[edd]

what a load of b******s guys i have a Thermopure the water that is heated
to 45 degrees is still 000 tds when it comes out the brush
  Do you really think Ionics would sell them if they didn`t work

 If you want pics no problem but still 000 hot or cold but the hot makes the job
quicker without a doubt I mean would you have a cold shower and would it get all the grease of I think not hot is just a nicer thing but when it comes to soil and
first cleans dirty cons roofs it just works so much quicker Edd

[EasyClean]

Get some pure water.
Check the TDS is 000
Boil the water
Check the TDS
I bet it has risen to anywhere between 8-14 TDS
Hot water systems leave spots
End of story.

CRAP!

[Tim Rose]

what a load of b******s guys i have a Thermopure the water that is heated
to 45 degrees is still 000 tds when it comes out the brush
  Do you really think Ionics would sell them if they didn`t work

 If you want pics no problem but still 000 hot or cold but the hot makes the job
quicker without a doubt I mean would you have a cold shower and would it get all the grease of I think not hot is just a nicer thing but when it comes to soil and
first cleans dirty cons roofs it just works so much quicker Edd

It's all very well saying that hot water 'cleans', and all that guff about cold showers etc., but you don't know what rubbish is left on your skin, do you?

[Tim Rose]

CRAP!

I like your argument - completely structured, well thought out and succintly delivered.  You have converted me!

[Clive McDonald]

V8ED, i do domestics, would it be any good for me, and ballpark what would it cost (ionics)?
I've got all the wfp etc, just a bare ionics hot system for my van.

And then what might the extra running costs be?

[EasyClean]

CRAP!

I like your argument - completely structured, well thought out and succintly delivered.  You have converted me!

Sorry my argument was not constructive. It's Friday and I've just crammed 3 days work into 1 very long, 'bat out of hell, go for it' day today so pretty knackered to say the least.  Next time I'll be more helpful

[jouk45]

Boil it in a stainless steel pan - over gas.
I did this last night and some 'pure' water at 000TDS rose to 15TDS while heating up, and then cooled down read 008TDS.
It's not the stainless steel causing the rise - it has to be a chemical reaction of some sort.

dont think the water is actualy boiled, its just heated to the right temprature,

[Tim Rose]

I doubt these 'hot machines' heat to boiling point anyway - very wasteful and could hurt yourself with very hot water flying all over the place.
Does anyone know what temperature the water needs to be to be effective?  I wold think that simply being 'warm' would help.
But I'm still worried about the TDS rising with heating.

Don't worry about the 'crap' thing - I talk and write crap myelf often enough!

[EasyClean]

The diesel heaters raise the water temperature to 80degrees Celsius which is far too hot to use on some glass. The way around it is to recycle the water around your tank to a more suitable 25 to 45 degrees. The larger your WFP tank, the longer it takes to reach a certain temperature but at the same time the larger the tank the longer it will remain at that temperature. It pays to insulate the WFP tank so that the diesel heater isn't running for so long and to also retain the heat better. My WFP tank is insulated 7 times better than my boiler at home. If I heat my water to hot then 24 hours later it will still be warm. I also have a calorifier tank which keeps very hot water very hot for 24hours as it loses very little heat at all.

[Tim Rose]

and you don't get aproblem with spotting/smearing etc.?

[NWH]

What about in the winter when it`s very cold,putting hot water on very cold glass would cause it to crack the glass i would think, you`ve seen the bloke next door that comes out on a cold winters morning and tips a kettle of hot water on his windscreen ouch!

[matt]

COLD works well

why use HOT

i knwo the arguement of " its great for first cleans" so it cleaning the windows TWICE for first cleans, i have no1 complain about that

afterall isnt a CLEAN window a CLEAN window if its down with hot, cold, warm, tepid ( you get the picture ) water

imho just another reason to sell another system to you

[Dave Turley]

crikey, this topic's livened up since i last was here.......

i've decided that i'm just being way too fussy. the last few days i've been whizzing over the windows with a good flow on, and ignored the tiny particle dots which hold the tiny dots of water..........  checked the windows on my collections and guess what.... they're perfect, every one. now i'm earning half as much again!!!     

i think i'd oversensitised myself to taking notice of these particles when we had all that windy rainy weather over last winter. they left all the windows in a real state which took alot of scrubbing to get clean.

i'm still interested in building a hot system at an affordable price. easyclean, thanks for the offer, i may well pop and see you over the summer!!

 

[Tim Rose]

What about in the winter when it`s very cold,putting hot water on very cold glass would cause it to crack the glass i would think, you`ve seen the bloke next door that comes out on a cold winters morning and tips a kettle of hot water on his windscreen ouch!

I believe that the glass in winter times is warmer than in the summer due to the fact that the house will probably have the central heating on.  You'd have to be very unlucky to break a pane.  Again, even less likely if the water is not VERY hot but just very warm.

Matt, I don't think this is a great way to sell hot systems, as if you can get a way to take heat from the vehicle's exhaust/engine then you could use that heat to warm the water.

I just need convincing that hot/warm water does not leave spots/cause the tds to rise, that's all. I wouldn't buy from a supplier a hot system - I would make it myself.  What about putting an immersion heating element into the tank and plug in where you can - at home over night, with a thermostat to keep the temperature down.  If any of your customers havean outside power point, you could, with permission, plug into their mains.

[edd]

hot water does not rise the tds
hot water in winter will crack windows if not kept under 30 degs I know
wabasto uk sell heaters for about £1000.00
ionics machine with van £26000.00
happy cleaning guys it works for me hot or cold
BUT hot or warm is quicker NO doult about it
its up to you how much money extra you want I want loads too pay for the Ionics gear ha ha
any questions on diy please ask Edd

[NWH]

Did you pay £26000 was that +vat,if you don`t mind me asking how much a month.

[Tim Rose]

Edd, wfp is quicker than trad (generally) so how much quicker than cold wfp is hot or warm?

What counts as 'hot'?  Anything over 30 degrees?

[Clive McDonald]

What did you pay Edd, not 26k surely?
And you didn't metion running costs.

Do you always turn it on, are there some days you don't bother, is there any benefit for domestic from the marketing point of view?

[Tim Rose]

I have a Thermopure.

There's youre answrr Eco.  £26K!

[Clive McDonald]

I would like to see someone put up a good argument for a hot system. I have seen several similar threads and none have been very convincing. There would seem to be three claimed benefits.

1. Marketing advantage. You can obtain an lead in geting big commercial jobs especially with cutting edge of high tech firms.

2.Technical superiority. A cleaner clean in less time, especially on dirtier jobs or first cleans.

3,More professional working method, that marries with the man in the streets perception of what should be used to clean windows.(if you can't have soap, then hot water would seem obvious).

However, either these arguments are not true, or none of the champions of this method are adticulate enought to expound them.