[Jim_77]

I've got a school complaining that there's a vomit smell in a couple of offices after I cleaned them a couple of weeks ago.  It's glue-down needlepunch, average school carpet.

They said it never smelled of that before and I couldn't smell it before or during the clean, it's appeared afterwards.  I can only presume it may have been puked on a long time ago and wetting the carpets has reactivated it in some way.

I've already re-treated one and they said it was a lot better, but that was a bout a week ago and today he rings me up and tells me the room next door is like it now, but he didn't mention it last week.

I've got on really well with the site supervisor, he's been really easy going and honest so I'd be surprised if he's trying to pull a fast one.

Has anyone ever had this before?

[markpowell]

Jim,
This sometimes happens, you may have re-activated a bacteria grow with the moisture used during the clean. It happens quite often with urine as well as vomit. I would  lift the carpet in the areas affected and give a heavy spray with a sanitizer then get dry with airmover before re-laying. Or do it on a Sat morning and leave the windows open a little for 24 hours after the treatment.
Mark

[Jim_77]

Can't lift it, it's glued down

Just got back from there, been to re-inspect it.  The Headmaster's obviously not too chuffed but they're not growling at me just yet.

Treatment isn't a problem, I'm going back tomorrow afternoon to do what I think will fix it.  I've already advised that another re-treatment may be necessary next week if it isn't completely sorted in one visit.

What I'd be interested to know is whether I've got my facts straight, as nothing smells quite like vomit so I can't see what else it could be.  The other 900m² I've cleaned hasn't had the same problem so it's got to be pre-existing.

It'd be good to hear if anyone else has had the same problem and how it turned out.  I get the feeling that they are considering me to be responsible but my opinion is that I'm not liable for the cause of the problem - it just happened as a symptom of the work I did.  Hypothetically speaking, I think if I went to my insurance company they'd not entertain a claim.

Tricky subject but I've worked hard to gain this client so I'm going back to fix this at no extra cost as I've already recommended the carpets be cleaned annually, I don't want to lose a guaranteed 4-figure sum every August if I can help it!

[Ben Ledwick]

I have started using the dry fusion system on my site.  The chemicals have a natural vanilla and orange extracts in to deorises.  Only had good comments so far.  Also cleans the carpet really well

Ben

[markpowell]

"MUCK SPREADER" 
i had a lady phone me who asked"Do you use water to clean, cos i dont want anyone who uses one of them muck spreader things"

[Doctor Carpet (Ret'd)]

Jim

A couple of thoughts. If they are offices then it's likely that only adults would use the rooms as opposed to the kids; and it's the kids who are more likely to have vomited/peed or something else which may be the cause of a bacteria problem.

Secondly, odours are, of course, difficult to deal with as you can't see them and as soon as you start to treat them then you can't then smell the offending problem and have to wait until everything has dried and gone back to normal.

Thirdly, whilst this may of course be repulsive to you it may be worth while getting down and sniffing the carpet yourself (yep, I've had to do it to locate the perimeter of a vomit odour problem many times). In so doing you may locate the precise problem area or conclude that it is a general overall problem.

My only other observation learnt from bitter experience is that sometimes water can react with the backing of the carpet either the latex or glue which can cause a insolvable problem. Once I had to buy a new rug and another time I was cleaning a school carpet (similar to what you describe) after a flood and they specifically were worried about the smell. No guarantees were given and the carpet was lovely and clean afterwards but the smell was back the next day despite giving it an antimicrobial treatment. The school ended up replacing the carpet....and yes, I did get paid.

Don't know if any of this helps you or not.

Roger

[carlton care]

There are many,  Mark, who would not only disagree with the unfortunate choice of name ( it's been used on here before ! )

Had she been around when I used a similar system, or when a friend of mine won a hospital contract, on results, not price, when using the same system, or when users of another VLM system were working, she would have been very surprised at the capability of such systems.

Entirely dependent on the operator, of course !

Jim

I'd phone JK, at Restoremate

[colin thomas]

exactly the same thing with a school i do jim, same carpet as well. the first year they were having building work done near by and they swore that the builders must have damaged a sewer pipe it smelt so bad. i treated it but it still ponged, told them to open the doors and windows and in the end that did it. same carpet in other areas, no smell, weird. after that first year they now just accept that after the clean, they will have to have plenty of fresh air in the rooms to clear the smell, like yours, it doesn't smell when we clean it, just seems to be a couple of days later

       colin

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys

Jim.

I too would suspect a degradation smell from either carpet or adhesive.

As you know smells are difficult to remove, I would bonnet wiith Texatherm heated pads but not use Tex chemicals. Instead I would soak tha pad in Cleansan or something similar and leave to dry.

Cheers

Doug

[DK]

Hi Jim

I work for bupa and recently had a colostomy bag fall in a room, the smell would make you sick, we used dry fusion product Bactoshield, this worked and the smell was gone, I was very suprised by this.

Regards

David

[Jim_77]

Thanks very much for the replies chaps.

Been on my hands and knees already Roger, I've smelled worse things in my time

Did manage to pin-point a certain spot right under the chair in the bursar's office, but didn't really get a definite location in the other room where it was really bad.

Interesting you had the same experience Colin, I was wondering about the ventilation issue.  Two of these rooms have no windows, but the one I went in today where it's really bad had a big window that I kept open for a good couple of hours after cleaning, I also dried each of the carpets off with a fan immediately after cleaning.

I too wondered about backing/adhesive reaction but it hasn't happened anywhere else, I've cleaned another couple of acres of the same stuff in the building and it's fine.  Only difference could be the adhesive the fitters used may not be the same in these rooms.

I'm going back in tomorrow afternoon, using the resources I have available.  If that doesn't fix it then I'll have to re-evaluate the situation with them and come to some sort of an arrangement on what would be the best thing to do next.

P.S. David, rather you than me   I do actually have a customer whose colostomy bursts sometimes when he gets in/out of bed, I'm there every couple of months.  Not the most pleasant side of our work but you have to take the rough with the smooth!

[John Milnes]

Hi Jim,

Seems like a complicated problem.

When all else has failed, I use bicarb of soda diluted in a sprayer. I know it sounds simple but has worked in some very bad situations for me. Vomit, dog urine on rugs etc. Definatly worth a try when you go back if you can pinpoint an area.

John

[cleaningmaster]

Jim
you could use a ozone generator, for a couple of days over the weekend.
I dont have to tell you the dangerous side of these but as a last resort..

Daryl

[Jim_77]

Thanks guys

[Doug Holloway]

Jim

It occurred to me that you advocate MP which is supposed to destroy smells caused by bactericidal action, did you use it in this case ?

Cheers

Doug

[Joe H]

M-Power does have the ability to get rid of some smells and leave the carpet "smelling fresh" (customers words).
However it is not the be all and end all - as we all know there is no single product that will do everyting (shame about that).

Solutions appear have a good range of products including those that will help to kill smells. Since the parting with Gunther Glockner there has been new products released too.
From another forum I understand Jim "is on the case" and no doubt will report back for our benefit.

Its aways good to know whats on the market and thats where these forums really shine. It would cost a fortune if any one of us had to try the multitudes of solutions to a fix a problem we may encounter every blue moon.
So thankfully we can draw on each others experiance - pick up on what we fancy and drop what we dont.

[Jim_77]

Yes I did Doug.

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys

Joe,

Speaking of Gunter are you going to the Alltec open day where the man himself will be speaking?

As for one product doing everything it will never happen because many of the removal things we are trying to achieve are contradictory so could not occur at the same time.

Cheers

Doug

[Joe H]

One product doing everything is a dream I know Doug - would be nice though.

No not going to Alltec - too far for me and my little poney and trap (getting to sound a bit like Shaun).

Am interested in what gets released though.

[markpowell]

Are you sure that M Power doesnt remove every stain and odour known to man, people on other forums seem to think it does, or is that only when it is rinsed out with a Scorpion???