[Len Gribble]

Going to my wmc next Sunday for the agm keep telling them to pull out of the ciu and make a profit, there potential is unlimited with the right people at the helm. Can’t knock ncca not a member but dose this make me a philistine/cowboy some may think that as they have the badge, but I’ve got the t-shirt. 


Pete

Don’t bother using the bell ware st, beer watered down food crap, you are so right she did not pay her sister did, give it two weeks probably have me to clean her carpets.

Thanks Doug and Paul


Ian

Got some roof windows from the loft shop their prices for blinds are ott, do you do them? Looking for the black out type!

Len

[Paul Kettless]

Also being a relative newbie, training is paramount, but the advise and guidance on these forums has been invaluable to me.

The thing to remember is that it is just that, guidance, and not set in stone.  You must make your own decisions and proceed with caution.

I have called Jason on a number of occasions for advise, and he has always been happy to help.  (mind u, I must nearly owe him a whole keg of that nancy beer he drinks by now )

[Ian Gourlay]

Len

An honest Answer for Velux type blinds it is best to order on line.


With most roof windows you will find a code number on the side

If you have problems sourcing a product on line let me know and I will  see what I can come up with.

[Neil Grainger]

Ian

Are you a double for Peter kenton .

Cheers

Neil

[garyj]

Len, there is someone on Ebay selling blinds for Velux at £20.00, the roll down type are £45. I have a couple of phone numbers here if you want them drop me an email. I'm about to order but can't make my mind up over blinds or roll down.

Back to the thread 

Yep, more information on here than any training manual and a collective of business brains to rival any carpet cleaning organisation. It would make sense for someone with a couple of brain cells to start a new organisation as the NCCA means nothing to the customers, and any new organisation would have the same clout!! As for gettting national work, there are enough people on here to do an area and give up a day to do a quote, but that raises the issue of who does the quote would probably get the work with a percentage going to the new organisation.

A good idea, but how long before it turns into Animal Farm.

[spindle]

i have been a member of this forum for bout 3 yrs

i have learnt alot from very patient individuals . i have also been in a position to offer other cc jobs in their area due to my custys moving away

i agree that the forum is no subsistute for training, but imo the training lacks the "hands on" experience that you get from  actually doing the job.
 we all started somewhere.

my point being .you can do all the training courses that are available but when it comes down to it, if you havent done it outside a workshop does it count??

just because you have the knowledge doesnt mean you have the practical experience.

ncca may work for some but what do you actually get for your membership?( serious question)


LEN

why didnt/dont you call me..........i can get you a table in my place. free feed!!
you would pay for your drinks only!!!! ( cost more than wmc)

[Ian Gourlay]

One of the benifits is a lead generation machine but it appears that Doug is doing this for some with his web network.

There is another organization  I always get the intials wrong called the SCCF or somthing Chris browne and art are in charge

For the Big boys there is Truck Mounters Association

I joined somthing onceon Ebay but it went no where

What I did like was you had to be a Carpet CLEANER FOR TWO YEARS, BEEN ON training courses for variety of industry providers, and have full product and PL liability insurance.

Two of the criteria are my gripe with NCCA

[lands]

Ian, why do you need products liability or is that for selling spotters?

[Ian Gourlay]

Pete

Ihave been a retailer to long

I mean Insurance for the Carpet or Suite being worked on.

I regards all my services as products.

[Nick Johnston]

Hi guys

Sorry I didn't respond to this post earlier, but I didn't spot the thread - I was notified about it by a couple of guys at Carpex. I haven’t deliberately been keeping my head below the parapet, honest!

Sincere apologies if I have given the wrong impression about cowboys - no offence intended, I assure you. What I am NOT saying is that all members of forums are cowboys. I have found forums to be an invaluable source of information and long may they continue. However, newcomers are influenced by forum information that can vary between excellent and downright unprofessional. The difficulty for the newcomer can be in sorting the good from the bad. We all know that the written word, be it newspaper articles, letters or emails can be misinterpreted and forum posts are no different.

Let me bore you with my story: my introduction to this industry came through a guy who taught me how to be a perfect cowboy, spurs and all. It was like being taught to drive by a driver with several convictions for dangerous driving. So I decided to learn to drive properly by taking a course run by Advanced Driving Instructors i.e. NCCA. I passed the beginners course, but just like driving, although I have the licence, it will take me many more years before I can drive competently. I do NOT believe that membership of the NCCA makes you the best carpet cleaner on the block. This is why I continue to improve my knowledge and experience, with courses and qualifications.

I was asked to write the offending article to describe what NCCA has done for me and hopefully inform others that NCCA is a professional organisation that offers a great deal to its members. Past directors have done a huge amount for this industry and I hope to be able to add something in my small way. I do understand that NCCA membership won’t suit everyone and this definitely does not mean that you are either an NCCA member OR unprofessional! As a relative newbie, I just want to make sure that other newbies get the right start in their carpet cleaning life and continue to develop their skills, knowledge and professionalism without being tripped up by unwittingly acting upon advice which is questionable.

I will be at the CCDO next week if anyone wants to rip my head off. I tried to upload a photo of myself to make the job of identifying me easier, but couldn’t do so!

Regards.

Nick   

[liahona]

This forum on the whole is very good.

One can learn as much from the nonsense that is posted on here as much as what would appear and hope to be good and sound advice.

A lot on here think I post nonsense which is fine by me.  Either way it is an education.  If its nonsense then it needn't  be listened to or put into any practice.  If its thought of as something usefull then it can be copied or put into practice by those who think it worthwhile.  Either way both have had their uses.

I still think a lot more is educational on here than most any of the courses but I am also of the quaint that courses should be attended.  Just the courses dont actually teach anyone how to clean a carpet.

Best, Dave.

[Ken Wainwright]

During my time with the NCCA, the policy has been that technical issues should be referred to technically competent people. Because of the risk of returned calls being "lost" because the caller is not available, turned their phone off, on another call or whatever, a decision has been made to provide a contact number to the caller. It is then their responsibility to contact the technically competent person.  The experiences of Dave and others in that scenario is the very reason for changing the office procedure. If this newer format is not, for whatever reason, working effectively then please let us know, with details if possible.

The office staff are just that. They have necessary skills ranging from accountancy through to graphic design that they bring to the Association, and specialist training too as required. But they will never be empowered to offer technical or business advice  nor any issues outside their own expertise. They will instead offer contact details as stated previously.

Should you wish to contact myself or any other NCCA officers via email, then simply use the  @ncca.co.uk format preceded by the officers christian name eg ken@ncca.co.uk  All directors details can be found on the NCCA website www.ncca.co.uk

Constructive criticism is always listened to and is welcomed. No system is perfect and the Association is always striving to positively develop it's procedures.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

[stevegunn]

Ken at the Woodbridge you spoke of big changes afoot (british standards)but have not heard anything since then.These sort of things infuriate me all the talk but no action

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Unfortunately the NCCA and its directors past and present will get tarred with that brush but from when ever these forums started we used to get the annual line "things are happening behind the scenes" speech but even that doesn't happen anymore and the NCCA hasn't really moved on any.

Now I appreciate it must be difficult when directors are unpaid part time workers but if the directors were really listening they should 'adapt' to what the members and potential members and past members who threw out because nothing was happening really want.

Perhaps if I rejoin I may put this point across BUT insunations of corruptions should be kept in your own head not open forums RESPECTFULLY.

Hope to see you all at the CCDO putting your peaceful points across.

Yours faithfully

Shaun

[Ken Wainwright]

Steve

Would the membership be interested in something like SOP XYZ issue No. 7 updated 01/04/2008 which changes the, for example, the procedure for refering consumer enquiries blah, blah, blah.  These are internal administrative details which would bore the pants off the membership. Should we really be broadcasting this type of info?

As an example though, a big issue at present, which could well be the type of information you are refering to, are such things as PAS 86. We will report information about this as appropriate once something definitive has evolved. For the record, the NCCA has completed it's contribution and obligations to the PAS 86 and are awaiting upon the next phase from BSI. Publication should be "soon" dependent upon the actions of others, not necessarily the Association.  This project has run into years, not months. The delays are often outside of the Associations control.

I know that the membership becomes frustrated, and it's an absolute certainty that the directors do to, when it comes to the slow pace of progress on many different issues. Having been on the inside, I have seen how the "system" (not the NCCA's) often works to surpress the best efforts of the Directors and office administrators.

At the AGM, there were one or two snippets revealed showing one direction the Association would like to travel. This may be one of the projects I was refering to at WCS. This one project though, produces a web of other benefits and consequences. It's not my brief to reveal this sort of thing as it was a meeting closed to non-members.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

PS Most of the criticism of the Association comes from non members.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

What does the NCCA expect to do with the BSI PAS 86?

The general public don't know what these pass mark are just as some may ask what the NCCA is? although that may not seem fare as cstomers do look for soe trade organisation affilliated cleaners but the PAS 86 doesn't mean a great deal to me either.

I can remember Chemdry getting BSI or something like it, with a quick look on their websites national and regional they don't seem to advertise it anymore, do you think that the industry will benefit from BSI? will they regulate the quality control or is it just training to an approved criteria?

Shaun

[Ken Wainwright]

PAS 86 is about standards and procedures. It will formalise through an independent nationally respected body (BSI) what to expect from a carpet cleaner.

So what are the benefits of that? The opinion is that all the training bodies can now "sing from the same hymn sheet". If a consumer is dissatisfied with any CC's service, a point of (publicly available) reference is there to show how things should be done.

There are many of our industry's big players behind this project. It is predicted that our insurers will also take this on board and that they should take this document on board as a basis for our liability insurance.

On it's own, PAS 86 will not eliminate unethical or technically incompetent tradesmen or companies, but it will make it more difficult for them to prosper.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Ken who are the industry big players?

I estimate that the biggest majority are the minority in our industry, the little fella hold the biggest share in our game.

Looking at it from a NCCA perspective I can see where it is going and would add credability to the trade but the NCCA need to have their logo added onto everything cleaning related that is associated with BSI to put itself further forward. IMO the NCCA has let its members down in not promoting itself where it matters that is to the general public but this just could be the jewel in the crown because it would really push the 'wear your badge with pride'

This could be a blinding time to be a member providing it doesn't take years to do and impliment and also it does NEED promoting/advertising.

Shaun