[nathankaye]

Haha ive never had more problems since faffing with MPPT controllers.
By all accounts I have a legit MPPT controller and as can see on vid below, its pulling the volts down from over 30 to 14 more suitable for the battery its feeding. The panels are connected in series and then meter and then into the MPPT.  I have mostly been parking in direct sun light but I am bitterly disappointed with the conversion of the overvoltage to amps. Especially when my small panel charging direct to my electric reel battery is pulling more amps.

In short:      MPPT has given 0.1@@ amps  from 2 panels in series pulling over 30v in.
Small 12w panel feeding direct to battery has given 0.389 amps in the same time.

What going wrong?
https://youtu.be/oohP259Ov2Q

[Spruce]

Disconnect the second panel in series that isnt facing the sun. So what you need to do is only compare the 2 panels that are facing the sun. See if that changes the figures.

[nathankaye]

Disconnect the second panel in series that isnt facing the sun. So what you need to do is only compare the 2 panels that are facing the sun. See if that changes the figures.

I still run a on/off switch on the panels before going into the meter. When I first turn the panels on, I have a collective volt of 35 coming into the MPPT. But when I turn the MPPT controller on, it brings the voltage down to just under 14v, which I thought was normal. So the over voltage should be turned into amps and thats what I dont seem to be getting.

Previously I had a meter on each panel and so I knew the outout from each panel but the problem with that, was that the meters had diodes in for one way flow of current. So I have now connected the panels before they enter the meter.
But Im now thinking the chinese meter is at fault and so I am bypassing the meter and running panels in series straight into the controller. The only meter will be after the MPPT to show me the output and I will see how that works tomorrow

[P @ F]

You and me both mate , avin a mare myself !!

But back to yours though , just watched the vid , the first meter you grab i think is connected to the 50 and 20 in series yes ?
And the readings you are getting off it are before MPPT yes ? 
Well as Spruce said , they need to be facing the same way for best effect , also , it was sunny at the time , this is when you would be best to have them in parralell , if you cant see the sun then more is gotten from series .
Also i believe that you are reading the meters wrong , the little panel 12w that you said was giving 0.384, that was the reading from bottom left , (the one that scrolls through readings) that 0.384 is what you have pulled in in total since switch on , the reading above it is the one that shows amps in at the time .   

[nathankaye]

You and me both mate , avin a mare myself !!

But back to yours though , just watched the vid , the first meter you grab i think is connected to the 50 and 20 in series yes ?
And the readings you are getting off it are before MPPT yes ? 
Well as Spruce said , they need to be facing the same way for best effect , also , it was sunny at the time , this is when you would be best to have them in parralell , if you cant see the sun then more is gotten from series .
Also i believe that you are reading the meters wrong , the little panel 12w that you said was giving 0.384, that was the reading from bottom left , (the one that scrolls through readings) that 0.384 is what you have pulled in in total since switch on , the reading above it is the one that shows amps in at the time .   

Yes, so I have the two panels connected in series, virtually straight away from the panels. ( ive got the panels set that way, so which ever way im parked I have at least one in full sun and the other still drawing power but just not in direct light.  For instance the other day I was drawing 25v in one and 11v from the other.  Yet if both panels were not in direct sun it would have been much less. Ild sooner sacrifice a little voltage rather than have days where i get none. If that makes sense)
Then from the connection of series, straight into the meter reader and then into the MPPT.
The small panel that i took the 0.389 from was the source AH showing the collective amps drawn in since it was turned on. (is how I understand it)   and compared this to the total amp hours from after the MPPT controller. So comparing the total amp hours delivered into each battery.

[Spruce]

I also think that you need to compare apples with apples.

If I understand this right you are comparing the performance of 2 different panels charging 2 different batteries. The only common thing is the gauge.

If you need to evaluate the performance of the MPPT controller then you need the same power source charging the same battery. So using the sun you would need a cloudless sky with the sun shining, or consistant cloud.

 Different batteries are going to give different charge values, especially if each are in different states of charge - a nearly fully charged battery will accept a lower charge than a half charged one will.

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[P @ F]

Yes , as above , i think you are over complicating things Nath , my system is about as easy as it gets , to be honest mine is not quite right as i have 2 different wattage panels myself , really to run series the panels should be the closest match you can get , and then only feed into one battery or a bank of identical ones .
If i were you i would take the 2 big panels and wire either parralell or series depending on weather as i have mentioned before .
Wire them to one meter and then to MPPT then to one battery .
Then wire your 12 watt to the other battery for your reel and keep an eye on the voltage as you used to .
That way freeing you up to do the job you are meant to be out there doing 

[nathankaye]

Sorry chaps, not sure if youve misunderstood me.
The first amp meter is connected to the wiring of the solar panels after they are connected in series. So this meter will tell me the amp and watt draw from the panels.
My understanding is that the MPPT will convert the over voltage to amps. So I should be looking at a higher ampage coming from my MPPT control box than the amp reading going in. This is the problem, I am not doing so.  But as a point of reference a smaller panel has given me a greater feed of amps in comparison and yes a lower voltage draw as well since its a smaller watt panel.  I made this  comparison just to highlight that I think I have a problem somewhere with my set up or the MPPT controller. Because logic would say that a greater feed of voltage from 2 larger panels in series plus the magic of the MPPT controller should see a bigger yield in amp's being given when both have ran for the same time.
Yet in my case, i wasnt getting that result.

[P @ F]

I do see what you are saying , i have had it myself at times , the amount of times i have found myself switching wiring configurations to get the most is stupid , thats why i just opted to go series in overcast and parralell in sun .
I would get 25% more on the cloudy days due to series one minute but then not the next , then other times when switching i got exactly the same , i sort of gave up switching and going with what i said above .
Just lately with the meters playing up i have stuck with series , i should have the bluetooth wired in and running by the end of play tomorrow , and that will document via app exactly what has come in when and how it was wired , i can then see for sure what is best how and when ! 

[nathankaye]

Yep, it can be frustrating.
You'll have to post your findings with the app. I have contemplated setting this up myself but with cable to laptop in an evening when filling my tank up. But I have decided against it for now.

[windowswashed]

What make of solar panels have you got. I use sun power solar panels so if solar panel is partially covered by cloud the drop is less than most  other manufacturers. I run a dual battery charger solar 20amp MPPT by vitronic  powered by two 150 watt panels.

[Spruce]

What make of solar panels have you got. I use sun power solar panels so if solar panel is partially covered by cloud the drop is less than most  other manufacturers. I run a dual battery charger solar 20amp MPPT by vitronic  powered by two 150 watt panels.

If one of you panels was facing the other way and not catching the sun's rays its the same as the panel being in shade.

If they put solar panels on a house roof with one array facing south and the other west for example, they use 2 separate inverters or a multi inverter which  treats each bank individually. (Roof solar use invertors to boost the voltage to 230v where we use controllers to reduce and control the input to suit our 12v batteries.)

I wouldn't be surprised if the one of Nats panels is feeding the other. What P&F has is 2 different size panels but they are both orientated the same, flat. So they both get the same available sunlight.

[nathankaye]

Ive attached a on/off switch to both panels and previously an amp meter for both. Also both panels are angled in.   So if one is in full sun it brought in the highest yield of amps/volts. However when I turned that one off and the other on, it was still yielding results because it was still in high sun just not directly facing it. But obviously not as much as the other.

P @ F  i believe has his panels flat on his roof bars, whereas mine are angled from roof bar down to the roof. However his panels are higher rated wattages.

[nathankaye]

Slightly different today as im in parallel but I seem to be getting roughly what im expecting. So my conclusion is that my amp meter from china was at fault for some reason. Dont know how, but since ive bypassed it, things seem to be working as it should

[P @ F]

Yes thats more like it Nath , those amp meters are good as an indication , but as you say , they are no cutting edge monitors , close enough for what we need though , as long as they work right !

I have disconected 2 of mine now , before and after the mppt , i dont need them anymore , that bluetooth dongle is the mutts nuts !
I do still have one on the pump and drill though to see what gone out .
But to be honest i dont think im going to need that either , i have gotten home for the past 3 days now with my battery in float mode , may it continue like that   

[nathankaye]

Yes thats more like it Nath , those amp meters are good as an indication , but as you say , they are no cutting edge monitors , close enough for what we need though , as long as they work right !

I have disconected 2 of mine now , before and after the mppt , i dont need them anymore , that bluetooth dongle is the mutts nuts !
I do still have one on the pump and drill though to see what gone out .
But to be honest i dont think im going to need that either , i have gotten home for the past 3 days now with my battery in float mode , may it continue like that 

Yep, your new set up looks good. Are you still using combo of solar panels and alternator or have you come away from solar panels altogether now and made use of them at home?

My solar panels are partof my reputation now lol!  Im known as the window cleaner with the reach n wash who uses solar panels.

[P @ F]

All i have done is stuck my multifunction Numax leisure in as my van battery , this then gets charged as a normal battery would via the alternator , but i still have all the solar going as that then charges me whilst the van is not running , as i say , i have not had the battery out for 3 days now , by the time i get home im fully charged , and as you know , the solar yield has been utter rubbish lately.

You may remember Spruce saying that i would find summer easy , but in winter it would be hard to achieve my goal of not taking my battery out  , well it would appear that i have cracked it my old son !

All i have to hope now is that the battery can handle the charge i am providing it , i dont think that multiple starts are going to be an issue , i did a test run of 15 starts the other day without actually driving the van or letting it idle during the 2 hour period i did it over , i then went for a 10 mile drive and was right back to being fully charged again .

All i need to work out now is how to upload a pic or vid to ciu or my laptop from my new piece of turd iphone , dont suppose you know do you ? 

[nathankaye]

All i have done is stuck my multifunction Numax leisure in as my van battery , this then gets charged as a normal battery would via the alternator , but i still have all the solar going as that then charges me whilst the van is not running , as i say , i have not had the battery out for 3 days now , by the time i get home im fully charged , and as you know , the solar yield has been utter rubbish lately.

You may remember Spruce saying that i would find summer easy , but in winter it would be hard to achieve my goal of not taking my battery out  , well it would appear that i have cracked it my old son !

All i have to hope now is that the battery can handle the charge i am providing it , i dont think that multiple starts are going to be an issue , i did a test run of 15 starts the other day without actually driving the van or letting it idle during the 2 hour period i did it over , i then went for a 10 mile drive and was right back to being fully charged again .

All i need to work out now is how to upload a pic or vid to ciu or my laptop from my new piece of turd iphone , dont suppose you know do you ?

What milleage is recommended for split relays to be of benefit do you know?
 But sounds like you have cracked it by combining the two together;  alternator n solar.
Wouldnt it be easier to upload onto u tube and then just post a link as youve done b4.  Or use a data/charge cable from phone to laptop?   Other than that, im clueless as i use android phones at mo. 

[P @ F]

I think Spruce said that half an hour of him driving would get him about 3.5 amps , dont take that as gospel though , i am only doing 10 mile on way home and it seems to be topping me right up ?

As for the phone bit i give up , i have always used android myself , only nasty ones as i always went for the free tv or console , this time i thought i would get an iphone to make life easier for myself , how wrong was i eh 

[Spruce]

I think Spruce said that half an hour of him driving would get him about 3.5 amps , dont take that as gospel though , i am only doing 10 mile on way home and it seems to be topping me right up ?

As for the phone bit i give up , i have always used android myself , only nasty ones as i always went for the free tv or console , this time i thought i would get an iphone to make life easier for myself , how wrong was i eh 

I honestly don't understand why some people can run their equipment off the van's battery and we haven't been able to.

When my son joined us he had a 2liter hdi Peugeot Partner Van. We ran his pump (just 1 Shurflo pump with Varistream analogue controller) for 4 days from his van battery. On the pm of the 4th day he had to bump start his van as the battery was flat.

Yet a cleaner (who ocassionally visits this forum these days) had the identical van (Citroen Berlingo) and he had no issues running his pump off his van's battery.
Son's battery needed to be replaced a couple of years later and we tried the same exercise, and again the van's battery was flat in 4 days.

When son in law joined us he brought in a 1.8 ttdi Tansit Connect. We also tried to run 1 pump and 1 controller from his van battery.  Even travelling a 9 mile journey to work and back didn't keep his battery from also going flat, although it took a little longer. We ended up adding a leisure battery to his van.

Our problem charging wise is that we do minmal mileage and we really get into a traffic jam. 90% of our work is within a 5 mile radius. My van is for work only as I have a private car as does the wife. We have one special customer that is 25 miles away (family related) and that trip isn't enough to replenish the battery charge in our leisure battery.

I have related on here before how I drove from the North East to the south coast to collect a diesel heater I bought. My leisure battery voltage was registering 12.4/12.5volts when I started off. It took 5 hours of driving before that leisure battery was fully charged, only accepting 0.3 to 0.5 of an amp on my combo amp/voltage gauge.

So the only advise I can give is down to my own running experience. If your daily commute includes getting stuck in traffic then thats good for your leisure battery as it is still getting a charge. In our area the only times we might get delayed is at a level crossing. 

I've been really interested in P&F's thread. Now my leisure battery is over 3 years old I can expect it to need replacing in the near future. With some leisure batteries also now having dual facilities, I could well replace my van's starter battery (which is relatively new) with a leisure battery with a CCA value and consign the starter battery to the back and use it to jump start the van should the battery go flat.

I don't want to get too involved as the van I have is in need of some major rust surgery or needing to be replaced. I'm in limbo atm.

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