[Dry Clean]

My take on it is this....

those that have spent (shall I say a large amount - seeing as they are a bit prickly) on a hot water system have, on every occasion made it clear that any other form of producing hot is not only as good at cleaning as 'their' hot water but is either dangerous or done because those who choose other methods are some way a second class business.

If your circumstances are such you wish to buy a system there's no problem with that - but the benefits of hot are NOT massive they are marginal - definitely a would like to have as opposed to I need to have. they are more about making the job comfortable than cleaning better  ( I have run various tests and time trials )

There is no way the investment in a heated system from grippa etc.. pays for itself within 8 years never mind 3 years so as a business decision it makes no sense - for a single operator possibly. But p&f is doing something fantastic - taking an air heater and turning it into an on demand water heater for what is a more attractive cost (lets face it the 'Webasto' systems are just a glorified conversion job.

Darran

i reckon i shave around 30 mins off my day using hot water compared to cold water cleaning...ok its not a huge amount but over the course of 8 years it is...on an average of 2 hours a week saved (on a 46 week year) its 736 hours over 8 years which is over a full months work(working day and night! )....

That's absolute nonsense, there will be days when I can knock an hour of the exact same work and other days can add an hour without seeming to do anything more, in other words there's no way you have got your cleaning to the point where you can time it day in day out to the nearest half hour, like I keep saying you guys should think before you type.

[P @ F]

I can already do better than the sweet spot  for 250 notes 

[Smudger]

can you use a webasto thermo top ?

I see you can pick these for around £300 fully re furb'ed

Darran

[dazmond]

theres nothing on the hot wfp market apart from a professionally fitted diesel heater if you want hot water on tap all day long.....

1.gas heaters are not reliable and can be dangerous....(not worth the risk)

2.immersion heaters are good for frost protection but not viable for proper hot water on tap all day long(luke warm at best)....

3.filling up from a hot water tap at home is not viable option either....(same as an immersion)....and can severely deplete resin prematurely running hot water through your vessels...

4.DIY diesel heaters are only for DIY competent guys(im not!)and even then theres usually a lot of faffing about and reliability/safety has not been proved....

[p1w1]

I can already do better than the sweet spot  for 250 notes 

What flow is that on? thats good going

[P @ F]

That is on about 1.8/2.0 LPM  .
It’s not on that from the start though , that 71 was at the end of the day , the heater was being fed with  recirculated water that was left in the tank .
I have found that normally from fire up I can raise the tank water temp by 35*c , normally 10*c in the tank jumps up to 45*c , then if all the hose is out 10*c is lost giving 35 at the brush head which I feel is ample in frosty weather (No broken panes) .
The temps rise quite rapidly , I find myself running at 75% power once the tank is half empty .

[p1w1]

That is on about 1.8/2.0 LPM  .
It’s not on that from the start though , that 71 was at the end of the day , the heater was being fed with  recirculated water that was left in the tank .
I have found that normally from fire up I can raise the tank water temp by 35*c , normally 10*c in the tank jumps up to 45*c , then if all the hose is out 10*c is lost giving 35 at the brush head which I feel is ample in frosty weather (No broken panes) .
The temps rise quite rapidly , I find myself running at 75% power once the tank is half empty .

For the money thats really good although it will probably drop more in winter but still good enough

[Smudger]

theres nothing on the hot wfp market apart from a professionally fitted diesel heater if you want hot water on tap all day long.....

1.gas heaters are not reliable and can be dangerous....(not worth the risk)

2.immersion heaters are good for frost protection but not viable for proper hot water on tap all day long(luke warm at best)....

3.filling up from a hot water tap at home is not viable option either....(same as an immersion)....and can severely deplete resin prematurely running hot water through your vessels...

4.DIY diesel heaters are only for DIY competent guys(im not!)and even then theres usually a lot of faffing about and reliability/safety has not been proved....

Daz, please, please just please don't make statements you know nothing about - I've got a tank unto 65 degrees  - hardly 'luke warm'


Darran

[P @ F]

Don’t worry, new design coming very soon , stepping away from the copper coils and the mild steel tubes  for this one , full stainless welded version that I would be happier selling 

[Smudger]

keep up the good work !

even if you never get to sell them ( I hope you do ) its great watching the development of your heater

Darran

[P @ F]

Darren , does the immersion heat the full body of water ?
I know they get mounted at the bottom, but does the heat rise to the top leaving colder water at the tank outlet ?
It does with my diesel, I have fitted another outlet half way up the tank and draw from both giving a uniform supply of top and bottom water , the idea was to shut off the bottom supply and just draw from the top until I got to that level and then switch to bottom again when I reached the half tank level , but I keep forgetting to do it 

[P @ F]

Darren , also did you see the new gen of heater I posted ?, could be of use to you , heating the vans and cycling the water all night on a lower heat setting could be ok for you , the only thing that I’m not sure of is how they do it , if they have made veins through the ally heat exchanger it would be fine for coolant but I am not sure how ally copes with pure water ?

[Smudger]

When I use the immersion I also have a 'wave maker' inside the lid - these circulate the water ( cost between 5  and 40 quid off eBay) they are for fish tanks and create a decent current

my vans are also inside a unit so the water is capable of reaching a temprature without losing out to the colder air if left outside - I'm sure if I lagged the tank and set the thermostat to 80 it would reach that overnight

my dilemma is - the guys really art fussed if the water is hot or not and I want to trim up some costs - I can halve the unit rent by having a smaller unit to store equipment and have 8 parking spaces (rather than park everything inside) but I need a viable way to at least keep vans frost free - if that system can heat water as well so much the better

Darran

[Smudger]

Darren , also did you see the new gen of heater I posted ?, could be of use to you , heating the vans and cycling the water all night on a lower heat setting could be ok for you , the only thing that I’m not sure of is how they do it , if they have made veins through the ally heat exchanger it would be fine for coolant but I am not sure how ally copes with pure water ?

I did - and i'm interested - but  haven't looked at the shipping options yet

[P @ F]

I now have a contact who imports the air heaters , he puts £30 on the cost of the heater but then checks them and gives aftersales care which EBay doesn’t, I may call him for more info on the dual purpose one and see if he can get them in , chances are it’s the same factory anyway , I will let you know

[p1w1]

theres nothing on the hot wfp market apart from a professionally fitted diesel heater if you want hot water on tap all day long.....

1.gas heaters are not reliable and can be dangerous....(not worth the risk)

2.immersion heaters are good for frost protection but not viable for proper hot water on tap all day long(luke warm at best)....

3.filling up from a hot water tap at home is not viable option either....(same as an immersion)....and can severely deplete resin prematurely running hot water through your vessels...

4.DIY diesel heaters are only for DIY competent guys(im not!)and even then theres usually a lot of faffing about and reliability/safety has not been proved....

Daz, please, please just please don't make statements you know nothing about - I've got a tank unto 65 degrees  - hardly 'luke warm'


Darran

It probably will be by the time its gone through all the microbore on the ground and pole hose as well as the tank itself loosing heat, especially in the colder months, even the diesel systems dont get that hot when the temp is 4-5C in the cold months after going through all the hoses.

[Smudger]

So, if I understand it, you guys start out with a cold tank of water, or a few degrees above zero - you then heat it as you go, but in the cold and through the hose you may get 35 degrees of heat - granted as you recycle between jobs your water temp rises so by mid afternoon you should be able to achieve 60 degrees

Whereas I start at 70 degrees in the tank this on a cold morning is around 45 at the brush and I work through the day yes water cools but not nearly as much as you think at the end of a full day remaining water was around 38 degrees but as the ambient temp rose in the afternoon I was still getting 30 at the brush

If I worked as little as Daz I suspect the water temp would have barely dropped......

Darran

[dazmond]

theres nothing on the hot wfp market apart from a professionally fitted diesel heater if you want hot water on tap all day long.....

1.gas heaters are not reliable and can be dangerous....(not worth the risk)

2.immersion heaters are good for frost protection but not viable for proper hot water on tap all day long(luke warm at best)....

3.filling up from a hot water tap at home is not viable option either....(same as an immersion)....and can severely deplete resin prematurely running hot water through your vessels...

4.DIY diesel heaters are only for DIY competent guys(im not!)and even then theres usually a lot of faffing about and reliability/safety has not been proved....

Daz, please, please just please don't make statements you know nothing about - I've got a tank unto 65 degrees  - hardly 'luke warm'


Darran

no doubt you have but it wont stay that way through your working day plus i bet your immersion was on for 12+ hours!

[Smudger]

See above post

10 hours - 3 hrs at a cost of 33p per/h 7 hrs at 21 p per/h

Darran

[Spruce]

See above post

10 hours - 3 hrs at a cost of 33p per/h 7 hrs at 21 p per/h

Darran

Lee Prior has fitted some outside 230v sockets in his unit so the driver can plug them in to frost heaters during the winter.

I have wired 230v into my van with an outside mounted socket on the side of the van, just like the installers do on fridge vans.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/16-amp-3-pin-OUTDOOR-WALL-MOUNTED-SOCKET-240v-WEATHERPROOF-IP44-caravan-camper/152307847557?hash=item2376415185:g:m5EAAOSwXeJYGxlu