[matty72]

got new van insurance today, done the usual call to Aplan £400, went and tried gladiator like some of you suggested got it for 350, so cheers.

[AuRavelling79]

got new van insurance today, done the usual call to Aplan £400, went and tried gladiator like some of you suggested got it for 350, so cheers.

Well done.

Anyone else having success?

[DaveG]

Anyone with Alexander Swan? Been with them years but they're not insuring self build van systems  going forward 

[The Jester of Wibbly]

Interesting thread.

I got a quote from Gladiators a few years back, and when I got details through there was no mention of the water tank.  I called them to check and they confirmed over the phone the quote includes the tank.  However they refused to put it in writing.   That would leave me without any proof of tank being covered which is dangerous.

Be careful you check your paperwork.

[EandM]

Interesting thread.

I got a quote from Gladiators a few years back, and when I got details through there was no mention of the water tank.  I called them to check and they confirmed over the phone the quote includes the tank.  However they refused to put it in writing.   That would leave me without any proof of tank being covered which is dangerous.

Be careful you check your paperwork.

I've been with them for years and clearly have water tank and other mods on the paperwork.
An oversight perhaps?

[Simon Trapani]

I thought Gladiator were just a broker?

[The Jester of Wibbly]

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=207649.msg1842758#msg1842758

It got discussed about the lack of paperwork proof in this thread, but it was a few years back, (including my experience).

[matty72]

I did a quote with gladiator online without a water tank, I think price came in at 240 from memory, so the tank added about 100.

[EandM]

I thought Gladiator were just a broker?

They are.
Very good at providing insurance for what you actually need and not what someone is trying to sell you.

I've been through quotes with them in the past and they've tried different underwriters live, until we found one that would cover what I needed.

Very good so far.

[EandM]

I did a quote with gladiator online without a water tank, I think price came in at 240 from memory, so the tank added about 100.

Mine didn't seem to make any difference but both the trucks and myself are quite old and we all live in the country.

[JandS]

Mine went from £450 last year to £800 this year just because I decided to declare the tank.........Alexander Swann got me the cheapest quote just beating CTM  quote......will be shopping around next time again though.......have 3 points for speeding and a no claim claim as well.......guy backed out of parking space as I was backing up and hit side of van......insurance said it was 50/50 when I tried to claim so no pay out but a claim on my insurance record.

[Pete Thompson]

Anyone with Alexander Swan? Been with them years but they're not insuring self build van systems  going forward 

Good.

Hopefully all other insurers will follow suit.

Death traps.

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

Anyone with Alexander Swan? Been with them years but they're not insuring self build van systems  going forward 

Good.

Hopefully all other insurers will follow suit.

Death traps.

Any evidence for this ridiculous post?🥱

[tlwcs]

Anyone with Alexander Swan? Been with them years but they're not insuring self build van systems  going forward 

Good.

Hopefully all other insurers will follow suit.

Death traps.

Any evidence for this ridiculous post?🥱

Drunk?

[Pete Thompson]

Anyone with Alexander Swan? Been with them years but they're not insuring self build van systems  going forward 

Good.

Hopefully all other insurers will follow suit.

Death traps.

Any evidence for this ridiculous post?🥱

You should explain to the family of this deceased young man how ridiculous their grief is:

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=210402.0

Or there’s this one:

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/van-driver-dies-collision-closed-26376655

Now look at the results of the HSE investigation that followed:

https://resources.hse.gov.uk/notices/notices/notice_details.asp?SF=CN&SV=313300565

Notice the particular wording of the EIGHT separate immediate prohibition notices that were issued (one for each van that the company operated):

“ Prohibition Notice 313300592 issued as the carrying of a water tank in the vehicle with registration number plate HJ10NVX without suitable and sufficient means of securing the tank will involve a risk of serious personal injury. The inadequately secured tank may move in transit and collide with or crush persons travelling within the vehicle.”

In my opinion, it won’t be long before all insurance companies refuse to insure home-made tank-in-a-van window cleaners.

They are dangerous and have killed people.

[AuRavelling79]

My home fitted system has had a crash with me in it with a full tank and nothing moved or was distorted.

I estimate point of contact was 20 mph and the vehicle I hit had pulled out in front of me and got pushed about half a metre by the impact staving in its passenger side front door, front wing and side pillar.

My van front was smashed back to the radiators (punctured) and bonnet creased.

My tank (which is strapped with 2 x 5 tonne lorry straps triple wound to a welded frame, the back of which is a 6" L shaped girder bolted through the floor with plates underneath) is a Wyedale 650L.

The tank is against the factory fitted bulkhead.

After the crash the tank had not visibly moved and there was no distortion evident.

When I put the van back on the road the insurer (who had written it off on value) said it needed to have a brand new MOT before being allowed on the road.

It passed and is still being used by me.

Now ... looking at Pete Thompson's post highlighting the HSE and the poor lad crushed by his tank.

Looking at the registrations of Teeside window cleaners vans served prohibition notice they were all vans in the 10/20 year old range. I would opine that a commercial operator running eight vans all of this age would be 'on the radar.'

It was that the tanks were unsafely being used - there is no detail as to whether there was an attempt to secure them and if so what and by whom.

I have seen a transit with a 1000L unbaffled caged storage tank in the back with no visible straps. Mental.

I know of others where the owner has had gone to great care to get a cage made and fitted and then bolted in by a local garage with keeper plates.

The fact that in twenty years of window cleaning with wfp that tank crush deaths are incredibly small in number means to me that it is a vanishingly small issue. (But I would throw the book at cavalier business owners who put lives at risk by not risk assessing how their tanks are installed and going for the cheapest option.)

Probably in the same league as touching an overhead power cable and with fewer injuries or deaths.

If self installing take care to remember that half a tonne of water needs properly securing. The forces in a crash are exponential to the speed and weight.

This does not mean a conscientious owner cannot do a secure job. Even more so if they have staff.

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

My home fitted system has had a crash with me in it with a full tank and nothing moved or was distorted.

I estimate point of contact was 20 mph and the vehicle I hit had pulled out in front of me and got pushed about half a metre by the impact staving in its passenger side front door, front wing and side pillar.

My van front was smashed back to the radiators (punctured) and bonnet creased.

My tank (which is strapped with 2 x 5 tonne lorry straps triple wound to a welded frame, the back of which is a 6" L shaped girder bolted through the floor with plates underneath) is a Wyedale 650L.

The tank is against the factory fitted bulkhead.

After the crash the tank had not visibly moved and there was no distortion evident.

When I put the van back on the road the insurer (who had written it off on value) said it needed to have a brand new MOT before being allowed on the road.

It passed and is still being used by me.

Now ... looking at Pete Thompson's post highlighting the HSE and the poor lad crushed by his tank.

Looking at the registrations of Teeside window cleaners vans served prohibition notice they were all vans in the 10/20 year old range. I would opine that a commercial operator running eight vans all of this age would be 'on the radar.'

It was that the tanks were unsafely being used - there is no detail as to whether there was an attempt to secure them and if so what and by whom.

I have seen a transit with a 1000L unbaffled caged storage tank in the back with no visible straps. Mental.

I know of others where the owner has had gone to great care to get a cage made and fitted and then bolted in by a local garage with keeper plates.

The fact that in twenty years of window cleaning with wfp that tank crush deaths are incredibly small in number means to me that it is a vanishingly small issue. (But I would throw the book at cavalier business owners who put lives at risk by not risk assessing how their tanks are installed and going for the cheapest option.)

Probably in the same league as touching an overhead power cable and with fewer injuries or deaths.

If self installing take care to remember that half a tonne of water needs properly securing. The forces in a crash are exponential to the speed and weight.

This does not mean a conscientious owner cannot do a secure job. Even more so if they have staff.

Good post, saved me writing it.🙂👍

[Stoots]

Bit different to having one in your own van as a sole operator to having them with employees in.

Im perfectly happy to risk my own life as im confident the way mine is secured is sufficent but i wouldnt want the worry of it killing an employee and me being liable.

Wonder if the Modded owner chap from teeside window cleaning got done for it 

[AuRavelling79]

Bit different to having one in your own van as a sole operator to having them with employees in.

Im perfectly happy to risk my own life as im confident the way mine is secured is sufficent but i wouldnt want the worry of it killing an employee and me being liable.

Wonder if the Modded owner chap from teeside window cleaning got done for it 

Well scouting round the interweb it seems the other vans were served prohibition notices for the way the tanks were put in.

If the accident is as has been suggested/described it looks like a Citroen pulled out and the Van hit but slewed off into a field. To me that would indicate that the van didn't come to an abrupt halt; but IF it turned over or hit something else to stop it abruptly and the tank wasn't strapped/bolted down properly and/or IF there was no bulkhead then it MIGHT have broken free and smashed into the cab area.

A lot of conjecture.

I would be happy to self install (as in get a frame made up by a welder/blacksmith with bolt holes and correct plates for the underside).

Now a question is asked of GrassRootsMotorsports Magazine here about self installing an antiroll bar into your car for motorsports and here are the instructions.

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/how-install-bolt-roll-bar/#:~:text=Roll%20bars%20can%20be%20welded,of%20removal%20in%20the%20future.

So to me if a competent D-i-Y'er is allowed to arrange for such in a competition I see no difference in principle to installing a tank.

I accept different insurers choose different criteria and I hope that the incident in the north-east, while tragic doesn't stop a conscientious business owner arranging for his own tanks to be installed.

[Splash and dash]

Anyone with Alexander Swan? Been with them years but they're not insuring self build van systems  going forward 

Good.

Hopefully all other insurers will follow suit.

Death traps.

Any evidence for this ridiculous post?🥱

You should explain to the family of this deceased young man how ridiculous their grief is:

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=210402.0

Or there’s this one:

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/van-driver-dies-collision-closed-26376655

Now look at the results of the HSE investigation that followed:

https://resources.hse.gov.uk/notices/notices/notice_details.asp?SF=CN&SV=313300565

Notice the particular wording of the EIGHT separate immediate prohibition notices that were issued (one for each van that the company operated):

“ Prohibition Notice 313300592 issued as the carrying of a water tank in the vehicle with registration number plate HJ10NVX without suitable and sufficient means of securing the tank will involve a risk of serious personal injury. The inadequately secured tank may move in transit and collide with or crush persons travelling within the vehicle.”

In my opinion, it won’t be long before all insurance companies refuse to insure home-made tank-in-a-van window cleaners.

They are dangerous and have killed people.

Well said I totally agree 👍