[Village Gleam]

That wasn't a dig at you peter- although I do tend to dig a bit- I was wondering at some of your posts. How can you think hot water damages glass? The only circs i can imagine is where a pane is held in by four very tight nails, but not many are put in that way these days.

Similarly you seem very concerned with the operational temp of resin.

If you shared some of your thinking with us we might be able to help. Now that you've blabbed you might as well spill the rest of it.

[Alex Gardiner]

No hot water system development for me!  I'm just looking into a new type of hose for them.

[Village Gleam]

I've being doing some work on the marketing side Peter, and it's quite interesting. If you look at the two brand leaders in hot systems, they sell something and then the person who buys it, the operator, does nothing but promote them(the original manufacturer)and their system.

People think they have all the terms phrases and marketing what not sewn up. They don't.

Can you remember the formula for making money?Find a way of adding value, a hot system?, and then tell people about it.

So go on, tell us a bit more about the engineering.

[Peter Fogwill]

That wasn't a dig at you peter- although I do tend to dig a bit- I was wondering at some of your posts. How can you think hot water damages glass? The only circs i can imagine is where a pane is held in by four very tight nails, but not many are put in that way these days.

Similarly you seem very concerned with the operational temp of resin.

If you shared some of your thinking with us we might be able to help. Now that you've blabbed you might as well spill the rest of it.

I never took it as a dig at me.

I never thought hot water damages glass; I was reading with interest all the post stating that it does.  I was the one who uses hot water to defrost my windscreen, and in my bucket traditional.

Again with the resin, I have been telling everyone for years that hot water is better for resin than cold water.

To put the picture straight, I have also been telling everyone for years that hot water would be no benefit as far as normal window cleaning is concerned, and I don't believe it is a benefit, not as far as any work I did was concerned.  I do say that on windows not been cleaned for years, then hot water would be a benefit.

The reason I am developing a hot water system is purely down to demand, and the fact that there could be a very cold winter.  In a very cold winter a hot water system will keep you working longer than a cold water system.  There is also a lot of talk every winter about keeping the inside of vans frost free, and the same hot water system will do that as well.  

So to sum it up a hot water system with an antifrost which will protect the inside of the van, would be a good thing to provide for anyone wanting to work when others may not be able to.

Peter

[Village Gleam]

Your reasons are well thought out.
You're wrong IMO about no or little benefit.
There's a massive benefit you haven't spotted, and this wil drive the demand
So it's a diesel system then?

[Village Gleam]

I didn't put that very well. I'll try again, what i mean is that you personaly Peter have made some big contibutions to the developement of wfp. Your brush, your various patents. I'm sure that many businesses started by copying you.

As you suggest wfp may be on the brink of another big sea change, and that is the widespread availability and use of hot systems.

Only today a customer(she was visiting my customer) complained to me that her window cleaner left her windows all spotty. 'But he only had a barrel thingy, not like you, he didn't have hot water...'

[windowwashers]

Only today a customer(she was visiting my customer) complained to me that her window cleaner left her windows all spotty. 'But he only had a barrel thingy, not like you, he didn't have hot water...'

Or do you mean a van mount ? you left yourself wide open for that did she really sy hot water or was that your added bit to it ?
someone with a trolley could well have hot water, no does not look as impressive as a van mount, then it does cost alot less so wouldnt IMO

[NWH]

I really like the look of the hot water system that they sell on the link from this site the concept 20,it`s the best looking one i`ve seen.Plus i like the idea of gas as it`s heat on demand and cheaper to run.

[Village Gleam]

That's my point WW. I didn't speak to her she spoke to me.

How did she know that I had hot water?
How did she know her chap didn't?

I had just done a house nearby, but there was no steam visible, so how did she know? Not only that, why was it so important to her?

I'll give you a clue. She was the first  person ever to tell me i had hot water, and it was my first day out since my rebranding.

Again today new customer by phone in a remote village quote (£15) start explaining cuts me short- yes i can see that will be great-. Comes out after I've finished(under 20 mins) to tell me what a marvelous job i've done.

[windowwashers]

I really like the look of the hot water system that they sell on the link from this site the concept 20,it`s the best looking one i`ve seen.Plus i like the idea of gas as it`s heat on demand and cheaper to run.

Concept20 have it hands down on looks, then it is designed by a lady (and not knocking that at all) looks very good close up  

[Nathanael Jones]

Concept2O's offering has a minimum flow rate of 2.4 litres a minute doesn't it??? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm sure I read that somewhere. Isn't that a bit wasteful?

I'd like the option to recycle hot water into the tank on a cold evening to keep the van frost free overnight,.. but other than that I'd only ever want to heat the water as I use it, and minimise the running costs. Why heat the whole tank if you'll only use half of it that day? 

I much prefer the idea of the diesel heaters by webasto and eberspacher. They're cheaper too!

[windowwashers]

That's my point WW. I didn't speak to her she spoke to me.

How did she know that I had hot water?
How did she know her chap didn't?

I had just done a house nearby, but there was no steam visible, so how did she know? Not only that, why was it so important to her?

I'll give you a clue. She was the first  person ever to tell me i had hot water, and it was my first day out since my rebranding.

Again today new customer by phone in a remote village quote (£15) start explaining cuts me short- yes i can see that will be great-. Comes out after I've finished(under 20 mins) to tell me what a marvelous job i've done.

Hook line sinker is what I would say to that m8, fair play to you, I am not knocking you at all.

[Peter Fogwill]

Your reasons are well thought out.
You're wrong IMO about no or little benefit.
There's a massive benefit you haven't spotted, and this wil drive the demand
So it's a diesel system then?

Yes a diesel system, but one that uses a lot of the heat wasted by the heat genarated from the vehicle engine.

Peter

[Davew]

Now there is a good idea. Some kind of heat exchanger perhaps maybe coming from the heat of the exhaust. Could heat a smaller tank or reservoir  whilst driving between jobs. Sounds difficult but the running costs would be minimal.

[Peter Fogwill]

There is two ways it can be done, one like you say from the exhaust, and the other from the cooling system.  If you do quite a bit of driving you would have free hot water, and if not the diesel heater kicks in.  The diesel heater is also used overnight to keep the van interior frost free.

Peter

[Nathanael Jones]

The internal heater on most vehicles runs off a heat exchanger that takes heat from the vehicles cooling system. Its quite easy to get hold of one that is small enough to go into your WFP tank just by lowering it into the top, without modifying the tank. I've one off a 2002 Celica that fits perfect.
 All you need is for a mechanic to run hoses (Heatproof!) from the tank to the heater under the dashboard in the van. The heat output isn't massive, but if you do a bit of driving it will definitely be enough to stop the tank freezing.
You would still need an "on demand" heater to boost the temp before it goes up the pole,.. unless you do an awful lot of driving

[Wayne Thomas]

The internal heater on most vehicles runs off a heat exchanger that takes heat from the vehicles cooling system. Its quite easy to get hold of one that is small enough to go into your WFP tank just by lowering it into the top, without modifying the tank. I've one off a 2002 Celica that fits perfect.
 All you need is for a mechanic to run hoses (Heatproof!) from the tank to the heater under the dashboard in the van. The heat output isn't massive, but if you do a bit of driving it will definitely be enough to stop the tank freezing.
You would still need an "on demand" heater to boost the temp before it goes up the pole,.. unless you do an awful lot of driving

FREE HOT WATER:

I have fitted a 75 litre twin coil calorifier tank into the back of my van. I  have it connected to the hot water outlet on my radiator so that the heat that would normally be dispersed through the radiator is instead passed through my calorifier tank and returned to the cold circulation side of the radiator hose where it is recirculated back through the engine block.
Inside my calorifier tank are two coils with a lot of fins which disperse the heat into the stored water encased in the calorifier which surrounds these two coils. The water that comes from the radiator is filled with a percentage of antifreeze/summer coolant to stop the engine block from freezing or overheating which then pass through the coils inside the calorifier tank. The water surrounding the coils I circulate around my WFP tank via a 12volt, 75psi shureflow pump.
On a long journey the water stored in the calorifier tank gets very hot. I can either leave this hot water to remain stored in the calorifier tank for 24 hours where it would remain hotter than if I circulated it through my very insulated WFP tank or I can transfer it to my WFP tank to use for the day. I have tried using the water straight from my calorifier tank straight to my WF pole but I find it tends to be too hot and the pressure builds up to quick and is likely to blow at the pressure relief valve which I fitted onto my calorifier tank. So for simplicity I use the heat from my calorifier tank by circulating it around my WFP tank instead.
To confuse you even further, in my calorifier tank I have a 2kw immersion heater element which I can connect to an electricity supply for heating the stored water in the calorifier, although it takes much longer to heat using the electric, then it would to have the engine running.
Using the immersion heater with electric cost money. Using the twin coil heat input from the engine costs me nothing if I'm travelling to and from work.
Hope this helps the DIY want to use hot water users

[Wayne Thomas]

It was minus 4 degrees outside this morning. My water was hot, my hose was lovely and soft and my pole wasn't frozen. I had a hassle free day working when all the local car washes had frozen up this morning. Oh and my hands were lovely and warm Worked today because I had Monday & Tuesday off this week

[matt]

The internal heater on most vehicles runs off a heat exchanger that takes heat from the vehicles cooling system. Its quite easy to get hold of one that is small enough to go into your WFP tank just by lowering it into the top, without modifying the tank. I've one off a 2002 Celica that fits perfect.
 All you need is for a mechanic to run hoses (Heatproof!) from the tank to the heater under the dashboard in the van. The heat output isn't massive, but if you do a bit of driving it will definitely be enough to stop the tank freezing.
You would still need an "on demand" heater to boost the temp before it goes up the pole,.. unless you do an awful lot of driving

FREE HOT WATER:

I have fitted a 75 litre twin coil calorifier tank into the back of my van. I  have it connected to the hot water outlet on my radiator so that the heat that would normally be dispersed through the radiator is instead passed through my calorifier tank and returned to the cold circulation side of the radiator hose where it is recirculated back through the engine block.
Inside my calorifier tank are two coils with a lot of fins which disperse the heat into the stored water encased in the calorifier which surrounds these two coils. The water that comes from the radiator is filled with a percentage of antifreeze/summer coolant to stop the engine block from freezing or overheating which then pass through the coils inside the calorifier tank. The water surrounding the coils I circulate around my WFP tank via a 12volt, 75psi shureflow pump.
On a long journey the water stored in the calorifier tank gets very hot. I can either leave this hot water to remain stored in the calorifier tank for 24 hours where it would remain hotter than if I circulated it through my very insulated WFP tank or I can transfer it to my WFP tank to use for the day. I have tried using the water straight from my calorifier tank straight to my WF pole but I find it tends to be too hot and the pressure builds up to quick and is likely to blow at the pressure relief valve which I fitted onto my calorifier tank. So for simplicity I use the heat from my calorifier tank by circulating it around my WFP tank instead.
To confuse you even further, in my calorifier tank I have a 2kw immersion heater element which I can connect to an electricity supply for heating the stored water in the calorifier, although it takes much longer to heat using the electric, then it would to have the engine running.
Using the immersion heater with electric cost money. Using the twin coil heat input from the engine costs me nothing if I'm travelling to and from work.
Hope this helps the DIY want to use hot water users

thats what was discussed on the DIY forum last year, some1 said they were going to try it and we never heard from them again , was it you ? ?? ?

[Wayne Thomas]

It was me  who suggested it on here in the first place under the name of Easy Clean