[Window Washers]

we all need a fresh approach, it's easy to get closeted inside your own ideas, and actually ewan, alex, matt and luke are all good examples of this in their own way.(And you never thought you had anything in common with ewan , matt!)

But alex is the main one, and i look forward to his new outlook on window cleaning once he starts using his new van and new kit.When he starts actually using the stuff in a pro way he will arrive at solutions faster.

A good pole is important, but so is van layout and an electric reel. The more of our job that is automated or made simpler the better.

Evening Clive 

[Captain Scarlet]

It is 24' 4" extended

Its 26.312ft extended ( states 8.02m in catalogue ) and advertised as a 28ft reach. I didnt actually measure it, but pretty sure its nearly the same closed the 25ft sl-x

Someone on another forum has quoted the catalogue as 24' 4" extended. I will have to get one measured and see for myself!

i have the catalogue right here as we speak, says  8.02m!!!!

[drwindows]

catalogue says 8.02m

Thats 26 feet 3 inches.

It says a "reach" of 28ft, i reckon you could probably reach about 4 or 5 feet above the actual length, so if i was them I would have said it "reached" 30 feet at least.

[Clive McDonald]

I think my point was that designed by a committee is often used as a critisism, but team work lets you achieve excellent results very fast.

As an example if a pole was proposed a lot of what was said would be rubbish, but it might be possible to take away and use one idea, or it might spark another related idea. And we all have different strenghts, matt is very practical for example and can do most things, you just have to keep him away from the fact that the end result will cost £600.

[leapstallbuildings]

I didn't make it to the show this year so can't comment on the other poles but I do like the SL-X.  I found the clamps a bit fiddly at first but soon got used to them - in spite of needing to do regular adjustments on clamps 1 and 2.  Unfortunately, I'm now finding that due to the adjustments on clamp 1, the screw is poking out so far that it's fouling the clamp lever.  I suppose I could dismantle the clamp and grind a bit off the screw - or for that matter - maybe try cutting a bit more out of the slot in the lever.  I've currently reverted to using my 18 ft Ionics glass multipole and just using the SL-X for when I need a longer reach or to clean at more horizontal angles.
I'm wondering if this is a design flaw in the clamps or if I've not done something properly.  I do clean the pole regularly though I prefer not to dismantle it.  Just wondering if there are any tips on this.
I must stress that I do like this pole and note that the newer version has different clamps.
Not sure I should put this on the forum due to the the owner's rules.  There does seem to be a grey area where it's unclear what may be posted.

[Alex Gardiner]

I didn't make it to the show this year so can't comment on the other poles but I do like the SL-X.  I found the clamps a bit fiddly at first but soon got used to them - in spite of needing to do regular adjustments on clamps 1 and 2.  Unfortunately, I'm now finding that due to the adjustments on clamp 1, the screw is poking out so far that it's fouling the clamp lever.  I suppose I could dismantle the clamp and grind a bit off the screw - or for that matter - maybe try cutting a bit more out of the slot in the lever.  I've currently reverted to using my 18 ft Ionics glass multipole and just using the SL-X for when I need a longer reach or to clean at more horizontal angles.
I'm wondering if this is a design flaw in the clamps or if I've not done something properly.  I do clean the pole regularly though I prefer not to dismantle it.  Just wondering if there are any tips on this.
I must stress that I do like this pole and note that the newer version has different clamps.
Not sure I should put this on the forum due to the the owner's rules.  There does seem to be a grey area where it's unclear what may be posted.

Sounds like your pole needs to be returned to us for a free service. We can sort these clamp issues out for you and replace the bolts etc. Give the Office a ring on Monday afternoon (shut in the morning for Stock-Take) and say that Alex has approved a service. (Moderators - I would have emailed a reply, but there was no email tab)

[[GQC] Tim]

Alex, I can remember you saying a long time ago, that with the new bigger warehouse, you might be able to do a comparison between poles, setting them up like that window cleaner magazine did some time ago.

I know you are very busy, but is that something that you are still thinking of doing?

I never understood why the Ionics pole info was removed from your website, surely they would never have any legal ground to ask that? Products are being reviewed by companies, and comparisons made all the time.

If not, why don't you get some webspace, and ask somebody else to take the pictures and to put the pictures up without any affiliation to Gardiner pole systems? Would take care of that matter.

I mean, it's only decent that you don't want to step on anyone's toes, but some companies are a bit too paranoid if you ask me.

[Alex Gardiner]

This is still something I would like to do. However time and money have been better spent elsewhere since we have moved in.

I think that the easiest thing to do do now would be to take a video of all the poles lined up and give them a bit of bounce and see how they all respond. Then some still shots of the poles fully extended at an angle. Charts and figures can get confusing.

The poles I would like to currently test are as follows:

Brodex Hydra (Carbon)
Ionics E2 +E3, Glyder
Facelift Carbon, Fusion and F1
IPC Eagle Modular
Unger Ergotec
Super-Lite and SL-X
Xtel Carbon
Aquafactors Aspire and Ascent (Tucker)
Durapole

The sizes I would like to test each pole at are 25ft, 45ft and 60ft.

Looking at the list above it would probably set me back by about £15,000 so realistically it is not going to happen. The trouble is even if I did buy them all, no one (apart from myself) would believe the results.

The only solution would be for an independent body (really independent) to set up a fund that all window cleaners could contribute to, that could then be used to buy the above poles, test them and publish the results.

Our firm would happily loan our products to such a body at no cost, maybe other manufacturers would do the same. This way there would be no need for any contributions.

The real problem would be finding an independent body that all manufacturers would be happy with. Perhaps I could approach Which? and ask them.

[matt]

And we all have different strenghts, matt is very practical for example and can do most things, you just have to keep him away from the fact that the end result will cost £600.

600 quid  you know how many ice creams that'll buy 

[matt]

This is still something I would like to do. However time and money have been better spent elsewhere since we have moved in.

I think that the easiest thing to do do now would be to take a video of all the poles lined up and give them a bit of bounce and see how they all respond. Then some still shots of the poles fully extended at an angle. Charts and figures can get confusing.

The poles I would like to currently test are as follows:

Brodex Hydra (Carbon)
Ionics E2 +E3, Glyder
Facelift Carbon, Fusion and F1
IPC Eagle Modular
Unger Ergotec
Super-Lite and SL-X
Xtel Carbon
Aquafactors Aspire and Ascent (Tucker)
Durapole

The sizes I would like to test each pole at are 25ft, 45ft and 60ft.

Looking at the list above it would probably set me back by about £15,000 so realistically it is not going to happen. The trouble is even if I did buy them all, no one (apart from myself) would believe the results.

The only solution would be for an independent body (really independent) to set up a fund that all window cleaners could contribute to, that could then be used to buy the above poles, test them and publish the results.

Our firm would happily loan our products to such a body at no cost, maybe other manufacturers would do the same. This way there would be no need for any contributions.

The real problem would be finding an independent body that all manufacturers would be happy with. Perhaps I could approach Which? and ask them.

the bit i put in bold

couldnt the professional window cleaning mag do it 

[Jeff Brimble]

Phil Hanson is one of us, if somewhat hamstrung.

[Alex Gardiner]

You have just cracked me right up matt......I love it  

[Tristan R Clean]

Whats the best 45 ft telescopic at the moment Alex?

Tristan

[[GQC] Tim]

Phil Hanson is one of us, if somewhat hamstrung.

More like one of Ionics.   

[Alex Gardiner]

Whats the best 45 ft telescopic at the moment Alex?

Tristan

Wow what a question!

What do you mean by best? Lightest? Shortest? Cheapest? Longest lasting?  For each priority there will probably be a different answer.  However, the X-Tel 45ft does very well on all counts but maybe not the best in every area.

[Tristan R Clean]

That is why we need the 43ft slx on the market!

Tristan

[Alex Gardiner]

That is why we need the 43ft slx on the market!

Tristan

Do you mind if it ends up being 47ft?

[S Fox]

The SLX has definatley hit a nerve, there is a large demand for 2*ft Carbon in the last few months which didn't exsist before - it was never an option before because it was thought no one would pay the cost, amazing how things change. 

[ftp]

That's changed because of the price. The only option was to buy a Facelift before which was priced out of reach of a lot of sole traders like myself. Although it was and is a very good pole few of us would justify the price tag.

[Clive McDonald]

I think they are talking about a suppliers point of view."demand for 20'-28' carbon that wasn't there before'.

To me the breakthrough came when xtel, some say at alex's suggestion, used shorter closed lenghts but more sections. This massive improvement in useability was groundbreaking, even if a little obvious in hindsight. The scaffold pole mentality was over, and this freed people up to say if fibreglass can do this what would carbon be like?

Of course gardiners answered that question by dipping a toe in the water with a modular 40' and higher sl2, and then when this didn't send them bankrupt, they had some of the know how necessary to take a crack at a telescopic (slx), which now seems the industry standard on price and performance that the others have to beat.

From a supplier point of view the domestic wfp has exploded, only time will tell if people stick with £500 day to day poles,or if cheaper fibreglass poles with a shorter life become the norm. As regards a comparitive review this is normally undertaken by an independant trade magazine. There is no such thing as an impartial review, and i wouldn't have thought which would bother as the market is so small , and this also a dangerous strategy because they would likely highlight the best benefit to householders.(i mean home systems).