[TennetClean]

Easy as this I wont bother thinking of any new ideas for the window cleaning industry -
so what you will probably say- but if you think back you probably wouldnt be using any trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes, and the GutterVac all of which we invented or developed years before the competition.

lol you didnt invent no trolley!  you copied it, somebody sent me a link to it ages ago.  some gardening thing it was.

"Independent power supplies" LOL so are you the inventor of the BATTERY then.  Lol we are in the presence of greatness.

[jouk45]

the think is,  if you diy a guttervac,  then who are we infringing glyn, your provision patent, or the inventor in the usa, you need seperate patents for both countrys, now it can get realy complicated, i dont condone anyone to steal other folks inventions, but seriously you can not tell anyone they cant buy a powerful vac which already has a length of flexible hose, then add whatever pole or pipe, to make there own system, so long as they dont copy any of your ideas, that i agree with you, and glyn, did you know, the large majority of wfp ideas where taken from these very forums,  

[jouk45]

right am on strike, am going back to ladders, do it the old fashioned way  night folks

[Old_Master]

Now I have looked at what is on offer :- Heres the prices you can buy the vac equipment described above from us
Standard ISSA 515M 1 x1200 watt motor 38mm outlet £195.00
Standard ISSA 640M 3 x1200 watt motors 38mm outlet £457.00
10metres 38mm black hose our price £39.00 List price £ £55.40
+ VAT

The hose is not the same type as used on our guttervac machine nor is it the same bore but is identical to the type described above and for sale by others . The vac priced above is the standard machine not our guttervac machine, however once again it is identical to the machine described above and for sale by others.
Hope this helps

[Jeff Brimble]

Another supplier savaged in a forum bloodbath for trying to protect his income/round 
Having had a couple of my original ideas nicked by "suppliers"    I do understand. Our next one  will have patent protection but like Dyson, will I go bust paying the legal costs.
 
Window cleaners must be the most inventive problem solvers on the Planet and the hardest sell. I am proud to be one. Paticulary with the group intelligence that forums provide.
Good place to sell but bad place to be butchered.

[Mr H]

Code: [Select]

http://www.guttervac.com.au/guttervac/about.html

Unique ideas are sometimes developed from everyday situations which require solutions. The Managing Director of Gutter-Vac, Warren Ballantyne, worked for many years in the plumbing industry and was constantly being asked to clean gutters at schools and other premises. Quite often he had to place his hands in gutters to retrieve objects and rubbish. He was determined to find a faster and safer way of removing gutter debris. In 1994 Warren hit on an idea to quickly and safely clean gutters and so, Gutter- Vac was born.

The first "Gutter-Vac"  was created in Bundaberg in 1994. The first five years of its operation were devoted to developing superior systems, procedures and marketing strategies. The initial market response to the Gutter-Vac service was overwhelming. It was due to this enthusiastic market reaction that Warren decided to franchise the Gutter-Vac system and all of its procedures.

Gutter-Vac sold its first franchise on the Sunshine Coast in 2000. Gutter-Vac is now Australia-wide and has over 25 franchises.

Does the name sound familiar Glyn....... Now who's copying...!!!!!


No-one can stop you from makeing your own gutter vacuum from off the shelf parts just like ford cant stop you from making a car from off the shelf parts. Even if you bought all the parts for a Ford fiesta and put it together then you could not sell it as a fiesta as ford had not made it. If Glyn has patented parts then provided they are not copied and sold then no-one is breaking any law.
If I posted that you needed exactly 18" or something of 8mm threaded rod and 20ft of a specific type of ducting or specifics like that, then I might be on slightly dodgey ground.
Trolleys are an example of what I mean. Many people have put together their own and posted details of it and how to do it so I don't see why Glyn is getting so uptight over it...
His Gutter vacuum NOR his high level camera are not new ideas.

Dread to think what he'll say when I post details of how to make a camera sytem to fit on top of your pole so you can survey "CHIMNEYS" for customers....

(Thought I'd better play safe there and not mention gutters)

Regards
Mr H

[[GQC] Tim]

Glyn, really you are creating a bad name for yourself on here.

Your going crazy, because somebody hooks up a wet and dry vac, to a pole and uses a hose to suck up the dirt. That has got nothing to do with your patent. Everyone can do that. It's like saying to all the other companies that they can't sell wfp. Or to a company that builds vacs that they can't use a metal tube, or any attachment, like carpet cleaning attachment, just because they look slightly similar. Ridiculous. The only thing that looks similar is the bracket that hold the pole and hose. But everyone can make something similar.

In fact, I'm going to make my own version of it aswell. Save some money aswell. Don't need it to say Omnipole in big letters.

[Alex Gardiner]

Patenting an idea or concept is not possible. If a long reach Vacuum attachment is used to clean Gutters then this concept is not able to be protected.

It is possible to Patent a production process or a device if it has unique features or has workings that are unique and not immediately apparent.

I would imagine that some of Glyn's vacuum attachments are unique (I have never examined them) and he has assured everyone they do have Patents Pending. Of course he is going to protect his products legally it is only what any sensible business would do. If most of us were in the same position we would do exactly the same thing. I also respect him for stating his point of view.

However the trouble with a good idea (whoever first had it, seems to be some discussion about this) is that it will be emulated, it is a fact of life. To see an example of this we have Mr Tucker and his wonderful idea-water fed pole window cleaning. If people had not copied his idea then Omnipole/Ionics/Facelift/GPS/Skypole/Eagle/Unger/Ettore/etc. would not all be making money from selling similar items. However many of the above do have slightly different approaches and some unique and protected parts to their systems.

There are also many who go down the DIY route and make their own WFP systems/poles.  A private individual is free to build what he wants as long as he is not attempting to sell a product that infringes design/patent/trademark protection.

At the moment there appears to be several different Gutter-Sucking machines and apparatus available on the worlds market. They all are slightly different and have different features. As stated above we have no intention at this time in selling a Gutter-Vacuum system. We have started retailing industrial vacuums as we had been requested by clients to source them. We do have another project in hand based on these machines that has nothing to do Gutters and depending on its viability we may start marketing this. One of the reasons that we are not particularly interested ion the Gutter market is that it is far too easily replicated and put together from standard retail parts (as has been shown). Some ideas are not worth spending money protecting because with a few simple changes the idea can easily be marketed by someone else.

I wish Glyn well with his Pending Patents and for his sake I hope that they are granted. These will not however prevent the many other firms from retailing their current Gutter-Vacuum systems or from private individuals from making their own.

[matt]

Patenting an idea or concept is not possible. If a long reach Vacuum attachment is used to clean Gutters then this concept is not able to be protected.

isnt that what glyn is trying to imply here though

this is exactly why the net is great, the freedom to share info

[matt]

Easy as this I wont bother thinking of any new ideas for the window cleaning industry -
so what you will probably say- but if you think back you probably wouldnt be using any trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes, and the GutterVac all of which we invented or developed years before the competition.

"Independent power supplies" LOL so are you the inventor of the BATTERY then.  Lol we are in the presence of greatness.

 

[Alistair@AWC]

When Glyn posted yesterday his username was Glyn_Omnipole its now Old_Master (Guest)


Please tell me he is not sulking and taken his toys in 

[Jeff Brimble]

Yep hes gone, shame.
See ya in Windex Glyn, you do have some good toys.

[Captain Scarlet]

Shame, why has he gone? was he removed? I liked some of his posts, Luke

[bluez]

Very interesting debate, a pity the topic couldnt be discussed instead of it only arising when someone feels they have to defend themselves.

Very good diy work Mr. H.

Glynn I wouldn't be too worried about a loss of sales, because the people who buy top of the range equipment in general are not the same ones who diy imo. There is no slur intended on either.


 

[matt]

When Glyn posted yesterday his username was Glyn_Omnipole its now Old_Master (Guest)


Please tell me he is not sulking and taken his toys in 

glyn hang on, you forgot this

[Alistair@AWC]

Matt,

Cruel.............but very funny LOL 

[jeff1]

Its a shame Glyn chose to delete his membership on CIU all that was asked of him was a few simple questions and in the end he never answered them.
Most of us know about copyrights laws etc, and I for one have no intentions of breaking them, I wouldn't put reach & wash or there logo on my paperwork or vehicle, because I know its protected and this was the reasons for my questions to Glyn.

I wanted to know if I built my own DIY one would I be breaking any copyright laws? I had no intensions of copying his gutter vac, I for one know Alex isn't stupid enough to copy any-ones patent, So why warn him?

I visited Glyns web-site to see Patent pending, he was asked by another member for his patent pending registered number/s he never gave them but said he wouldn't disclose them until he was granted a patent on it, now if you have applied for a patent and its pending you can disclose it because it has already been registered.

Its a shame Glyn would not answer any ones questions directly as it would have saved a lot of replies back and forth, my main question was simple? Would I be breaking any of his copyright laws? if I built my own Gutter Vac? I asked this question 2/3 times and never once got a reply.

I had the impression that Glyn was trying to corner the market with his gutter vac and warn off any of the small fry if they tried to build there own system.

Now if you look on Glyns site all the equipment he sells, is of very good quality and no one can knock him for that, I checked all the specs on his CCTV gear and its all very good gear and worth the money he asks but you can't patent a camera on a pole, so how can you patent a gutter vac? if it has already got a patent on it, unless you make improvements to the original design.

After reading some of the replies, I came to the conclusion that Glyn may have designed some part or parts in his system and that he can patent, but he wouldn't tell us what, If he has then I hope he gets his patent.

I have the greatest respect for Glyn, as I do for every member on all the forums and my intention's and questions were honorable, if they were not then I sincerely apologies to him, they were not in any way meant to offend him, if he had answered my original post then the debate between him and myself would not have continued, I even gave Glyn the opportunity to continue the debate by email rather than an open forum.

Glyn you have my respect.

[Neil Williams]

Am I on dodgie ground?
I use an old carpet cleaning machine which when attached to a mains supply does a great job of sucking 'stuff' (choose words carefully) from gutters.
Attach suction pipe to a rigid pole and instead of sucking water from carpets it sucks 'stuff' from gutters.
Sorry but you surely can't patent a method of doing something. Where would it all end. Cars, telephone, internet, vacuum cleaners, gas supply. The list is endless of ideas which there are variations of.

[poleman]

DIY a gutter vacuum system

As I am sure many of us would like to do are own DIY Gutter system and get the topic back of track

The big question is! How would you get a 51mm hose to fit into the side of entrance hole on the vacuum cleaner as it is only 38mm,  would a collar / adapter work! would the big clumps of dirt course a blockage just before it goes into the vacuum 38mm hole! As it would be coming from 51mm diameter!  

Andy

[jeff1]

DIY a gutter vacuum system

As I am sure many of us would like to do are own DIY Gutter system and get the topic back of track

The big question is! How would you get a 51mm hose to fit into the side of entrance hole on the vacuum cleaner as it is only 38mm,  would a collar / adapter work! would the big clumps of dirt course a blockage just before it goes into the vacuum 38mm hole! As it would be coming from 51mm diameter!  

Andy

The vac I have in my workshop has a 51mm outlet and the hose for sucking up water, I then have a smaller hose for my tools in the workshop, the collar of that is 51mm so fits in the vac, i suppose you could get a reducer, I think the idea is to break up any large sods  before you suck them up.