[tompoole]

Hi

i would put them all out and write a letter to say that i was sorry and next time i would charge them for the  advertising

tom

[Paul Coleman]

Is it definitely a whole Ionics system you must have in order to use the logo or is it sufficient to simply buy and use one of their poles?
Apart from that, I am aware that they are a company that would use litigation.  I may be wrong but I think that they weren't even obliged to give a warning.  However, perhaps they take the view that it would not be in their best interests to sue a potential future customer and indeed, it could even harm their standing within the industry.
My view is that you've had a warning that they did not need to give.
Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.

[Mike_G]

No, you cannot just buy their poles and use logo. I asked them that a few years ago after buying 2 poles from them

[Captain Scarlet]

why use their logo?

why promote their business?

dont push the term "reach and wash" term, instead use the term "water fed pole", unfortuantely the public and most people I meet use the term "reach and wash", its similar to using the term hoover. Luke

[williamx]

Ionics import some of their products from America, they double the price, then sell it to the gulliable as if ts part of the Ionics brand.

These products are not protected by copyright that Ionics own, so you could buy these same products from the same company that Ionics use, and use that logo without fear of litigation from Ionics.

Also do Ionics own the copyright of the words "Reach & Wash"? I don't think so, but if they do, then they are missing out on hundreds of companies, who say they use such systems.

For example, I have been approached by several companys and councils to tender for work, which must be cleaned using the "Reach & Wash System" I have pointed out that I use a WFP system which in all purposes is a reach & wash system, but its not an Ionics product that costs many thousands of pounds.

They don't want you to have a Ionics system, they just want you to have a wfp system, but the name "Reach & Wash" is identified with wfp cleaning.

As for using their logo, this is illegal and you need to bin the leaflets. on your next leaflet get a photo of you, using a pole in the same manner as the Ionics logo, they can't copyright your face and image.    

[d s windowcleaning]

what if all the leaflets had been posted before you recieved the phone call ?   you couldnt bin them or cover the logo then .

[Mike_G]

You would think that all advertising is good advertising. So why do ionics jump on anybody using their logo and not the system. I wonder if they have sold any systems just because the person buying loved the logo so much and had to have it. It would cost loads for an ad campaign if most van in every town had this logo on it. Maybe they are missing a trick here, free advertising and perhaps the chance to sell just the logo for people who would like to use it.

[Village Gleam]

These posts are making it worse. Nice one Sean very helpfull.
This is what you must do.

Write the most groveling apology you can think of as the very next post. Say that it was an unitentional mistake on your part, and that you intend to bin all the leaflets. Then lock the topic.

If it goes the legal route the best you could hope for is to settle out of court and pay their costs.

[TennetClean]

Sean Rimmer, that cant be your real name surely? LOL!

[Alex Gardiner]

Having looked up registered trade marks of nearly every water fed pole supply company (I do this sad sort of things), Ionics have the phrase 'Reach & Wash' as a registered trade mark.  Interestingly they do not have the phrase 'Reach and Wash' as a trade mark. However, they may still litigate if they felt your intention was to build upon their registered trade mark.

[brightnclean]

I have just put together a leaflet and included the reach and wash logo (someone told me it was free to use) i didnt think any more of it then today got a call from Ionics saying that i had put a leaflet through one of their customers doors and he had contacted them. The guy from Ionics said i have to have one of their systems to use the logo and could i please stop using it ..... only problem is i have just had 10,000 printed! ... Any ideas?

Sorry Matt but the fact is you nicked the logo.. period. Lesson here is.. check the facts out don't just go one someone elses opinion.

The reason councils and big companies use the phrase Reach and Wash is that for better or worse Ionic's marketing has made it the Hoover of the WFP industry. They have obviously invested very heavilly in marketing and brand building and to their credit brought the use of WFP into everyday use.

Take the advice of people like Alex gardiner and Glyn from  omnipole and bin the lot. If you don't it could well bankrupt you in the end. I will protect my own copywritten logo with litigation if it is ever used by anyone else. I am small fry compared to Ionics. They have basically given you the opportunity to refrain from using the logo without any further action. They will be aware of this thread here and without a doubt would drag you through a very expensive litigation process if you dont do what they have in in all honesty asked you nicely to do. I also will repeat.. continue at your peril.

You will always have the "get out of jail" replies to a problem like this but playing safe is by far your best bet.

[Wayne Thomas]

Why advertise Ionics if you don't get paid for it? I wouldn't advertise any WFP system. The only advertising on my van & website is for my benefit, nobody else gets a mention. I use Ionics WF poles and an Ionics cricket trolley but I wouldn't want to put an Ionics logo on my van because I'm not advertising freebies. If they paid me to advertise their stuff, then I might consider it............

[L.J.Thorpe]

all you have said is "leaflets" how much did you spend if its 10k mono flyers bin em if its 10 full colour a4 and they aint been folded then you could salvage em without using stickers or a guillotine depends on the costs really but can be done

[TennetClean]

LOL nevermind.  My childish humor I suppose.  (and too much time on urbandictionary.com)

[TennetClean]

crikey moses I didnt know that was still going.

Ah it brings me back to the ol' school days.  Life was simple then...

[*foxman]

Having looked up registered trade marks of nearly every water fed pole supply company (I do this sad sort of things), Ionics have the phrase 'Reach & Wash' as a registered trade mark.  Interestingly they do not have the phrase 'Reach and Wash' as a trade mark. However, they may still litigate if they felt your intention was to build upon their registered trade mark.

hmmm.. may be you cant trademark an action? The '&' symbol may be intergal to the trademark. If that is the case anyone can put Reach AND Wash on anything because you are describing what you do.....

[eddie d]

interedting .
does anyone kno .

a trade mark lawyer

[dai]

Ionics may take you to court, but they would alienate themselves against most of us posting on here if they did. We all hate the big guys, trying to swat the little guys trying to make a living. They could well shoot themselves in the foot. Dai

[windowwashers]

interedting .
does anyone kno .

a trade mark lawyer

I dont know one but I do know you cannot use a word that is in every day use (different saying but means the same generic I think the word is) ie window or cleaner these cannot be a trade mark Reach & wash can be but reach and wash not so maybe the other way round I dont use it nor would I because if you said that to someone you would get a blank look back unless they had bought a system.

hard one to be honest, ditching the leaflets is the easy option, posting them you would be taking a gamble and the stakes are agaist you.

[TennetClean]

Ionics may take you to court, but they would alienate themselves against most of us posting on here if they did. We all hate the big guys, trying to swat the little guys trying to make a living. They could well shoot themselves in the foot. Dai

no offense dai but they are not going to care diddly squat about anyone on here or what they think IMO.  People who like to post and rant on here are mostly cobble-together merchants who are never going to be their customers anyway.    granted not everyone but most. 

(Before some idiot calls me a sexist racist stalinist pacifist loyalist terrorist butterkist sunkist satan worshiping nazi for making a generalization - dont bother.)

If anything an example would be made of "the little guy" to encourage others not to do the same thing.  If it was me I'd SQUASH THE LITTLE GUY LIKE A FLY then go MWAH MWAH MWAAAAAH in a 'world domination laughter" stylee.