher. look at politicians do they go into politics because they want to help the people or are then enticed by the power or a sense that they in some way are better than the rest of us, so need to 'help' us

but I'm not saying anyone mentioned lately has this god complex but I think some people have an over-inflated self opinion and need to wind in their necks a bit  
Ian Gourlay Wrote
Yep thats why I went into Politics

But why do I spend so much time helping people with their problems  finding ways to make their lives an area better. Go knocking on the doors and get more insults than Joe H does   If it was Ego I would have quit years ago.

[robert meldrum]

Ego is part of it Ian just as some people need to be part of something, while others need to teach /help / mentor others.

Others just want to prove everyone and everything wrong and provide their solutions forgetting where they got their solutions from in the first place.

If people want someone to raise their profile, find them customers, show them how to do their job there's loads of information available on the internet forums and IICRC supply all the courses anyone could want.

[alan lewis]

I hope everyone has read the cleantalk link posted by Shaun, a few very important paragraphs by different poster's sum it up for me:


Simon

In a nutshell then, we are all fighting one another in a shrinking market place but there is a huge, and I do mean HUGE untapped market out there that if tapped effectively could get all of our phones ringing a lot more often. If you don’t believe me, just look at the rows of houses and estates in your own town that you have never worked in and ask yourself –Why?


Ken wainwright

There is an issue raised which, for me, requires clarification. This is the statement that only 25% of the market has been explored, and that 75% remains untapped. Does this refer equally to the business and residential sectors? Or both? And what is the source of these figures?

Simon

Now, it is a fact that if you put every carpet cleaner in the country together, I’ll bet that we don’t serve 25% of the total market because the other 75% don't even know that they can have their carpet cleaned by trained professional operators. Which means, in effect that we all scurry around fighting amongst ourselves for that measly portion of the market that we do have. Yellow Pages and Thomson Local Ad’s serve only to point the established part of the market towards us, but does not in anyway expand that market to find new potential and 75% untapped potential is huge.

Dave Lee

I seem to remember reading somewhere fairly recently, relating to some research done, comparing the carpet cleaning market in the USA to the UK. The figures may not be exact but in the USA the market was around 50% of the population, and in UK around 3%. Not the potential market but the present market.
I for one think 3% is more like the true figure,than 25%.

Ian Gorlay

This is an interesting post. Nobody knows the size of the market.
In most industries that is the starting point of market research.

Mike Halliday

To answer one point raised in the thread, The Franchise Rainbow International in 1997 did a survey, the conclusion was that 14% of the British population use the services of a professional carpet cleaner.

I believe that professional market research is needed to find out the real reason's the vast majority of people don't use us, only when we have those answer's can we act accordingly wether we are in an association or not.

Alan

[Goldfinch PCS]

Very Interesting Stats

To get the stats done is very costly. You can get the stats at the library but it is mainly based on commercial not domestic. The same company that does those stats can do the same for domestic if  they are paid or if they find it financially viable (they can sell it and make a profit).  I read the stats for 2006 some time back, I will pop into the library when I have some time and check the new stats (2008).

To be honest I just feel that the general public here isn't really aware of the service and it's true benefits. In America they sing and dance about everything and seem to be more proactive with an idea or concept.

In America they mostly have Truck Mounts so you find customers have less drawbacks to having these used to clean there house, where as in the UK you get the silly issues from some custies. The Americans  are always coming up with fresh marketing approach. Hence, the success of Joe Polish and even our Fast-Track here, where is it copied from?

In Britain we copy ideas but not necessary marketing concepts/methods for the idea. When the yanks tries to impose there style it rarely ever works. Why I am not sure because it is proven successful most of the time in the US.

I speak to window cleaners who wont use WFP yet still the US has shown how effective it is. Countries do things different but I think the UK the most reluctant to change or try new approaches to things.  The RotaBrush did catch on here though but Magic glide didn't.

Maybe I'm wrong

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys

Amongst the negativity there is obviously a strong interest in this.

I am among those driving forward a modern, dynamic organisation, but do not want to say too much at present as there is a lot of work to be done and I am a great believer in positive action.

Cheers

Doug

[Simon Gerrard]

Steve,

I'm really quite offended by this:
Is it because you want it to fail, so you can say "I told you so" ?

You are misinterpreting my reason for raising this issue and the comments I have made  regarding it. Like I said, Glynn and I looked at this long and hard and even looked into how to go about starting national radio / TV advertising campaign but the costs of that are mind blowing.
In my view all that people actually want from an Association is some addition credibility and hopefully some additional work, that's it in a nutshell.
I don't think we need another association, nor do I think people actually want another association, but if Doug and Co can come up with something new that isn't just a money making scheme then I will be the first to congratulate them.

Simon

[Mike Halliday]

Doug uses 2 words which I think are the crux of what is seen to be wrong with the NCCA .....'modern' & 'Dynamic' could anyone describe the NCCA as this?

it is seen as an organisation ran by OAPs, when was the last time you saw a dynamic OAP?

also it is seen as having a very strong 'old Boy Network' if you are not in the club you don't belong.

This is why all these comments about

if you are not happy, join the NCCA and change it from within

you will change nothing until you are seen to be worthy of being listened too, and that will take 10yrs of being a member and paying your dues with plenty of brown nosing and volunteering. no one will join the NCCA and change things in months it will take years.

 out of interest how are the president & other top dogs chosen? by a ballot of all the member? and how long was each person a member before being elected to a position of influence? I bet no one has been elected within 10 yrs of becoming a member.

So what other options are there? ......start your own association! .....then straight away you will be top dog and in a position to start making real changes for the better.

[robert meldrum]

Thinking back - I've a long way to think back - my favourite association was in the first job I ever did, golf course greenkeeping.

My memories are

Three golf outings per year at the top courses St Andrews / Turnberry / Gleneagles, etc which was free apart from the catering. Prizes were donated by Suppliers.
In the winter there were monthly educational seminars again sponsored by Suppliers, at which we were introduced to new technology or had discussions on problem solving.

Not unlike carpet cleaning and maintenance.

[Dave_Lee]

Mike,
I am only 2 years of my OAP. I can tell you for sure, I am fitter and more dynamic than most half my age. That is some generalisation. Not offended, just making the point.
Dave.

[Mike Halliday]

Dave most men don't have your dedication to looking after themselves, your are an exception to the rule

but watch those last 2 years..... if you have  the urge to get an allotment or start moaning about how young policemen look...... seek help immediately