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hi jeffi've used oval vikans for nearly 3 years & always thought they were fine, i read a few posts with propole (i think) slagging them off & blarting on about how you must get the right tool for the job etc.etc. and i still thought "well they work fine for me" ( i'd never used anything else) BUT- having got a facelift pole & brush, i have to say that i AGREE with him 110%!!! forget the pole, the brush alone is worth its weight in gold. i honestly can't beleive what a massive difference this has made to my work. i do a LOT of sash windows and always struggled to get into the corners and right up to the top of the bottom window (recessed), and did have problems with overspray etc.i now see clearly what propole means, you have total accuracy with this brush, no overspray, gets right into any corner and to be honest just does a far, far better job as a whole. i get round my work loads faster, i couldn't be without it anymore. if you were to try a brush like this jeff you would see exactly what i mean, this is only a standard facelift brush too, i would think that these here Gaz brushes and the likes are probably better. it's a good position your in being able to nip home to top up too.regardstony