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Poll

what do you think of new pwc mag

excellent
7.7%
3 (7.7%)
very good
2.6%
1 (2.6%)
good
5.1%
2 (5.1%)
not bad
10.3%
4 (10.3%)
rubbish
74.4%
29 (74.4%)

Total Members Voted: 37

Voting closed: October 23, 2006, 07:47:08 pm

Sarah Sarill

  • Posts: 1537
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2006, 10:45:43 pm »
and while I liked the small pic of the young lady on page 38

Like your style  Malc  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Sarah

Terry_Burrows

  • Posts: 1643
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2006, 08:29:43 am »
I never bothered to sign up for it :-\ I think it will dwindle away there is only so much you can write about wc,and its tools etc,whats new ,er not much :-X it might be worth coming out 2 times a year then it might be jam packed with info thats of Interest :-\ by the sounds of it not many will renew :-\
WWW.FASTESTWINDOWCLEANER.CO.UK
GUINNESS WORLD RECORD HOLDER
BURNING RUBBER FASTER!
NATIONAL FEDERATION OF MASTER WINDOW CLEANERS.

Trevor Knight

  • Posts: 1825
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2006, 03:20:42 pm »
I have to agree that this is not what I was expecting through the post.

I wanted a Window Cleaning magazine for window cleaning not X-boxes and gym membership?

Really not sure why the need for this info? Maybe they have a secret x-box window cleaning game coming out and wanted to make sure we all have the right console to play it on?

Hate to say it but I actually think the Fed has a better publication?

oh well,

Trev
Covering Hampshire, Dorset, Surrey, Berkshire

matt

Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2006, 03:27:44 pm »
i used to get the freebie version, with bits blanked out

i guess thats not happening :(

i like my Xbox though, infact got myself a 360 a few weeks ago ;)

jeff1

  • Posts: 5855
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2006, 04:35:55 pm »


Really not sure why the need for this info? Maybe they have a secret x-box window cleaning game coming out and wanted to make sure we all have the right console to play it on?


They have its called poles & Ladders   ;D ;D

combat cleaning

  • Posts: 34
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2006, 05:24:29 pm »
Funny isn't it, with the previous issues my partner just looked at me sadly and shook her head.
As soon as a girl appears on the cover her head dives into it, and within minutes she's onto the internet for a LED blue tap light which will cost me the equivilent of a couple of houses cleaning!
She also made the remark about lady window cleaners being neglected, which is fair, however I'm not volunteering to strip off and hold a squeegee that would really sink sales.
I think we will have to see where it goes but its a good idea and if comments on the forum are noted we should see a decent mag.

Sarah Sarill

  • Posts: 1537
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #26 on: October 17, 2006, 05:41:28 pm »
She also made the remark about lady window cleaners being neglected, which is fair, however I'm not volunteering to strip off and hold a squeegee that would really sink sales.

Oh I dont know,  I see some fit w/c's locally and have always wondered why you lot dont do a charity calendar-  if I said womans institute you should get the idea.

Im sure a few strategically placed chamois' and buckets would go down a storm. ;D

Sarah
Sarah

Terry_Burrows

  • Posts: 1643
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2006, 05:52:51 pm »
big scrim needed to cover me 12 incher :o squeegee ;D
WWW.FASTESTWINDOWCLEANER.CO.UK
GUINNESS WORLD RECORD HOLDER
BURNING RUBBER FASTER!
NATIONAL FEDERATION OF MASTER WINDOW CLEANERS.

combat cleaning

  • Posts: 34
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2006, 06:10:26 pm »
Have  heard you are pretty fast with it as well Terry!

dai

  • Posts: 3503
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2006, 07:52:30 pm »
I am dissapointed with it to be honest. I want to know where are the best resin deals, insurance quotes etc. It's a bit difficult to give objective advice when you are dependent on a few advertisers isn't it?
Don't think I'll be renewing my subscription. I can learn more on here in an hour than I could in a year of the magazine. I want information not titivation. Dai

stevekennedy

  • Posts: 677
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #30 on: October 17, 2006, 09:38:32 pm »
I haven't read the magazine yet so will reserve judgement until i do. However, it must be pretty hard to fill a whole magazuseful infoine every 2 months just on window cleaning topics.

Information is the most valuable commodity you can possess. I would be quite happy paying a fiver for 20 pages if those pages give me some useful information.

If you get something helpful from it, you've recouped your £5 and some. THis has proven to be the case with the previous 6 issues.

SOme people though, don't value information. THey value entertainment. THe biggest selling magazines are not trade journals but those covering celeb marriages etc. It is because of these people that I believe PHilip has changed the format of the mag. He needs to sell more to make it a viable proposition.

Seems to me that you still get the 20 pages of useful stuff and he has merely added some extra content. I am I way off beam here?

Whether it rpoves to attract new business or alienate the existing readership remains to be seen.

Personally, I would stick with it. The magazine is still new and is constantly evolving. These comments will be read by Philip and his team and I'm sure they will be taken on board.

Trevor Knight

  • Posts: 1825
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #31 on: October 18, 2006, 07:19:01 am »

SOme people though, don't value information. THey value entertainment. THe biggest selling magazines are not trade journals but those covering celeb marriages etc. It is because of these people that I believe PHilip has changed the format of the mag. He needs to sell more to make it a viable proposition.

Seems to me that you still get the 20 pages of useful stuff and he has merely added some extra content. I am I way off beam here?

Whether it rpoves to attract new business or alienate the existing readership remains to be seen.

Personally, I would stick with it. The magazine is still new and is constantly evolving. These comments will be read by Philip and his team and I'm sure they will be taken on board.


A vaild but  misunderstood point.

The purpose of all the subscribers of this magazine isn't for light hearted irrelevant content but to find out more about the industry we work in, latest deals, updates etc.... Not to be enlightend about pc games, gadgets and gyms, we can buy FHM or Nuts or other similar editorials for that info.

An industry magazine is exactly that, INDUSTRY, subscribed to by people who are generally in that industry?

I may be wrong but I believe the majority of subscribers would agree that's why they purchase this magazine?

Trev
Covering Hampshire, Dorset, Surrey, Berkshire

stevekennedy

  • Posts: 677
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #32 on: October 18, 2006, 06:10:44 pm »
just got my copy. Yep, I must admit preferred the old style. But, I AM a complete anorak when it comes to window cleaning. Maybe there just isn't enough information about window cleaning out there to fill a bi-monthly magazine?

How about the following regular slots:

1) FINANCE Have an accountant explain how to do our books, tax advice etc a little every issue
2) SAFETY How to do risk assesments. What COSHH means, insurance regs etc. Different area every issue
3) TOOLS & TECHNOLOGY All the latest stuff and some classics. Clothing, business cards etc
4) BIOGRAPHY different person from the industry each issue
5) ADVICE How to price jobs, special techniques, advertising etc
6) LETTERS/EMAILS inc. responses and reader's responses
7) NEWS what has been happening (cleaning related)
8) USEFUL NUMBERS/CONTACTS/WEBSITES same every time but updated each issue
9) AN INDEX of all back issues under the relevant topic
10) COMPETITION win promo stuff from a supplier (free advert for them, free stuff for the reader)

Also, pay people or give a gift to people for a good story. Reader's Digest do this and they are not mugs.

All the best Phil. Give me ring if you want to discuss.

Paul Coleman

Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #33 on: October 18, 2006, 06:56:35 pm »
just got my copy. Yep, I must admit preferred the old style. But, I AM a complete anorak when it comes to window cleaning. Maybe there just isn't enough information about window cleaning out there to fill a bi-monthly magazine?

How about the following regular slots:

1) FINANCE Have an accountant explain how to do our books, tax advice etc a little every issue
2) SAFETY How to do risk assesments. What COSHH means, insurance regs etc. Different area every issue
3) TOOLS & TECHNOLOGY All the latest stuff and some classics. Clothing, business cards etc
4) BIOGRAPHY different person from the industry each issue
5) ADVICE How to price jobs, special techniques, advertising etc
6) LETTERS/EMAILS inc. responses and reader's responses
7) NEWS what has been happening (cleaning related)
8) USEFUL NUMBERS/CONTACTS/WEBSITES same every time but updated each issue
9) AN INDEX of all back issues under the relevant topic
10) COMPETITION win promo stuff from a supplier (free advert for them, free stuff for the reader)

Also, pay people or give a gift to people for a good story. Reader's Digest do this and they are not mugs.

All the best Phil. Give me ring if you want to discuss.

Now that's the best post in the thread Steve (IMO of course).  It's so easy to knock change but it's not so easy to make positive suggestions.  I definitely preferred the magazine the way it was (didn't get around to reading it till last night) but some of your suggestions are sound.
I am not going to cancel my sub because of one issue that did not meet my expectations.  I know how I felt about complaints after some of my first WFP cleans.  My thoughts were along the lines of "Hey.  Give me a break. It will come good".  Perhaps some of the guys on here may even want to contribute material for the next edition.  Hopefully Phil would print contributions that he feels are OK?  I've got a couple of ideas but am a bit busy right now.  Maybe when the working day shortens appreciably I will have some time to knuckle down to it.
Are you up for receiving contributions eventually Phil?

Sarah Sarill

  • Posts: 1537
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #34 on: October 19, 2006, 08:27:25 am »
You have made a few good suggestions Steve, although why the consumer has to give the publisher ideas is beyond me.  Surely that it the publishers job - find a market, source its requirements and fullfill those needs.

I assume that PWC had done its market research before this radical re-vamp ?. 

For the sake of its future, I hope that Ionics and the editor take on board your suggestions Steve and listen to what we the consumer want from the Magazine.   The old version was far better and yes it could have been improved and updated but IMHO its has now lost its credibility in the w/c marketpace.

Sarah
Sarah

*foxman

  • Posts: 250
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #35 on: October 19, 2006, 12:00:33 pm »
A success story each month would be a winner. How some one got from a ladder and bucket to a fleet of vans, etc. They are always a good read.

Philip Hanson

  • Posts: 652
Re: new look pwc mag New
« Reply #36 on: October 19, 2006, 04:14:43 pm »
Hello

May I thank everyone who has taken the time to respond to this thread, I knew that Issue 8 of PWC would provoke some discussion, but I must admit to being surprised (pleasantly) by just how much!

Firstly, I should say that I very much welcome all of your comments, both negative and positive.  I constantly ask for feedback on the magazine, I created a space on the PWC website for just that function.  I also set up the email account feedback@profe... so that readers would be able to easily give me their comments.

The reason I did this, is because I am not afraid of criticism, in fact I positively want it.  Its my opinion that some organizations in the window cleaning industry have become stagnant because they don't listen to criticism, and I hope the magazine never becomes like that.  Criticism, when its constructive, is what lets you know if you're doing things right... or not. 

I'm not the least bit offended by the comments of readers, rather I'm actually rather taken aback by the depth of feeling about the magazine.  Its now clearer than ever to me that PWC readers really do care about the mag, and quite honestly, knowing that makes me feel that my effort over the last year has been worthwhile.  PWC readers have a right to express their opinion about their magazine, and I am genuinely grateful when they do.

So, to the matter in hand: Why the change of style for PWC?
Although I ask for feedback, for a number of reasons it's quite difficult to get.  Most people don't take it upon themselves to criticise a person, an organization, or a product directly and that's probably just a British thing.  For the second year of publication, I wanted to do things a little differently, a fresh approach, a broader appeal.  I selected a focus group from among window cleaners, both subscribers and non-subscribers, and over the course of a few weeks, got some in-depth feedback about what they thought of PWC.

The comments I got were that the magazine was "very professional" which was good, but also the feeling that the style of PWC was just a little bit "highbrow", even (dare I say it) stuffy?  It became obvious that readers found the magazine useful, but was it really enjoyable?  Was it too serious?  The feeling was that perhaps it was.

I spent a long time looking into ways that I could broaden the appeal of the magazine, to take it forward.  I decided it should be physically a better quality magazine, and I hope the fact that it has  grown from 36 pages to 52, and also that the paper is a higher quality stock has not gone unnoticed.  The layout of the pages has also been revised, and this has been no small effort.

But the real challenge was the content, and in many ways this is something you can't really know how its gone down until it's 'out there'.  Now it is in print, and the full picture of what readers think will emerge.  The point is, now readers have something to compare against.  Even if the new style proves to be unpopular, I can say with my hand on my heart that I was not afraid to try something new, and that has got to be a good thing.

Subscribers to the magazine are in some ways, a special group (and a very valued one).  Like window cleaners who tend to post on forums, a window cleaner who subscribes to a window cleaning magazine is serious about their business, and about their trade.

What, though, about the average window cleaner who doesn't use forums, isn’t a member of any association, and doesn't bother with trade shows?  I think its fair to say that would describe by far the vast majority of window cleaners.  How many times have you spoken to a window cleaner in your neighbourhood who hasn't even heard of WFP, the work at height regs, ladder safety?  Plenty I would guess, because that is what most of the window cleaning industry is like.  We always complain that window cleaners have a poor public image, and that's not for no reason.

It is important to me that the magazine appeals to these window cleaners as well.  After all, I started the magazine with the purpose of improving information in the industry as a whole, but if that information isn't presented in a way that is appealing, then it won't be read. 

I think that most here are business owners, and you are no doubt very interested in the issues surrounding equipment, safety, best practice etc.  But what about employees?  Will they be as interested as you would be in those things?  They might, but only if the information is presented in a way they that takes their interest.

continued...
Editor, Professional Window Cleaner Magazine

"The irony of the information age is that it has given new respectability to uninformed opinion"
John Lawton

Philip Hanson

  • Posts: 652
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #37 on: October 19, 2006, 04:15:08 pm »
...continued

It might be your opinion that perhaps this issue of the magazine was too far one-way, perhaps not.  But whatever you think, I'm interested to know.

Because the magazine's style is so different, I have set up a page on the PWC website to get feedback on just this new style.  Its the form of a questionnaire, and in addition to the online version, I'll be sending paper copies to all subscribers in the next few days.

http://www.professionalwindowcleaner.co.uk/survey.html

If you read the magazine, whether you're a subscriber or get a copy from one of our stockists, please do take the time to complete the questionnaire.  I'll be compiling the results and publishing them, and the reaction of readers will directly determine how the magazine will go in future issues.

The discussion on the forum so far has been lively, and Issue 8 has certainly provoked more interest than almost any other issue.  Many here have supported the magazine since its very beginning, and although the feedback on this thread has been a little one-sided, what has also transpired is that this latest issue has clearly appealed to a whole new group of window cleaners who would perhaps never have read a window cleaning magazine otherwise.  The difficulty now is striking the correct balance, but that is always going to be a challenge.

In conclusion then, this is a very interesting and important time for PWC Magazine, and I would like the opportunity to deal with your feedback properly.  Please take a moment to complete the questionnaire, and don't be polite, be honest!

-Philip
Editor, Professional Window Cleaner Magazine

"The irony of the information age is that it has given new respectability to uninformed opinion"
John Lawton

Sarah Sarill

  • Posts: 1537
Re: new look pwc mag
« Reply #38 on: October 19, 2006, 04:38:49 pm »
Questionnaire completed Philip.

Sarah
Sarah