[Stoots]

I wish they would stop it with these grants.

I was annoyed that i couldnt get the first one.

Now its taking the p, 4 grants or whatever i could have had, missed out on thousands because i was Ltd.

You fecking leeches i hope you choke on it.
 

[G Griffin]

Is there any more money we can claim at the moment since that last self employment grant back in the summer? If so anyone have any links on where to claim. If there aren't any going at the moment any idea if there will be any rolling out before the end of the year?  Have they tightend up any rules on who can claim on the new grants or is it the same as before just give them your tax reference number and bank account details you want your money transferred into?

You should have been contacted by HMRC asking if you wanted to claim.  We’re you contacted? The deadline for the last one was 19/10/2020. I didn’t claim as I wasn’t adversely affected.  Future grants? That may change in the coming months though as I’ve started to lose some due to financial reasons.

No I wasn't contacted by HMRC I claimed the first one and would claim anymore that are going I'll make sure I don't miss the Nov date unless changes are made.

You should have had an email if you claimed the first one. I don't know if you can do anything about that now.
I don't know anything about the subsequent grants and I'm hoping that I won't need them. I'll try and have a look if I get the chance but this could go on well into next year. The government will have to pay us if we can't work because of the virus.
That's one of the reasons they take our money in the first place.
I've spoken to a few people that didn't claim because they couldn't be bothered or because they didn't think that they needed it.
It's our money; not the government's.

[zesty]

It’s not really our money Griffin.

Hence why the government is building up astronomical debt.

Our economy no where near covers the amount of help we’re receiving.

You sound like a socialist?

Now I’m not suggesting we don’t take the grants, but I am expecting the country to pay over and above what we have been paying in taxes for many many years to come, to repay the debt.

My advice to anyone adversely affected is to take the grant, absolutely. But I would never suggest it’s ‘our money’ when it isn’t.

‘Our money’ doesn’t even cover the running of our country in good times, let alone during this pandemic.

This is the problem, no one wants to pay high taxes, but we still want a first class country with social benefits and the streets swept. Fact is, that all takes money, and we don’t cover it as a nation. Hence, BIG DEBT.

At least that insane man Corbyn didn’t get in. The country would be bankrupt within months.

We’ve had a taste of socialism during this pandemic, and we’re finding out (as expected) that it always, without exception, leads to huge national debt, amongst job losses and unemployment. Granted the job losses are due to the virus, but socialism has a similar effect, albeit slightly slower.

[Arnold Palmer]

It’s not really our money Griffin.

Hence why the government is building up astronomical debt.

Our economy no where near covers the amount of help we’re receiving.

You sound like a socialist?

Now I’m not suggesting we don’t take the grants, but I am expecting the country to pay over and above what we have been paying in taxes for many many years to come, to repay the debt.

My advice to anyone adversely affected is to take the grant, absolutely. But I would never suggest it’s ‘our money’ when it isn’t.

‘Our money’ doesn’t even cover the running of our country in good times, let alone during this pandemic.

This is the problem, no one wants to pay high taxes, but we still want a first class country with social benefits and the streets swept. Fact is, that all takes money, and we don’t cover it as a nation. Hence, BIG DEBT.

At least that insane man Corbyn didn’t get in. The country would be bankrupt within months.

We’ve had a taste of socialism during this pandemic, and we’re finding out (as expected) that it always, without exception, leads to huge national debt, amongst job losses and unemployment. Granted the job losses are due to the virus, but socialism has a similar effect, albeit slightly slower.

Only read the first line.

[G Griffin]

It is our money. We give the government the money and they spend it on us. Where do you think that they get the money from?
I am a socialist. It's not about paying high taxes, it's about a lot of wealthy people paying low or even no taxes. Some pay lower rates than those on minimum wage.
We have a taste of socialism every day and you can't just dismiss that when it suits. Break your leg and get treated at A&E without taking out your wallet. That's socialism.
The debt comes when not everyone pays in and I'm not talking about cash in hand window cleaners.

[zesty]

No it’s not mate.

No one is paying that much tax to cover the grants they are receiving.

So it’s not your money. It’s borrowed money.

Socialism never works, ever. Never has, never will. It’s a flawed concept for dreamers.

Thankfully there aren’t many socialist nutters like you about. That was proven by corbyns massive defeat.

Show me a socialist country and I’ll show you poverty.

Don’t go claiming the Nordic model is socialist by the way, bevsuse it absolutely isn’t.

When I visited Ukraine last December, the locals were utterly shocked to hear that people like you exist in the U.K. They just could not believe people in the U.K. even begin to entertain the idea of socialism. They know all too well how disastrous it is.

If it was your money, the government wouldn’t be in debt. Your tax doesn’t even cover the street sweeper and light outside your house. Let alone a £7k grant.


Bottom line, your tax isn’t paid so you can receive a grant every few months. There for, it’s not ‘your money’.

[G Griffin]

No it’s not mate.

No one is paying that much tax to cover the grants they are receiving.

So it’s not your money. It’s borrowed money.

Socialism never works, ever. Never has, never will. It’s a flawed concept for dreamers.

Thankfully there aren’t many socialist nutters like you about. That was proven by corbyns massive defeat.

Show me a socialist country and I’ll show you poverty.

Don’t go claiming the Nordic model is socialist by the way, bevsuse it absolutely isn’t.

When I visited Ukraine last December, the locals were utterly shocked to hear that people like you exist in the U.K. They just could not believe people in the U.K. even begin to entertain the idea of socialism. They know all too well how disastrous it is.

If it was your money, the government wouldn’t be in debt. Your tax doesn’t even cover the street sweeper and light outside your house. Let alone a £7k grant.


Bottom line, your tax isn’t paid so you can receive a grant every few months. There for, it’s not ‘your money’.

So capitalism isn't working either? The government are continually borrowing with no way of paying it back?
Look at the poverty in America, as well.

Socialism never works? You claimed the grant, didn't you? You use the NHS, I presume?

I'm more of a socialist than I am a capitalist. Am I 100% socialist? No, because I'm part of the free market as a window cleaner.
The same as you not being 100% capitalist because you're willing to accept state aid and use state funded services.
I'm in favour of a free market with government intervention, some nationalisation and a decent welfare state.
Germany isn't doing too badly.

So come on then, where is the government's money coming from and who is prepared to continually bankroll the country?

[zesty]

Paying taxes under capitalism is the best of a flawed bunch of systems.

Paying taxes for some state benefits isn’t socialism.

Socialism is evil. It’s dire. It never works. It Always increases poverty. It always increases the size of the government, and decreases the citizen.

I’d take capitalism every day of the week. It’s far fairer.

Only self entitled, lazy people want pure socialism.


And Yes, I’ve no problem with people taking the grant, my problem is people claiming they are ‘owed’ it. We’re not owed anything. It’s not our money, it’s incredible that we have a government that’s helping in this way. But it’s all got to be paid back. Hence the dark side of socialism. High taxes = job losses and poverty.

Just look at California. People fleeing by the droves due to high taxes, socialist style policy, and spiralling living costs.

[G Griffin]

How can an economic philosophy be evil?

[zesty]

How can an economic philosophy be evil?

Of course it can.

To steal people’s Money to give people free stuff is wrong.

And no that’s not the NHS, schools etc. I’m talking real socialism. It steals.

Why would you want bigger government control? All it does is decrease your freedom.

Again, show me a socialist country and I’ll show you unhappiness, unemployment, control, poverty and economic ruin.

Go and visit Ukraine, like I did. They will help you with your love for socialism Griff. They know a thing or two about it.

It never works, it brings death, decay and decline. It is an evil system.

Capitalism brings economic prosperity that can be in part, be shared with the nation.

Socialism is like a leech, eventually you run out of blood money.

Do you still think the grant money is our money? Is that how a socialist thinks? Even after being explained it clearly isn’t. It’s debt. So to claim ‘it’s our money’ is part of the problem, socialists have a sense of entitlement. It’s wrong.


A quick history lesson for you:

Socialism failed in:

Germany
The Soviet Union
 Cambodia
 Cuba
 China
 Vietnam
North Korea
 Romania
 Venezuela

So why do you think it will work in the U.K.? The reason you think it will work is the same reason every other country thinks it will work - ‘we’ll do it differently’. 

[G Griffin]

So you start explaining  that an economic philosophy can be evil by saying that it steals peoples' money?
You just made that up.

You also said that socialism failed in China. How are you measuring failure? To me, the Chinese economy seems to be doing ok, at the moment. They're in the top two in the world for GDP.
Germany? They're doing ok with their social market economy. They're top in Europe for GDP.
Vietnam are doing ok, too. They had 'maybe' the fastest growing economy in the world a few years ago.

[Arnold Palmer]

So you start explaining  that an economic philosophy can be evil by saying that it steals peoples' money?
You just made that up.

You also said that socialism failed in China. How are you measuring failure? To me, the Chinese economy seems to be doing ok, at the moment. They're in the top two in the world for GDP.
Germany? They're doing ok with their social market economy. They're top in Europe for GDP.
Vietnam are doing ok, too. They had 'maybe' the fastest growing economy in the world a few years ago.

And all of them have covid under control.

[Shrek]

So you start explaining  that an economic philosophy can be evil by saying that it steals peoples' money?
You just made that up.

You also said that socialism failed in China. How are you measuring failure? To me, the Chinese economy seems to be doing ok, at the moment. They're in the top two in the world for GDP.
Germany? They're doing ok with their social market economy. They're top in Europe for GDP.
Vietnam are doing ok, too. They had 'maybe' the fastest growing economy in the world a few years ago.

And all of them have covid under control.

Lol

[G Griffin]

So you start explaining  that an economic philosophy can be evil by saying that it steals peoples' money?
You just made that up.

You also said that socialism failed in China. How are you measuring failure? To me, the Chinese economy seems to be doing ok, at the moment. They're in the top two in the world for GDP.
Germany? They're doing ok with their social market economy. They're top in Europe for GDP.
Vietnam are doing ok, too. They had 'maybe' the fastest growing economy in the world a few years ago.

And all of them have covid under control.

Aye and who has the most deaths?
And look at our figures with a PM that has to redefine child poverty.

[zesty]

You need to look at history griff. Germany is no longer socialist.

You are ignorant. Do the research, or, go and live in Venezuela, that’ll give you a taste of modern socialism!

A few vids that might help you:

https://youtu.be/bKhR9i5CGkA

https://youtu.be/Fdfru9NHGvE

https://youtu.be/CCIdm3cM6zQ

Oh, and if you trust China with Covid, you’re very slightly mad.

Go and live there, the biggest surveillance state in the world, less freedom and huge poverty. It baffles my mind that people in this country would put China on some kind of pedestal. Have you seen there human rights record? I’m amazed at the unbelievable ignorance of some of you socialist dreamers.

[Arnold Palmer]

You need to look at history griff. Germany is no longer socialist.

You are ignorant. Do the research, or, go and live in Venezuela, that’ll give you a taste of modern socialism!

A few vids that might help you:

https://youtu.be/bKhR9i5CGkA

https://youtu.be/Fdfru9NHGvE

https://youtu.be/CCIdm3cM6zQ

Oh, and if you trust China with Covid, you’re very slightly mad.

Go and live there, the biggest surveillance state in the world, less freedom and huge poverty. It baffles my mind that people in this country would put China on some kind of pedestal. Have you seen there human rights record? I’m amazed at the unbelievable ignorance of some of you socialist dreamers.

Lol

[zesty]

You can’t win arguments against dreamers, the good news is, the nation is mainly capitalist, hence corbyns massive defeat.

Thankfully griff and soupy, you’re the minority. Feel free to move to a socialist country.

Interesting when I speak to customers about this subject, some were socialist untill they got a job and house. They very quickly become capitalist.

This is why socialism is so popular among youth. I never imagined seasoned window cleaners would want socialism. Capitalism is the reason us window cleaners are so successful.

This is my last post on this thread, again, you can’t argue against utopian dreamers. Please go and visit a former socialist country both of you.

And watch the videos, they’re easy to understand. You can’t argue against the simple truth.

[G Griffin]

You need to look at history griff. Germany is no longer socialist.

You are ignorant. Do the research, or, go and live in Venezuela, that’ll give you a taste of modern socialism!

A few vids that might help you:

https://youtu.be/bKhR9i5CGkA

https://youtu.be/Fdfru9NHGvE

https://youtu.be/CCIdm3cM6zQ

Oh, and if you trust China with Covid, you’re very slightly mad.

Go and live there, the biggest surveillance state in the world, less freedom and huge poverty. It baffles my mind that people in this country would put China on some kind of pedestal. Have you seen there human rights record? I’m amazed at the unbelievable ignorance of some of you socialist dreamers.

You mentioned Germany. I'm not 100% socialist, I've told you. Very few countries are.
Germany has a social market economy with a good social welfare system. Some of it from the private sector.

You're emotionally spouting about China and Venezuela because I want a better health and welfare system and more public control of essential services.
There is a balance.

[NWH]

Don’t waste your time worrying about it if you lived another 10 lifetimes you wouldn’t change a thing,I find it easier when I’m just concerned what’s going on in my bubble because I can change what’s happening in there.

[jo5hm4n]

Anyone got any popcorn they can share with me?  I ran out and this is entertaining i need popcorn!