[Totus]

I been thinking about dumping the ladders and going WFP but worried about losing customers especially in current climate. Have given serious thought about changing - have the dough, 600 odd customers but wondered if you WFPers could clarify some of the issues i've thought about:

1) I do about £200 per day 8.30-5.30 doing it traditionally, what could I do ££££ wise with a WFP you guys?

2) How do you clean the windows that people leave open at the top during the day, especially as (hopefully!!!) the good weather will be upon us soon or do you just skip them?

3) Although most of my custys have UPVC window frames i still have about 25-30%  that have powder coated metal frames, metal frames, wooden frames, and crittle windows. Are windows like this still able to be cleaned or will I have to seriously consider binning them due to milky/dirty marks that might be left?

I've worked bloody hard building this up so it's a big step. I've spec'ed everything ("fail to plan - plan to fail") so above and beyond my main points above if there is anything i'm over looking being a traditional window cleaner i'd or you think i should be taking into consideration i'd appreciate additional feedback.

Cheers.

Neil

[kris martin]

dont dump them because you will always need them for the odd window..

definately go wfp for safety reasons alone

WFP does 95 % of the time do a grand job if you have your technique right, if not you can leave spotting but i honestly dont think that this spotting is as bad as some make out..

you can generally clean open windows their is just the odd one (maybe one a day) that you cant do..
i have loads of hard to clean WFP windows but still do them all with WFP ( the odd house i get the ladder off for) the more you clean them the better they get to clean..

change i did a year ago and would not look back, you will loose some custys but i have also picked up a lot of custies due to the fact i use the pole and dont place ladders all over their proerty..

kris

[NWH]

Everything you`ve ask has been said many many times,go to the search engine on the forum and tap in a topic you want to know about ie earnings how quick is WFP etc.

[JCS*]

I been thinking about dumping the ladders and going WFP but worried about losing customers especially in current climate. Have given serious thought about changing - have the dough, 600 odd customers but wondered if you WFPers could clarify some of the issues i've thought about:

1) I do about £200 per day 8.30-5.30 doing it traditionally, what could I do ££££ wise with a WFP you guys?

2) How do you clean the windows that people leave open at the top during the day, especially as (hopefully!!!) the good weather will be upon us soon or do you just skip them?

3) Although most of my custys have UPVC window frames i still have about 25-30%  that have powder coated metal frames, metal frames, wooden frames, and crittle windows. Are windows like this still able to be cleaned or will I have to seriously consider binning them due to milky/dirty marks that might be left?

I've worked bloody hard building this up so it's a big step. I've spec'ed everything ("fail to plan - plan to fail") so above and beyond my main points above if there is anything i'm over looking being a traditional window cleaner i'd or you think i should be taking into consideration i'd appreciate additional feedback.

Cheers.

Neil

Open windows not really a problem; just don't squirt water into openings.

)))) You may find that the mosr reliable way of making sure the windows are going to dry 100% is to leave the top frame edge of the window, as this will most likely drip down onto the glass.

))))On powdery metal framed windows, leave the frames well alone and just do glass, or do all frames, rinse the frames (with brush off) then go back to first window and carefully just do glass.

))))Wooden painted frames not really an issue I've found, but again, I don't tend to do the top edge of the frame.  If you want to do them every now and again, just do the frames, rinse them well, then go back and do glass.

I've found on average, after 2-3 cleans WFP is twice as fast as trad, esp if you georgian style windows.
The other benefit is that you can reach higher/awkward windows with the correct pole.

[NWH]

I havn`t lost any customers due to switching,educate them and take 5 minutes to explain the way it works.I would only do this when the odd few wondered how it worked other than that i just turned up and cleaned them from the start,if you start handing out letters saying you will be cleaning them this way for 1 they will be inspecting every window from then on or they will dump you without giving you a chance.Be brave after you`ve practised on your own and friends windows and have faith in it even on the odd bad day in 6months to a year you`ll laugh to yourself how much easier it is and kick yourself at the same time because you didn`t do it sooner.

[tomy jackson]

it wos the only resun i whent WFP wos my safety and the wear and tear runing up laders will i lose sum  i recond on 25% but i picked up moor , now you have a valid pont in this climet so its up to you as to wether you chane over , i woodent go back to laders for any thing befor going back to ladders id give it up and do sumet els

[D B Services]

You are obviously quick at trad to do £200 a day regularly. Here are my answers based on 8 years of using WFP.

1)  250 to 300 after 4 to 6 months

2)  There's a knack to this. A lot of the time they can be left open but it will take a while to get proficient enough. You can also try closing them with the brush.

3) The only ones you will have real problems with are the powder coated frames that have gone powdery. Wooden frames are OK as long as they are watertight.


Dan

[NWH]

You are obviously quick at trad to do £200 a day regularly. Here are my answers based on 8 years of using WFP.

1)  250 to 300 after 4 to 6 months

2)  There's a knack to this. A lot of the time they can be left open but it will take a while to get proficient enough. You can also try closing them with the brush.

3) The only ones you will have real problems with are the powder coated frames that have gone powdery. Wooden frames are OK as long as they are watertight.


Dan

A man talking honestly and from experience by the sounds of it.

[Dave Turley]

when I went wfp I earned les money for about 2 months. (too fussy, not in a routine, hoses catching on everything!)

I nearly went back to ladders 3 times.

3 months in I was getting the hang of it.

6 months in I was getting good and enjoying it. you start to work with your hose and get to know the best way to do your houses.

now  3 and a half years wfp, and LOVING IT!

my advice would be to tailor your round over time so that it suits your new way of cleaning. you'll soon figure out which houses are good for wfp

[C.C.S.]

the problem i find about switching from trad to wfp which i did last month is the quality on the first clean with wfp.no matter how much water and time i spend on the first clean there will still be smears on the windows on the first clean and the customers are used with spotless windows every time.they end saying that the method is not good even if i explain them that the first clean is not brilliant because of the frames being cleaned properly for the first time.i had to return to a few but didn't lost any yet.i just wish to get faster to the 3rd clean.

[Totus]

Another couple of points i've just thought of guys.

For those of you who went from traditional to WFP did you increase your prices on the USP that you get the frames cleaned too. Or did you just expect at some point that your day rate would increase through the speed of the WFP system?

Plus some guys i've seen have been using the Shurflo back pack system any thoughts - looks to eradicate dragging that hose about!!! Pros V Cons???

[JCS*]

Another couple of points i've just thought of guys.

For those of you who went from traditional to WFP did you increase your prices on the USP that you get the frames cleaned too. Or did you just expect at some point that your day rate would increase through the speed of the WFP system?

Plus some guys i've seen have been using the Shurflo back pack system any thoughts - looks to eradicate dragging that hose about!!! Pros V Cons???

I started  off advertising that now frames would be done, but now don't as it don't want or need to over sell myself; the WFP system IS quicker, and hourly rate should increase as a result, without increasing prices.

My USP is that I can reach higher more awkward windows - SAFELY!

B-pack can be a useful tool in your armoury, but has pro's and cons.

[Window Washers]

Neil, welcome to ciu m8 

You still thinking then fella, I know for a fact alot of your work would save you a load of time done this way...

[Totus]

Some really good advice. Thank you to everyone who's provided feedback. It's nice to get a range of views and opinions. If anyone reads this and thinks they could add more please do i'm sure this thread will provide useful to other traditional windows looking to switch to WFP.

Hi Ian - Yes mate still deliberating!!!
Just taken on my brother and picking up a good amount of new work so want to try and free up more time to get in more work. I'll give you a buzz next week for a chat. Hope things are all well in the world of window washers.

Cheers

Neil.

[AuRavelling79]

I changed four years ago and I did it in sections on my round.

March 2005 - First all commercial - easy to convince.

May 2005 - One village representing about a quarter of my round - got that right then:-

July 2005 - All the rest except two estates of terraced blocks of five 1970's houses/bungalows

April 2006 - Changed the above estates over.

Every domestic customer got a letter explaining the change over and that it was going to happen - the HSE WAHD and Daily Mail article and the BBC stuff was referenced -  most on here would say a letter was not what they did or would do - but it worked for me.

In all I lost one genuine Georgian house with leaky old windows and two elderly council tenants who didn't "want all that water" running down their walls.

I did have a handful of "I don't like the new system" types but they settled in and are ok now. Especially as I can reach far more rooflights or hard to reach windows.

£200 a day trad 8.30/5.30pm is good - I'm happy with that on wfp as a base daily figure on a domestic dry day say 9 - 5.  But if I want to work briskly I add £50 to that. But it's a rare week where I do that 5 days in a row (weather, can't be bothered, knackered, disorganised, lazy or whatever ...) and it never equates to anything like 4K turnover in a month!)

[Niall McAllister]

I wouldnt put the prices up on existing customers, but if they ask make a point that it is more expensive to you but you don't feel the customers should foot the cost of you changing methods, also point out over time it will be quicker and that is how you make up the difference. if peole think you are doing them a favour they like you.

[Window Washers]

I wouldnt put the prices up on existing customers, but if they ask make a point that it is more expensive to you but you don't feel the customers should foot the cost of you changing methods, also point out over time it will be quicker and that is how you make up the difference. if peole think you are doing them a favour they like you.

I would ask them if they want all there frames cleaned at the same time for £1 or £2 a time, I did this on most customers, I used to charge highly for frame cleaning when trad

[lee_dewing]

what niall says make sense

the way i looked at it is i knew there would be doubts from custy's and spotting on some of my
jobs.
wfp is a big learning curve,
all the advice and theory is very helpful

but you can't learn experience.

the first two months wfp were the most stressfull.

i think my faults were expecting to be quick immediately

i was earning 30% less a day and being moaned at about all the water.

for me i was being to methodiacal standing at a window too long, which created large puddles.

If you can phase in wfp in sections then do

while your on ladders now take the time to clean horizontal top sections of frames anywhere which when wetted will run down onto glass and dry leaving spots.

you will get alot of people bluffing you saying there not happy and prefer you back on ladders.
stick to your guns!

I did a letter saying in a fancy way ladders were no longer viable for w/c and wfp was now the safer alternative but the advantages were the frames were cleaned free of charge.

so basically i have to work like this to stay within the law,
it will seem weird having a wet finish on your glass but will have clean glaa frames and sills at no extra cost.

I would never go back to ladders as my round at the time was spaced out but now with wfp i'm earning more, so i can re-invest in my business quicker more time to get extra work.

I now offer a better all round service and can also clean con roofs.

you will find it difficult as your obviously very quick trad.

Sqeaky: on here roger; would be a good one to talk to.

you will be taking a giant step back, but you can do quite a bit too lessen the blow and maybe
saving a small nest egg to compensate for a decraese in wages 30% a day for say two month's will help.

I hope i haven't put you off i love my job now; where with ladders i was getting to a stage of throwing in the towel in
or employing someone which to me was not an option i wanted.

Try and go out and see one of us in action and look at someones setup

If you not a million miles from me your more than welcome.

Sorry buddy i forgot to look at your details and i can't remember your name

appologies for my ignorance
all the best lee

[tomy jackson]

hear an other one , tery has bin in hospital for two weeks annother fallen winddow cleaner how many dus it take befor trad giys say stuf the ladders