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Barry Pearce

  • Posts: 111
TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« on: April 30, 2005, 02:20:14 pm »
We all know from our school days and early work experience that there are good and some terrible teachers, and teaching is to impart knowledge, training however is practical education or so the concise dictionary tells us.
Why do people think that because they know something about a subject or even know the job inside out, that they have that gift of communication, of getting things over in a construtive manner that spures the pupil to want to succeed.
Now bear in mind that I have been a trainer on oriental rug restoration and carpet repairing  for over 20 years and have probebly met more franchisees, loss ajusters, loss assessors, claims inspectors, and CCs for training  and most importantly the follow up. "A lifetimes hotline" that still keeps me in touch with the grass roots.
The lack of professional preparation and approach is the biggest let down, I do not do stain removal now but when I did every student had an A4 size bound  plain wool sampler and on it would be 15 seperate circular stains four tea and four coffee stains, one of each was one hour old, one day, one week, and one month old, there was also one each of Rust, Polish, Oil, Lipstick, Eye Shadow, Tar, and Latex,  the same would be repeated on a plain synthetic  bound sampler and these after being worked on would be taken home by the student. and what do I hear on the grape vine  today on that same subject, a rag bag of stained fraying carpet peices of all differant qualitys and colours, some of which had been used before and with no order and little or no presentation.
It is not a nice prospect when the keen newcomers full of enthusiasm and thirsting for knowledge are palmed with "It'll do---They'll be alright"

Neil Mc Anulty

  • Posts: 407
Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2005, 05:45:49 pm »
Is this a dig at a particular person or organisation, or your thoughts on the general standards of training courses that are available today?

Barry Pearce

  • Posts: 111
Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2005, 08:19:11 pm »
 Hi Neil
it is not so much my thoughts, but the trickle of information, the gossip, the feed back from colleges, you have to realise that because of carpet fringe sales and enquiries about restoration I am in regular contact with the trade and because I have always stood above the cut and thrust of carpet cleaning they have some how felt that I can be confieded in, and my comments are a generalisation in  the downward trend of standards, and in particular training and trainers.
If anybody has been on a course that has had spot and stain removal and read my presentation, how did your course compere?
Barry

Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2005, 01:49:35 am »
bad trainers good trainers , what is a trainer someone who should know how to do a task in many ways. most trainers only show you the one, beneficial to there company that is not training. that is taking your har5d earned cash and ramming down your throats thers sponsers products true ?
listen,learn.and benefit. try. reward.and love, peace harmony.feng shui. and all that. it improves ones selling .to ones customers.reap THE HARVEST WHILST YOU CAN. and try to crush the opposition.

Derek

Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2005, 08:56:03 am »
Several points here...I suppose that Barry is repeating the old adage...If you can't clean ..teach!' (with apologies to those who use this phrase in its more frequently used context... "If you can't work ...become a teacher")  ;)

Barry I am surprised at 'you', of all people, listening to gossip  ;) people will always whinge whatever...if they didn't the majority of conversation as we know it would cease overnight....think about it!...No, just listen to any conversation in the street and you will see what I mean.

The old samples used by some trainers that Barry refers to will probably reflect the true problems faced by cleaners on site (We all know only too well the raids on cupboards under the kitchen sink by the client BEFORE we are asked in to perform "the miracle"!)...
I have seen too many chemicals and manufacturers technicians over the years who test their products in 'ideal' laboratory conditions...Mrs Joe Public doesn't live in a laboratory!...if only.

Sherlock ...you are correct there are some courses run by retailers who do heavily subsidise the courses to cleaners therefore wish to recoup their investment..we cannot criticise them for trying to promote sales of their products...makes good business sense and as an astute business person yourself I am sure you will understand my point.
The NCCA and IICRC do 'NOT' sell chemicals or equipment therefore they run generic training courses... the rule is if they name a product they must also include several others made by different companies....so there are alternatives

Cheers
Derek

Barry Pearce

  • Posts: 111
Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2005, 01:36:47 pm »
Derek.
I was trying to be diplomatic over the disquiet of many many CCs who talk in confidence to me, "There is trouble at tut mill" and at a course an indevidual may find it very intimidating, hence they find a sympathetic ear and out trot the complaints,   "Things were not as they expected"
Perhaps the wording of the actual promotion needs to be defined.
A tutor (theory,Ideology) teaches deligates at a seminar.
A trainer (Instructor, practical education) student (acquisition of learning or of skill) in a workshop environment.
If a training course its not hands on, then it has to be a called seminar and many new CCs are being  sadly misled.
My samplers for the students  hands on spot & stain removal course had all normal domestic stains and for all I know the samplers are hanging on a nail  in numerus workrooms and offices and pointed to with pride "I did that".
Barry

Derek

Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2005, 05:34:38 pm »
Barry

You could call in and discuss this point with me next week if you have the time.. Do you realise its four years since we had our last bedside chat (I was in Hospital before you all start thinking)

I take your point and I do agree that there is training and training...the ideal solution is extremely difficult to arrange and costs could and do impose severe restrictions.

In an ideal world we could do practical training with all the whistles and bells plus aerials, wing mirrors etc.

What's the betting there would still be whingers who would find fault.
I deleted my next comment..it was perhaps a little impolite

Derek

Barry Pearce

  • Posts: 111
Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2005, 07:17:47 am »
Derek
I will look forward to nipping down to the Nuffi.
Perhaps the National Cleaning Council who have Govenment funding could be approached to look into the potential of a Univercity Chair being created, so that a curriculum  on minimum standards on training, instruction and opperating proceedures within the cleaning industry, which distite its  multi billion pound turnover does not have a very good public image, and it starts  with the lack of true professionalisum at the top, "if you are trained badly, you will perform badly" and it dosn't matter whether its football or carpet cleaning.
Barry

Ian Gourlay

  • Posts: 5748
Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2005, 09:11:33 am »
Barry,

I read your post with interest

I think you have a valid point which unfortuanley defeats an aqument I have been having regarding NCCA  and IIRC being the only training bodies that will let you into NCCA.

The  three day course that I did which did  include spot and stain removal dod not have any examples to work in just a long list of what product to use on what stain, and yes they were Own Brand products.

Personally I think you can learn as much about cleaning from manuals and text books as you do on courses.

Which is why I think this National Cleaning Council should sponsor an open Learning programe.

What does this National Cleaning Council do with its Government Funding


I have nothing against the Government helping the cleaning industry as long as help is actually reaching those on the ground and not swelling Catering companies coffers


Barry Pearce

  • Posts: 111
Re: TRAINERS & TRAINING 6/10
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2005, 09:46:08 am »
Ian.
I still think that the NCCA have seat on the national council, I sat on it myself years ago and I felt lost in the jargon of the thinkers but the heart of it is in the right place. As for the detail of what their remit is today could be best explained by the NCCA directors, your comments about  training is a continuing sore to many, they say "one picture is worth a thousand words" and it could be true to also say "that one practice is worth a thousand pictures".
I'm just a simple craftsman who lives for the moment when the student say's "OK, now you have shown me, let me have a go".
Barry