[NWH]

I’m sure I’ve missed out countless other things an employer would have to pay for when having just 3 employees 1 being a premises that is able to supply water for 3 people every day,maybe this is why people go down the hard to control franchise route because the above example doesn’t look very appealing to me.

[Smudger]

You have 3 vans out that do 300 each and you take 50% say after fuel and wages but not vehicle repairs and the need to pay for resin-poles and all else that goes with it,here’s the thing you can easily go out and do 4-450 on your own you don’t have multiple van insurance holiday pay etc X 3 as well as the above,
How does this work do you make money from it or am I missing something on top of what you’d make on you’re own,is their money in it or does it just give someone the opportunity to say yeah but mine is a business because I have a few vans and employees,just a thought.

if only they earn as little as that a day !

The point is Nigel the mind set to running with staff is different from a sole trader - all you see is money lost - I see more work and money gained + I don't have to clean anything either... 

We don't just do windows - when doing roof cleaning the guys are bringing in 5x what windows do

Darran

[Mike Burd]

You have 3 vans out that do 300 each and you take 50% say after fuel and wages but not vehicle repairs and the need to pay for resin-poles and all else that goes with it,here’s the thing you can easily go out and do 4-450 on your own you don’t have multiple van insurance holiday pay etc X 3 as well as the above,
How does this work do you make money from it or am I missing something on top of what you’d make on you’re own,is their money in it or does it just give someone the opportunity to say yeah but mine is a business because I have a few vans and employees,just a thought.

Essentially you are correct. However, the OP will be able to get ill now and still have income.

[NWH]

Then I would say it would be a lot less hassle to have insurance cover for the above rather than having the hassle I suggested.

[Mike Burd]

Then I would say it would be a lot less hassle to have insurance cover for the above rather than having the hassle I suggested.

Hmmm. Not sure about that. I’ve always understood those policies aren’t great but I’m not an expert.

[KS Cleaning]

You have 3 vans out that do 300 each and you take 50% say after fuel and wages but not vehicle repairs and the need to pay for resin-poles and all else that goes with it,here’s the thing you can easily go out and do 4-450 on your own you don’t have multiple van insurance holiday pay etc X 3 as well as the above,
How does this work do you make money from it or am I missing something on top of what you’d make on you’re own,is their money in it or does it just give someone the opportunity to say yeah but mine is a business because I have a few vans and employees,just a thought.

if only they earn as little as that a day !

The point is Nigel the mind set to running with staff is different from a sole trader - all you see is money lost - I see more work and money gained + I don't have to clean anything either... 

We don't just do windows - when doing roof cleaning the guys are bringing in 5x what windows do

Darran

A common theme on here, you’re  getting mixed up with sole trader and one man band, a sole trader can have employees😉

[Smudger]

I stand corrected - but for purposes of being polite I didn't want to use the term "One Man Band" ( or woman/ uno binary )

Darran

[NWH]

Nothing wrong with 1 man bands when you start getting the calculator out and comparing it to 2-3-4 man bands,the truth is if you come off the tools you need to be doing big numbers to cover all costs and be anywhere near to what you need-want get out of it money wise.
Without trying to be negative on this topic if you earn very well when you are still small it can make it seem more difficult when trying to expand,you would expect or need each van to be returning very similar numbers to you  or in you’re head you are going backwards.
Bare in mind an employee won’t put the effort in you would and 4 weeks holiday and a week average on sick days would need to be taken into account with lost income,the futures bright the futures brown 🤣🤣🤣

[Smudger]

your lol'ing at your non coheirant post again Nigel

As said it might be going back in your mind but that says more about you than anything else.....

Darran

[NWH]

Obviously thought provoking I would think if I had to bet quiet a few people may agree with me,maybe not who knows everyone’s position and expectations are different depending on what they can do on average on a daily basis.

[NWH]

I think someone was saying they could do 4-450 on their own yet with help only managing an extra 100,even if you put them on their own bare in mind they won’t be as keen to knock out work like you do even with incentives it’ll soon lag costs will have to be counted in with a van etc.
After wages and running costs per day that extra 100 -150 working with you won’t be far off what you’ll still end up with as an employer,am I missing something again.

[Richard iSparkle]

I think someone was saying they could do 4-450 on their own yet with help only managing an extra 100,even if you put them on their own bare in mind they won’t be as keen to knock out work like you do even with incentives it’ll soon lag costs will have to be counted in with a van etc.
After wages and running costs per day that extra 100 -150 working with you won’t be far off what you’ll still end up with as an employer,am I missing something again.

So your response to someone asking ‘how to get off the glass’ should have been …

‘I don’t know. I haven’t managed to do that successfully myself. When I tried it was too hard for me and I couldn’t work out how to make enough money to make it worthwhile’

Or alternatively, you could have read the title and thought … huh… maybe this will be an interesting topic for me to watch and maybe learn something from. But I don’t have anything useful to add so I won’t say anything 🤔’

[Smudger]

Well said that man

Nigel - yes someone did post that but in the context that the employee is very slow - you have scooped this up as gospel that all staff in all companies work to this level - that’s not the case and if you read the other thread properly instead of huffing and puffing about your limited perceptions then you would have seen many good posts

Try not to concentrate on negatives all the time

Darran

[NWH]

I’ll try that Dazza it’s not very nice when someone just picks the odd comment out and jumps on it 👍

[Smudger]

I’ll try that Dazza it’s not very nice when someone just picks the odd comment out and jumps on it 👍

but that's what YOU do all the time i'm afraid.......

Darran

[supernova77]

Here’s a question:

If you had 3 vans out (3 staff)  turning over at least £300 a day each 46 weeks of the year (which takes holidays / sickness into consideration) and were flat rate VAT registered - would it make you money without having to do any of the manual work yourself?

[NWH]

Put it this way it wouldn’t be worth the trouble for what you’d get out of it financially,don’t forget it won’t be 900 a day coming in every week of the year it just doesn’t work like that in this job.
The franchise model may work better financially but you have no control over how it’s run day to day really in reality,you could start off with a very good name in a business franchise it and watch its reputation dwindle overnight almost.

[Mike Burd]

Here’s a question:

If you had 3 vans out (3 staff)  turning over at least £300 a day each 46 weeks of the year (which takes holidays / sickness into consideration) and were flat rate VAT registered - would it make you money without having to do any of the manual work yourself?

Barely. Without going into actual daily figures, my friend who has a solid round at the VAT limit was earning more than me until I got to 5/6 vans. Each van does about the same a day as he does, but he has a paid off van and based at home. But he has a really solid one man business with very little outgoings - fuel, insurance and consumables.

[High-Tower]

Here’s a question:

If you had 3 vans out (3 staff)  turning over at least £300 a day each 46 weeks of the year (which takes holidays / sickness into consideration) and were flat rate VAT registered - would it make you money without having to do any of the manual work yourself?

Of course it would.
£900 x 230 = £207k
£207k - 16.5% = £173k
- 3x £25k wages
- 3x £15k expenses
= £53k

But the investment in 3 vans and filling them up with work would be considerable. Keeping 2,000 or so customers organised would be no small task, and managing 3 members of staff as well.
My expenses wouldn’t allow a lot for ongoing marketing, you might need to replace 2-400 customers a year.
Trouble with staff or a blown up van could see you  left with only £30-40k, and most people would be able to make that kind of money on their own in fairly short hours without any major hassle.
 

[supernova77]

Here’s a question:

If you had 3 vans out (3 staff)  turning over at least £300 a day each 46 weeks of the year (which takes holidays / sickness into consideration) and were flat rate VAT registered - would it make you money without having to do any of the manual work yourself?

Of course it would.
£900 x 230 = £207k
£207k - 16.5% = £173k
- 3x £25k wages
- 3x £15k expenses
= £53k

But the investment in 3 vans and filling them up with work would be considerable. Keeping 2,000 or so customers organised would be no small task, and managing 3 members of staff as well.
My expenses wouldn’t allow a lot for ongoing marketing, you might need to replace 2-400 customers a year.
Trouble with staff or a blown up van could see you  left with only £30-40k, and most people would be able to make that kind of money on their own in fairly short hours without any major hassle.
 

But if you wanted to get “off the glass” that’s what you’d need to be looking at minimum 👍