[derikraven]

serious question here, whats the best way to approach cleaning a nubuck? suite. I've got one to do next week. Can it be wet cleaned?

[LTT Leathercare]

Firstly you need to be 100% sure that it is Nubuck.  There are some very good fabric imitations around and people do think they have Nubuck when it isn't.  Look and feel alone will not give you a definitve answer.
A Nubuck suite will have been very expensive.  If you use a microscope to have a look at it you will be able to see either the structure of the leather fibres or the fabric threads.

If you follow this link you will see a complete guide to cleaning Nubuck.

http://www.lttsolutions.net/cleaning.asp#nubuck

but as I have said it is vital to check first as this process would ruin a fabric suite!!  
Wet cleaning is often specified by other people but we would not recommend it at all.  If you wet Nubuck all that happens is that the dirt is drawn deeper into the leather, the whole thing will go black and you will have no idea what it is going to look like until it has completely dried out (which takes forever).  It can also draw old stains to the surface so it can look worse than when you started.

if you want any more advice don't hesitate to get in touch.

[Joe H]

As always, a good answer from the professionals who specialise in this area.

[Roger Koh]

Seriously, the best approach to clean a nubuck suite is to wet clean it!
Besides the effective removing of soils, spills, stains and other foreign contaminants,
the suite should return to its original nubuck characteristic when done by a serious leather cleaning professional.

And additional features should be highlighted to bring value to the customer:
1. Diminishing fatliquor to be replenished to return to the nubuck’s original tannery structure softness.
2. Diminishing Wax or Oil Pull-Up Effect to be replenished especially on body-contact, light and heat exposure surfaces.
3. Enhance a “finger writing effect” aesthetically to its fine nap.
4. Enhance a “silky feel” non-stick surface to its fine nap.
5. Enhance the unforgettable classic Leather scent that will make customer smile.

Using Leather safe (pH 3-5) wet cleaning system products is the preference both for the cleaners’ reputation
and for the sake of maintaining nubuck leather chemistry integrity seriously!
 
Products are available, email me for details.

Roger Koh
IICRC#942 LCT MTC MSR
info@leatherdoctor.org
Leather Doctor® System
Sharing with you a 21st century breakthrough in leather cleaning and restoration technology

[bennymon]

unless your 100% sure what your doing give it a miss 

[Mark Roberts]

Stay right away from wet if you value your insurance, 4 years ago I did a report on a suite worth 12k, ruined by a cleaner using 'safe products'.

It's not something to experiment on, using any product. I would do it the dry way, even Fenice only use a light foam/cloth procedure.

[Ben Staerck]

Cleaning dry is undoubtably the safest way, but the results aren't that great, especially not compaed to wet cleaning.

I have been testing nubuck cleaning out quite extensivley the last few months and I have found it is best to brush the pile using a dry brush to remove any loose dirt. and then after that, if you feel necessary, wet clean the leather.

I cleaned two pairs of nubuck shoes last week, when doing the dry mothod it didn't make the slightest bit of difference. It wasn't until i wet cleaned them that you could actually see the cleaning results, which were superb!

A few tips. You don't need a nubuck cleaning brush or cloth. I found using a tampico brush and terry towel much better, and both of which are in most peoples tool kits. The only specialist products you would need are a protector and cleaner.

[LTT Leathercare]

Tampico brushes are far too soft for doing this type of work which is why you need a napping brush and a Nubuck Cloth is sticky so it does the work properly.  If you do not use these products obviously the results will not be good because a tampico brush and a terry towel will give nothing like the results that proper equipment does.

Can someone explain how on a leather that is so absorbent and continually draws in moisture that wet cleaning can possibly draw out the dirt.??

We have had huge success dry cleaning nubuck over the past 15 years.  We have also seen many disasters where a wet cleaning system has been used using so called 'leather safe' products.  Wet cleaning is massively risky and anyone using this method should double check their insurance to make sure they are covered for any problems that this will throw up.  Many problems that you will encounter during wet cleaning will be unfixable once they have happened.

This is a subject that we have researched and worked on over the past 15+ years and the results speak for themself.

[Ben Staerck]

Can someone explain how on a leather that is so absorbent and continually draws in moisture that wet cleaning can possibly draw out the dirt.??

The dirt & stains are loosened by the cleaner and so come away from the fibres, then when you brush it it brushes the dirt out or too the surface, which you then wipe away with the cloth.

Just because something is absorbant doesn't mean it cannot be cleaned.

Tampico brushes are far too soft for doing this type of work which is why you need a napping brush and a Nubuck Cloth is sticky so it does the work properly.  If you do not use these products obviously the results will not be good because a tampico brush and a terry towel will give nothing like the results that proper equipment does.

It is not obvious that they do not work as well, you have to test each method out and see what works best for you.

I also found that the nubuck brushes can remove a lot of the fibres from the nubuck making the pile less evident in that area - I belive this happens because you try so hard to remove dirt or stains with the brush that you start to remove the fibres. This also happened if you were too aggressive with the tampico brush. The advatage of wet cleaning is you do not need to be aggressive and so you do not get this problem.

[LTT Leathercare]

We cleaned our first Nubuck Suite (not shoe) in the late '80s and have cleaned them (not regularly- because of the problems) ever since, the last one being a chair last month which came up really well.

So we do have experience of on site practical applications of our processes and the problems that other processes create (because we have tried them) so if you do not want to follow the advice we have given that is entirely up to you and as someone said in an earlier post check your insurance.  Repairing damage caused by incorrect use of product or process is usually impossible to rectify on Nubuck.

We have also done colour restoration on Nubuck so we understand the problems of trying to restore colour and damage to Nubuck.  We don't do this anymore!!!!

We always teach to play safe so Good Luck.

[Ben Staerck]

All im going by is what I have done these past few months.  I have tested the cleaner on seven different upholstery nubucks and I haven't had any problems with it.

What type of problems to you expect to occur? Its only a mild water solution, what possible damage could it cause? I even poured it onto each leather and let it dry and it dried back to normal without any problems.

The only down side of course, is you have to wait for the leather to dry to see any results, but this is something you just allow time for before you start.

[LTT Leathercare]

Dirty and worn leather will give vastly different results to tests done on new leather.

[Ben Staerck]

Dirty and worn leather will give vastly different results to tests done on new leather.

Two of the leathers were extremely dirty and each about 2 years old.

But you still didn't answer my question.

What type of problems to you expect to occur?

[LTT Leathercare]

We have cleaned many Nubuck suites in the USA where Nubuck was far more popular than it has been here. 

Seven Nubuck suites in a few months 

If you have had wide experience of cleaning Nubuck you will have encountered all the problems yourself.  It takes time over many years to experience all the problems that leather presents and cannot be done by simple tests.

Most of the problems that occur when wet cleaning Nubuck have been posted before and I do not intend to put up all the information here so that you can develop your knowledge on the subject just so that you can use it as your own.  If you have cleaned 7 Nubuck suites in the last few months then you should have a good knowledge of the problems that these cause and that you are prepared to back up the information and products you supply to your customers.

If you want to pursue this argument please do it through a private email as this is getting out of hand and is very unprofessional. 

Any one who wants to discuss the problems of wet cleaning Nubuck with me may contact me on 01423 881027 and I will be happy to help.

[Ben Staerck]

are you joking???

You said wet cleaning causes problems. I haven't had any problems with it, yet you say they occur.

You have to back up your claims, you can't tell people that it damages leather, without proof.........you can't even tell me what the potential damages are.

If you have cleaned 7 Nubuck suites in the last few months then you should have a good knowledge of the problems that these cause and that you are prepared to back up the information and products you supply to your customers.

My point is I haven't had any problems.

[LTT Leathercare]

No one mentioned damaging the leather except you.  All our statements can be verified and backed up so please read the last paragraph on our last reply. :

[Ben Staerck]

This is for the benefit of all members of the forum. You cannot say that one method damages the leather WITHOUT BACKING IT UP.

I am about to start marketing a wet cleaning system for nubuck when all my testing is finished, and I find it offensive that you say its damaging. If you had a good reson I could accept that, but you cannot just brush the matter away because you are unwilling to answer my question, or back up your statements.

[*paul_moss]

Judy as you said you need to be very experienced when it comes to Nubuck, and it would take lots of years or lots of suites to clean to gain that experience.
For that reason I always walk from them as I have only done a couple of Nubuck cleans and found the end result not to my satisfaction ( strange as the customers seem to be happy with the result). Same goes for any unfinished leather, I just walk now as the customer usually only calls when its too far gone or had a go themselves.
Dont forget that  the Nubuck market is only around 4% of the total leather trade.
I prefere to stick to pigmented leather.

Ben thanks for your help with the new PU finish to day it worked a treat and problem solved 

[LTT Leathercare]

Hi Paul

Most people do walk away from Nubuck for the reasons you state.  Results are very unpredictable (even when dry cleaning methods are used - although with this method the results are more predictable than with a wet system). As you say Nubuck is a very small %age of the market (I think they must all be in Newcastle by the sounds of it!!)

Unfinished leathers although they do not clean effectively are ideal candidates for restoration which is very straightforward and the results are stunning.  Will try and post some photos.

[LTT Leathercare]

This shows restoration done on the following bed head.