[Goldfinch PCS]

I have notice Carpet Cleaners working/advertising for work at £0.17 per square foot. Now what bothers me is the fact that they claim to Vacuum, Pre-Spray, Agitate, HWE, remove stain and deodorise.

Some of these cleaners are NCCA members and IICRC members (as advertised on their site). Well why bother gaining a professional status only to work for these prices? I strongly believe that no professional Carpet Cleaning Technician should work for less that £0.25 per sq ft, what's your view guys?

To all the cleaners who care to respond;
         Do you feel been a member of NCCA or IICRC have any real benefits?

And finally lets be honest about our pricing structure, because, contrary to believe competition isn't our enemy. If we make competition our enemy we stand a chance of loosing out, simply because customers vary and target marketing is better than price competition.  I learnt it years ago when I use to be a sales person for Currys, we made more money when we were next to Comet on the same complex, when Comet move to another complex we were the only electrical goods retailer left on our site and sales fell by almost 50%, I quit cause my commission wasn't worth it.

I set a price starting at £0.38 per sq ft and increases it if the customer requires additional services such as green cleaning, spot/stain removal, protection and/or allergy care. I do my survey as normal and cleaned following standard procedures, I feel a lot better doing things this way than to turn up charge according to the house location or appearance or any of the other methods used in our industry.

Let's not drive our industry in the ground, place a value on yourself and on your work and sell it to the customer, if we all do that then pricing becomes less relevant and customer care becomes priority. The industry will also become less susceptible to "dodgy" or "fall short Cleaners" let the customers as them why they are so cheap and leave them to justify that. We all know what we get for cheap so please guys lets not do CHEAP.

Let have your reactions.

[jasonl]

I generally charge £40/hour, per person on site , and this equates to far  less than 17p/foot, for the following.....rake/vac/prespray/deodorize /agitate/bonnet buff/spot/stainremoval/rake.

It is carpet cleaning, not hard to do , and I train people in under a month so I am confident to send them out to tackle any job.

However ,a one man and his van operator NEEDS to charge more than this to make a living. Because he is simply exchanging time for money.

A business running 2 or more cc vehicles can often afford to lower the hourly rate and still turn a healthy profit for the owner.

I do other services such as fire and flood work, and my rates can go as low as £15/hour per man, however there may be 20 people on site , so I figure if I net £5/hour for each of them over a 10 hour day then life is ok.

Going back to carpet cleaning, I do not get hung up about a rate per ft, The carpet cleaning business is  about hourly rates and net profit, gaining and retaining customers. Not about an obsession with sq ft pricing, that is simply an american concept a few people over here have latched on to.

[Ken Wainwright]

Hi "Dove"

A realistic approach to the value/charge issue.

First, NCCA/IICRC.

I'm a strong believer in the NCCA, and to a lesser degree IICRC, but rarely will the consumer search you out because you are a member, or even be aware of it's existence,  BUT it is another tool which you can use successfuly in your presentation (using a leaflet perhaps) to help you SELL your services. The consumer then has another reason to BUY from you and with confidence in your professionalism.

As for pricing, I'm in a priviledged position of being able to focus on my own pricing structure, not that of others. I only offer one standard of work ie the full monty of whichever system I choose to use (the customer doesn't have a choice).  For stand alone systems, I cost at from £1.60sqM commercial. For rinse/extract I'm looking at from £4sqM for residential. Combination systems for excessive soiling/problems are costed accordingly, so too for out of area jobs.  A site visit to quote carries a 20p premium.

Upholstery from £160 for a 5 seater.  Todays was £185.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

[Mike Halliday]

how much we charge per sq/ft is meaningless its what we walk out of the house with in a set time, you could call it our hourly rate.

too start we need to realise why we are in the house in the first place, to give a perceived level of cleanliness often this is a visual perception 'the carpet looks clean'  we could do what Ken does and do 'the full monty' or we could wizz across it with a bonnet,  both could give the same perceived result, the carpet looks clean but ken takes an hour the bonnet takes 30mins. both earn £100

this an extreme example but to use Ken as an example again he charges £4/yd I charge £3/yd ken give the full monty, I only do a 3/4 quarter monty (pre-spray/rinse) both give the same level of clean, but with me I earn more (because I'm quicker) and the customer wins because they pay less....... everyones a winner!!

so we can follow IICRC guidelines and do the full monty but if we don't need too are we doing a misservice to the customer.

[mark shannon]

Usually price it at £80 inclusive p/h. I often find measuring is unfair as all jobs are different.

[Goldfinch PCS]

I think for commercial cleaning (offices/open space) Jason your price is ok, I feel you could even get away with more depending on your location. The thing is you have employees working at an hourly rate as oppose to most carpet cleaners on the domestic front which consist of one man and a van or one man and one worker. But you have just given me some food for thought, maybe I should employ someone to do the cleaning and I do the marketing and selling - cheers Jason.

[John Milnes]

Pricing is a personal issue.

If your starting as a newby and charging cheap rates to get the work....you'r digging a hole in the ground because the custy database that you'r building will be the lower end of the market.

Once your established and your charging 25 to 50p per sq ft etc, you may loose many of you'r past customers based on price.

Many custy are not so price conscious and just want a good job doing at a fair price.

If you'v invested a lot of money, and most of us have, we need to get paid a fair price.

If someone is charging .17 a sq ft, they may as well be working for someone else and not have the hastle of being self employed.

John
.

[Goldfinch PCS]

Mike I really would like to hear Ken's view on your approach, is 3/4 monty the same result as full monty?

What about the cleaning science? Surely you are leaving a bit more behind than Ken, so Ken's customer pay for the full monty which is more than the 3/4 monty which is fare enough, but surely Ken's customer also get a better service and a cleaner carpet. Also Ken needs to do less jobs than you in order to make a decent days pay, if both of you had the same itinerary everyday no matter how fast you were Ken would be better off.

I accept that perception plays a part and what the customer sees is a carpet looking clean but is it a clean carpet that you are leaving the customer with or just a perception? I don't support that approach at all the customer pays for carpet cleaning not perceptions. The perception should reflect the reality, the truly cleaned carpet.

[jasonl]

I also  do not aim at a particular demographic,  I will do  work in any house from rough social  housing to the largest country estates , and all points in between, I have a smart logoed image, clean uniformed staff, tidy equipment and procedures for every function written for staff and customers alike.

[Goldfinch PCS]

John my sentiments exactly, it doesn't make sense but I see adds like that everywhere on the net. I was just thinking there must be a secret I don't know.

Cheap don't work John, look at gas prices remember a couple months back everyone was on the telly telling us shop around and find cheaper suppliers, EDF was one of the cheapest and they were the first to become the most expensive as the cheap stance almost killed the company. Then today British Gas 37% rise after they tried to go cheap not long ago. NO CHEAP AINT WORTH IT

The rising cost of living and transportation doesn't justify cheap and cheerful. I like a professional job, done properly with pride. I guess I will just have to carry on and hope my other Technician colleagues realise that cheap perceptions isn't the way forward.

Thanks guys for your feedback

[ianharper]

Guys

This a great way to show how you can play the price shoppers game and bet the splash and dash. if you use "plan" or in other words differant specs you will give the prospect two or three differant prices that they can fit to their budget and in the same breath tech them not to compare price with other carpet cleaners as everyone provide differant types of service.

prospects think that all carpet cleaners are the same the only way to teach them other wise is by plan selling.

I with you all on the hourly rate we must know what we need to earn each hour to make a profit. this helps use set marketing budgets etc. but as has been said that our business. two side to every coin.

A good eample in a quote we did today for a prospect with cat sick. she been quoted £50 for the job. we explaned that she needed to know what she was getting for that money. as it sounded like it was just going to be a top pile clean.

we know because we asked that the sick was down to the underlay. we explaned what needed to be done and what our charge was.  if she had used the cheap guy and the odour was still there after does not look good on us aas carpet cleaners.

my point is that people need to know what they are getting for their money then they can tell if it gives them value. which is what all customers are looking for. they think they are looking for cheap, but value is what they really want.

respect

ian harper

[carlton care]

Well good luck gentlemen. Wonder if you will still be preaching the same gospel while people like Ken and Mike drive past your van sitting in your driveway.

John

Tell me one employer, apart possibly from deep sea diving, who will pay you over, or anywhere near £50 per hour. What a stupid comment.

robert m

Dove'

An equally stupid analogy.

[spindle]

i wont get in my car for less than £50
doesnt matter if its a doormat  to clean or a single room the cost is still £50

dont charge by the meter or foot........i work it how long it will take me.......average 30/50 per room

i like to earn  £50 ph and very often achieve this..........if you cant earn £50 ph cleaning carpets the you must be doing something wrong.........

p.s would like to add that i clean carpets part time....but so far this year with my PROFITS i have had holiday to australia, bought a brand new car, new top of the range lap top.......and i still have 5 months left to earn

not bad for a partimer

[markpowell]

We all have different commitments and overheads, the guys that charge £50 for a suite are probably semi retired no mortgage, van paid for, machine paid for, minimal advertising as dont need loads of work. So out of that £50.00, £45.00 ends up in the back pocket. Another guy charges £120.00 for the same job, by the time hes paid all his outgoings he is left with £45.00.
Does this mean that the first guy didnt do just as good a job?
ITS NOT WHAT YOU EARN, ITS WHAT YOU ARE LEFT WITH AT THE END OF THE WEEK THAT COUNTS!!!!!
Mark

[spindle]

i'd have too agree with you mark

i have very little or no over heads so more of the money is mine!!!

[Goldfinch PCS]

Carlton

Not a stupid analogy at all, I would never as a self employed person price myself as an employed person. Companies don't pay £50 an hour they charge that and more then they pay £6.50 an hour to an employee.  They like me and you and all other self employed have to think about their costs. take a look at markpowell simplified breakdown, then think of all the other costs involved and then tell me £50 an hour is too high, compared to some guys I know that is low.

Just think of the cost of driving that van around and think how much of your profit it's eating then think of the retirement pension you are trying to build up and then think how long before you can retire

You know how many machines are at one of my local repairer uncollected after been brought in for repairs.  I will ask him if I can mention his name on the forums because he has loads of stuff that can be used as backup or first time buy. Some good quality machines Ashbys and Prochems included. So where are these cleaners, retired? I don't think so, they didn't get their pricing plans and business plan right.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

If you are on min wage then regular cleaning all day long for £150 a day sounds good, even if it costs you £75 a day to run the other £75 a day is still better than the £45 a day you would have got.

Shaun

[Mike Halliday]

Dovie mate, the point I'm making i I can do an equal clean as ken ( although he might not agree ) without doing the 7-8 cleaning process ken will use.

so I can earn  more over the same amount of time.  I could do one job and earn £350 or 2 jobs @ £175 it might sound better doing just one job but is it fair for that one customer to pay £350 just because I can't be bothered to travel to another job

its getting a bit deep but hopefully you get the point.

[carlton care]

Mr Halliday has a knack of cutting the crap out and just stating the facts, so I have cancelled my long winded comments and will just say. I agree with Mike.

robert m

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Look at the statistics, how many domestic jobs do you do at £350?

It's easier to find 2 jobs at £175, Ken obviously has marketed himself well over the years but if he were a younger man with a bills to pay I wonder if he would do the 1/2 day or 1/2 week method he uses now? (I have this beef with Ken evry 12 months or so, but it's not personal Ken )

Selling carpet cleaning can be more of an art than doing it, there are fantastic cleaners out there that are struggling because they cannot find work and/or just can't get the price their work deserves.

Shaun