[dazmond]

i was kidding myself...hot water allows for a much easier,comfortable working day just like electric reels and xtreme poles.put all 3 together and you ve got the best cleaning system for demolishing your worklists......

[Jonny 87]

Impossible for me to use mine flat out hot on some of my jobs I’d be cracking left right and centre.

Me too.

I turned mine off at 2pm today and the last two hours of work it was like I was steam cleaning.

I’d definitely recommend getting a second pump fitted if you can.

[p1w1]

Only had mine for about 3 weeks now, but my temperatures are a bit higher than daz. I think it’s because I have mine set up with a second pump constantly recirculating hot water back into the tank.

I can now adjust from Luke warm to scalding hot. Even when I’ve got 100 metres of hose off the reel and about 3 degrees outside, I can get 60 plus degrees at the brush head. (Great for plastics and conservatory roofs but too hot for glass)

I just make sure I keep checking the temp (with my hand) every so often and tweak the heater as necessary.

I’m Realising now that although thermal shock can happen, it’s very rare, and if a window is fitted properly it should be fine. I’m a lot less worried now. Worse case scenario that I break a window I will pay the £60-80 for a glazier to fix it. Not the end of the world.

What I would say though....if you are a one man band, then the 5kw will be plenty if you just want it for general window cleaning. You’ll have nice hot water no matter what the conditions.

I got the 9kw because there are sometimes two of us out, and I wanted the option to have really really hot for plastic cleans and facias etc.

For general window cleaning I never run my 9kw on full heat.

I run pump 2 (that’s recycling hot water back to the tank) on full heat, and the pump on my side on about half heat. This gives me 50 degrees at the brush head with about 30-50 metres of hose off the reel which I find is the standard amount for me, and is so warm that it’s uncomfortable to keep your hand under the jets for more than 10 seconds.

If I was cleaning delicate glass, I would turn my side right down and it would be just warm.

The plus side for me running my set up like this, is that at about 1 or 2 pm I power down the heater because I’ve got 55 degree water in my tank. That’s enough to give nice hot water for the rest of the working day.

Once you get used to how these heaters work you will love them.

I was cleaning a big residential care home yesterday which is nearly all traditional, (windows turn in and get cleaned along with the insides) and the last hour and a half is WFP pole work. Usually that last hour as horrible because you’ve been in the warm all day, and then you have to go out in the freezing cold. ( it was 3 degrees here hesterday)

Yesterday it was awesome. Warm pole, warm hands, windows were so easy to clean, even the ones next to trees and bushes which for the past 8 weeks had been getting battered by  a few storms.

I’m enjoying windowc cleaning again.

  🔥

Thanks for that mate, a nice realistic overview of the system. I think for what they cost an extra 500 for the 9kw is the better option also i would of thought with the 1 man version you wouldn't be able to run a second pump on it. My thoughts would be to run it like you do..anyway bit the bullet and getting one fitted at the end of next month  they are expensive but it will last me for the rest of my window cleaning days.

[NWH]

i was kidding myself...hot water allows for a much easier,comfortable working day just like electric reels and xtreme poles.put all 3 together and you ve got the best cleaning system for demolishing your worklists......

what are you on about you can’t beat a non speed lined van full of rust cold water setup wires and pole spares everywhere the odd bucket wet cloths chucked about,p poor freezing cold in the morning with the front window steamed up.
When your at this level you can be pleased with yourself Daz 😂

[dazmond]

Only had mine for about 3 weeks now, but my temperatures are a bit higher than daz. I think it’s because I have mine set up with a second pump constantly recirculating hot water back into the tank.

I can now adjust from Luke warm to scalding hot. Even when I’ve got 100 metres of hose off the reel and about 3 degrees outside, I can get 60 plus degrees at the brush head. (Great for plastics and conservatory roofs but too hot for glass)

I just make sure I keep checking the temp (with my hand) every so often and tweak the heater as necessary.

I’m Realising now that although thermal shock can happen, it’s very rare, and if a window is fitted properly it should be fine. I’m a lot less worried now. Worse case scenario that I break a window I will pay the £60-80 for a glazier to fix it. Not the end of the world.

What I would say though....if you are a one man band, then the 5kw will be plenty if you just want it for general window cleaning. You’ll have nice hot water no matter what the conditions.

I got the 9kw because there are sometimes two of us out, and I wanted the option to have really really hot for plastic cleans and facias etc.

For general window cleaning I never run my 9kw on full heat.

I run pump 2 (that’s recycling hot water back to the tank) on full heat, and the pump on my side on about half heat. This gives me 50 degrees at the brush head with about 30-50 metres of hose off the reel which I find is the standard amount for me, and is so warm that it’s uncomfortable to keep your hand under the jets for more than 10 seconds.

If I was cleaning delicate glass, I would turn my side right down and it would be just warm.

The plus side for me running my set up like this, is that at about 1 or 2 pm I power down the heater because I’ve got 55 degree water in my tank. That’s enough to give nice hot water for the rest of the working day.

Once you get used to how these heaters work you will love them.

I was cleaning a big residential care home yesterday which is nearly all traditional, (windows turn in and get cleaned along with the insides) and the last hour and a half is WFP pole work. Usually that last hour as horrible because you’ve been in the warm all day, and then you have to go out in the freezing cold. ( it was 3 degrees here hesterday)

Yesterday it was awesome. Warm pole, warm hands, windows were so easy to clean, even the ones next to trees and bushes which for the past 8 weeks had been getting battered by  a few storms.

I’m enjoying windowc cleaning again.

  🔥

Thanks for that mate, a nice realistic overview of the system. I think for what they cost an extra 500 for the 9kw is the better option also i would of thought with the 1 man version you wouldn't be able to run a second pump on it. My thoughts would be to run it like you do..anyway bit the bullet and getting one fitted at the end of next month  they are expensive but it will last me for the rest of my window cleaning days.

you wont regret it......esp if you ve had DIY gas shower heaters in the past....diesel heaters are the best if you want hot water on tap every day with minimal faff.....

[jonboywalton75]

Have you told your girlfriend about your diesel heater Daz😱😱😱
She might be jealous

[P @ F]

Quick question .....5 kw and 9 kw how do they differ as I can only see 1 model of thermotop , is it 2 plate exchangers as opposed to 1 or is it a larger plate exchanger , or is there more than 1 model of thermotop ?

[NWH]

The 9kw produces hotter water more consistently I’ve had the 5kw heater and it was hot enough for window cleaning,the 9kw will give you above 50-60degrees even with a high flow of water 70-80 on the controller. I still use a high flow of water even when the water is that hot,if you get 1 get the 9kw it’s setup for 2 man system and like I say gives water hot enough to clean anything.

[Jonny 87]

Quick question .....5 kw and 9 kw how do they differ as I can only see 1 model of thermotop , is it 2 plate exchangers as opposed to 1 or is it a larger plate exchanger , or is there more than 1 model of thermotop ?

The 5 and 9 are totally different units.

The 9kw is a thermo pro 90.

[P @ F]

So 5 kw is thermotop c
And 9 kw is thermo pro 90
Thanks for that !

Next question is .... What is the temp of the coolant before it goes into the heat exchanger and what sort of Lpm it pumps it at ?
I’m just having another of my brainwaves in DIY world 😁

[NWH]

You have to base it on the pump your using I think my pump is max 5.9lts a minute.

[Spruce]

So 5 kw is thermotop c
And 9 kw is thermo pro 90
Thanks for that !

Next question is .... What is the temp of the coolant before it goes into the heat exchanger and what sort of Lpm it pumps it at ?
I’m just having another of my brainwaves in DIY world 😁

Here's the inside of a Purefreedom 5kw diesel heater.

[NWH]

That’s the same as my old heater that 5kw let me know if you want to buy all those internals,they are less than a year old including the fuel pump which is £300 itself.

[Spruce]

So 5 kw is thermotop c
And 9 kw is thermo pro 90
Thanks for that !

Next question is .... What is the temp of the coolant before it goes into the heat exchanger and what sort of Lpm it pumps it at ?
I’m just having another of my brainwaves in DIY world 😁

5 years ago I thought about making my own version with a few additions of my own.

So I put this together with the view of then fitting it into a box.



Firstly the diesel heater is a Thermo Top C and its a universal variant. A diesel heater from a Rover 75 will work as will one from a Citroen C5 and C8. The universal units are available ex narrow boat and yachts. Mine came from a refurbisher.
Vehicle specifical Thermo Tops for BMW and others that integrate into the vehicles Canbus do not work, no matter what the Ebay sellers say. (I'v got a BMW one here in the garage that doesn't work.)
 
You will need a wiring harness, a fuel pump and in some cases a water pump. A 1531 controller is also a plus although cheaper digital controllers or a standard on/off switch will work.

When I played around with this the water temperature in the tank was 9 degrees. With the heater working flat out the temperature at the brush head was 35 degrees after 100 meters of hose, most of which was coiled on the hose reel. The water leaving the heat exchanger to go back to the boiler via the header was cold. That heat exchanger zapped every scrap of heat from the hot water.

I was running my pump at 3 on my Varistream which was around 1.5lpm with cold water. Hot water flows quicker through the hose so 3 on my Varistream would been more lpm but I didn't measure it.

I believed that 5kw would support heating 2 hose reels. According to the calculator I used, raising 1.5lpm of water through 26 degrees should have only used 2.65kw, so the rest of the heat was being lost, mainly through the exhaust. That put me off a bit.

The idea of the 3rd heat exchanger was to connect it up to a third pump that would be controlled using a digital temperature controller. This was my automatic control solution to ensure the furnace remained running when I stopped to chat to people.

The cycle of a Thermo Top C is that it takes around 90 seconds to fully start. It will burn on full heat mode until the water its heating gets up to 74 degrees C. At 74 degrees the heater goes into half heat mode.  Once the temperature of the heated water reaches 77 degrees the heater goes in power down mode, which takes around 90 seconds.

Now if you start to draw heat from the heating circuit when the water is 75 degrees, the heater will stay in half heat mode until it drops to 68 degrees C is memory serves me. So the idea was to program the digital controller to kick a pump in at 75 degrees and switch it off at 70 degrees C and bleed that hot water into the tank.

The problem with diesel heaters is getting them out of heating sync. So if I talked to a customer for a while and the heater went into its shutdown cycle I would have to wait for at least 3 minutes before the heater switched off and then restarted. By then the water at the brush head was cold as I had zapped all the heat from it and because I'm still working the temperature will take a long time before it starts to heat the water up. I will probably have completed the next house using mainly cold water. Once I stop working the heater then has a chance to catch up. This will probably mean the heater again goes into shutdown mode. This is the reason why NWH and a few others redirect the water to the tank on route to the next customer.

These things are primarily engine preheaters. So they start and warm up the coolant in the engine block. When the temperature of the coolant water reaches 30 degrees the unit will switch on the internal blower motor so defrosting the windscreen and warming the cabin. This process will take around 30 minutes, so the programmer will switch off after 30 minutes unless you set it to stay on longer. The heater shuts off at 77 degrees C as that is before the vehicles cooling thermostat starts to open.
Its pointless pumping that hot water through the radiator to be cooled by it.

.

[dazmond]

i never let my heater shut down during the day spruce....i fire it up just after i start the van first thing in the morning and turn it off just after the last job of the day.....i plug back into the tank when driving from job to job,lunch time and if a customer makes me a brew....

ive been told its best to run them flat out all day every day to avoid premature coking up of the burner...i dont know how true this is but i do it anyway......

mines the thermo pro 90.......

[NWH]

If anyone wants to buy my cabinet they can build there own it has room for 2 plates exchangers making it a 1 or 2 man lol.

[dd]

Only had mine for about 3 weeks now, but my temperatures are a bit higher than daz. I think it’s because I have mine set up with a second pump constantly recirculating hot water back into the tank.

I can now adjust from Luke warm to scalding hot. Even when I’ve got 100 metres of hose off the reel and about 3 degrees outside, I can get 60 plus degrees at the brush head. (Great for plastics and conservatory roofs but too hot for glass)

I just make sure I keep checking the temp (with my hand) every so often and tweak the heater as necessary.

I’m Realising now that although thermal shock can happen, it’s very rare, and if a window is fitted properly it should be fine. I’m a lot less worried now. Worse case scenario that I break a window I will pay the £60-80 for a glazier to fix it. Not the end of the world.

What I would say though....if you are a one man band, then the 5kw will be plenty if you just want it for general window cleaning. You’ll have nice hot water no matter what the conditions.

I got the 9kw because there are sometimes two of us out, and I wanted the option to have really really hot for plastic cleans and facias etc.

For general window cleaning I never run my 9kw on full heat.

I run pump 2 (that’s recycling hot water back to the tank) on full heat, and the pump on my side on about half heat. This gives me 50 degrees at the brush head with about 30-50 metres of hose off the reel which I find is the standard amount for me, and is so warm that it’s uncomfortable to keep your hand under the jets for more than 10 seconds.

If I was cleaning delicate glass, I would turn my side right down and it would be just warm.

The plus side for me running my set up like this, is that at about 1 or 2 pm I power down the heater because I’ve got 55 degree water in my tank. That’s enough to give nice hot water for the rest of the working day.

Once you get used to how these heaters work you will love them.

I was cleaning a big residential care home yesterday which is nearly all traditional, (windows turn in and get cleaned along with the insides) and the last hour and a half is WFP pole work. Usually that last hour as horrible because you’ve been in the warm all day, and then you have to go out in the freezing cold. ( it was 3 degrees here hesterday)

Yesterday it was awesome. Warm pole, warm hands, windows were so easy to clean, even the ones next to trees and bushes which for the past 8 weeks had been getting battered by  a few storms.

I’m enjoying windowc cleaning again.

  🔥

Thanks for that mate, a nice realistic overview of the system. I think for what they cost an extra 500 for the 9kw is the better option also i would of thought with the 1 man version you wouldn't be able to run a second pump on it. My thoughts would be to run it like you do..anyway bit the bullet and getting one fitted at the end of next month  they are expensive but it will last me for the rest of my window cleaning days.

Are you able to run a lead out to your van to charge the batteries overnight? I do not think you can rely on a split charge relay to top the batteries up enough on its own.

[NWH]

If you buy 1 of these heaters 5-9kw you will need the mains hookup that grippa fit,it’s a 3 pin plug I have 1 attached to the side of the outside of my van so when it needs a charge I plug in overnight come out in the morning and unplug and ready to go for another couple of weeks.
Like I say you do need this or you will have to unclip and carry 2 batteries indoors to charge,if you don’t do as much driving as me you’ll be doing it often with these heaters. Since I’ve had this fitted I’ve never had battery issues,add another 1000 onto the heater price though.

[p1w1]

Only had mine for about 3 weeks now, but my temperatures are a bit higher than daz. I think it’s because I have mine set up with a second pump constantly recirculating hot water back into the tank.

I can now adjust from Luke warm to scalding hot. Even when I’ve got 100 metres of hose off the reel and about 3 degrees outside, I can get 60 plus degrees at the brush head. (Great for plastics and conservatory roofs but too hot for glass)

I just make sure I keep checking the temp (with my hand) every so often and tweak the heater as necessary.

I’m Realising now that although thermal shock can happen, it’s very rare, and if a window is fitted properly it should be fine. I’m a lot less worried now. Worse case scenario that I break a window I will pay the £60-80 for a glazier to fix it. Not the end of the world.

What I would say though....if you are a one man band, then the 5kw will be plenty if you just want it for general window cleaning. You’ll have nice hot water no matter what the conditions.

I got the 9kw because there are sometimes two of us out, and I wanted the option to have really really hot for plastic cleans and facias etc.

For general window cleaning I never run my 9kw on full heat.

I run pump 2 (that’s recycling hot water back to the tank) on full heat, and the pump on my side on about half heat. This gives me 50 degrees at the brush head with about 30-50 metres of hose off the reel which I find is the standard amount for me, and is so warm that it’s uncomfortable to keep your hand under the jets for more than 10 seconds.

If I was cleaning delicate glass, I would turn my side right down and it would be just warm.

The plus side for me running my set up like this, is that at about 1 or 2 pm I power down the heater because I’ve got 55 degree water in my tank. That’s enough to give nice hot water for the rest of the working day.

Once you get used to how these heaters work you will love them.

I was cleaning a big residential care home yesterday which is nearly all traditional, (windows turn in and get cleaned along with the insides) and the last hour and a half is WFP pole work. Usually that last hour as horrible because you’ve been in the warm all day, and then you have to go out in the freezing cold. ( it was 3 degrees here hesterday)

Yesterday it was awesome. Warm pole, warm hands, windows were so easy to clean, even the ones next to trees and bushes which for the past 8 weeks had been getting battered by  a few storms.

I’m enjoying windowc cleaning again.

  🔥

Thanks for that mate, a nice realistic overview of the system. I think for what they cost an extra 500 for the 9kw is the better option also i would of thought with the 1 man version you wouldn't be able to run a second pump on it. My thoughts would be to run it like you do..anyway bit the bullet and getting one fitted at the end of next month  they are expensive but it will last me for the rest of my window cleaning days.

Are you able to run a lead out to your van to charge the batteries overnight? I do not think you can rely on a split charge relay to top the batteries up enough on its own.

Hi dd hope all is well..yes i will bench charge it as well. Have a 20 amp mains charger that i will leave in the van. Also my dad has a nearly new stirling 30amp battery to battery charger that he used to use and doesn't want anymore so luckily saved a few £ there.

[dd]

Hi Paul

Yes I am well. Things must be going well for you as you are taking the plunge to go hot. Good luck with it all.

Best wishes, David