[robbo333]

Do you all clean the top frame on every clean and then move directly onto the glass below. I tend to just do the top frame when its looking a bit dirty, possibly every 3-4 cleans, but this then makes it almost like a first clean as i move round each frame first and then come back to the first window when the drips have stopped. i was told a long time ago to avoid the top frames as much as possible as it will only cause problems?

Hi Chopsie, I clean every 8 weeks.

Yes, I clean the top frame on every clean.

Once or twice across the top frame with water on a fairly high flow.

I then proceed to clean the horizontal top opener, right around the little window frame (if there is one) and then the rest of the frame, down the sides etc (but not the bottom sill).  So fundamentally, i've cleaned all the frame (but not the sill).

Then I clean the glass, start with top opener (if there is one) twice over with a brush and a quick rinse. Then the window opposite the top opener (two or three times, horizontally, across the top of the glass and the bit of rubber and frame above it) spread your brush so it covers both the top of the glass and the frame above.

Then up and down over the glass; go over it twice and then a quick rinse. When you go over the glass, you agitate the dirt (make sure you get right down the sides and into the corners), when you rinse, you rinse off all the dirty water.

Then come back to the window below the top opener and repeat as above.

Then clean the plastic just below the window (once across), then turn your water off.

Now you can wipe your brush along the window seal (once or twice, up to you).

So basically, I have cleaned all the frame first (except the sill) then cleaned the glass in a logical order that minimises drips onto the glass below.  Then I cleaned the window seal, with the water turned off to minimise drips onto the window below.

If your first clean is good and you are methodical in your subsequent cleans, you should be ok.

I understand you were told not to clean the top frames. I disagree, if you clean it thoroughly on your first clean then you should be ok on subsequent cleans (but you need to keep it clean). If you don't clean the top frame properly, rain can hit it and the dirt on the frame will run down onto the glass below. If the frame is clean then the rain should make no difference (in general, rain water is clean).

The only problem I have found with rubber seals is when they oxidise. You can tell this by licking your finger and wiping over the rubber. If your finger is black, then the seal has oxidised. In my opinion, I would walk away and find another customer. This is just my opinion but you have to be very careful how you clean these and most customers won't appreciate the extra hassle involved.

Hope this is helpful.

Good luck

PS, If you think you have a problem window then clean the whole house.
Then come back to the problem window and rinse it again (but don't touch the top frame, 10mm below the top of the glass, yes miss out the top 10mm of the glass.)

Regards  Robbo

[Splash & dash]

Do you all clean the top frame on every clean and then move directly onto the glass below. I tend to just do the top frame when its looking a bit dirty, possibly every 3-4 cleans, but this then makes it almost like a first clean as i move round each frame first and then come back to the first window when the drips have stopped. i was told a long time ago to avoid the top frames as much as possible as it will only cause problems?

Hi Chopsie, I clean every 8 weeks.

Yes, I clean the top frame on every clean.

Once or twice across the top frame with water on a fairly high flow.

I then proceed to clean the horizontal top opener, right around the little window frame (if there is one) and then the rest of the frame, down the sides etc (but not the bottom sill).  So fundamentally, i've cleaned all the frame (but not the sill).

Then I clean the glass, start with top opener (if there is one) twice over with a brush and a quick rinse. Then the window opposite the top opener (two or three times, horizontally, across the top of the glass and the bit of rubber and frame above it) spread your brush so it covers both the top of the glass and the frame above.

Then up and down over the glass; go over it twice and then a quick rinse. When you go over the glass, you agitate the dirt (make sure you get right down the sides and into the corners), when you rinse, you rinse off all the dirty water.

Then come back to the window below the top opener and repeat as above.

Then clean the plastic just below the window (once across), then turn your water off.

Now you can wipe your brush along the window seal (once or twice, up to you).

So basically, I have cleaned all the frame first (except the sill) then cleaned the glass in a logical order that minimises drips onto the glass below.  Then I cleaned the window seal, with the water turned off to minimise drips onto the window below.

If your first clean is good and you are methodical in your subsequent cleans, you should be ok.

I understand you were told not to clean the top frames. I disagree, if you clean it thoroughly on your first clean then you should be ok on subsequent cleans (but you need to keep it clean). If you don't clean the top frame properly, rain can hit it and the dirt on the frame will run down onto the glass below. If the frame is clean then the rain should make no difference (in general, rain water is clean).

The only problem I have found with rubber seals is when they oxidise. You can tell this by licking your finger and wiping over the rubber. If your finger is black, then the seal has oxidised. In my opinion, I would walk away and find another customer. This is just my opinion but you have to be very careful how you clean these and most customers won't appreciate the extra hassle involved.

Hope this is helpful.

Good luck

PS, If you think you have a problem window then clean the whole house.
Then come back to the problem window and rinse it again (but don't touch the top frame, 10mm below the top of the glass, yes miss out the top 10mm of the glass.)

Regards  Robbo









At last someone who knows what they are doing rather than the splash and dash brigade

[chopsie]

Thanks you for that information robbo333, I appreciate you taking the time to write all of that. I’ll be hitting top frames hard from now on. Cheers everyone

[Slacky]

I remember a few years back having a conversation with someone on here about cleaning vents. They claimed they could clean vents without leaving runs on the glass I reckoned otherwise.

I now believe you can clean vents without leaving anything on the glass. Its knowledge and technique.

[dazmond]

I remember a few years back having a conversation with someone on here about cleaning vents. They claimed they could clean vents without leaving runs on the glass I reckoned otherwise.

I now believe you can clean vents without leaving anything on the glass. Its knowledge and technique.

ive never had a problem with vents however i dont squirt water up them.


ive said it before and ill say it again some top frames will cause you trouble if you clean them with wfp.its nothing to do with splash and dash(although i do that from time to time depending how dirty the windows are).

main culprits are wooden/aluminium window frames but certain plastic windows with badly fitted rubber seals will cause runs sometimes.luckily i havent got too many like these but i still have them.its less hassle to miss them out.

check you work lads and you might be surprised.......

[Dry Clean]

Cleaning vents isn't a black and white issue, some vents will come up perfect every time some will always cause problems and
others will be ok one clean and terrible the next, experience and a good technique will certainly minimise any potential problems
but it certainly wont remove them completely.
As with a lot of things in this game what works for one might not work for another and just because your getting away with something doesnt mean you are doing it right.
That said I have started to notice that a lot of wfp'ers in my neck of the woods have stopped cleaning above vents altogether
which I think is a bad thing, theres always a way even if you dont want to put water above them.

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

I would just be aware that in your marketing material, if you say you clean all the frames not just the glass, that you actually clean all the frames not just parts of it.

[Smudger]

There's alotof silly nonsense talk on this thread, especially saying how skipping on top frame is poor workmanship and how someones customer would complain if they themselves missed the top frame. What a load of ollocks.

My work is cleaned on a 4week rotation and for arguement sake I have done a video showing how clean my windows and yes how clean my frames are.  Therefore I dont need to clean the top frame or even the frame on every visit when they pay me to clean their glass window! Because of this they may be cleaned every 8 weeks instead and the only exception to this are my houses out in the sticks where the frames do in deed  need cleaning every visit. This is simply common sense.

In the past when I was trad cleaning, I gave my customers 2 prices. One for the windows to be cleaned and a double price for the frames to be cleaned as well. This made business sense, as it took longer to clean frames trad way and windows and it made money. Thats what running  a  business is all about, making money.

Lol
Funny how ONLY your house  needs the frames cleaning......

Please make he frames are cleaned every visit too risky trying to leave a dirty tide line along the top which will bing down dirt when the t gets wet - part of our customer service is to clean the entire frame so it’s done every time if cleaned correctly you won’t get run lines

On first cleans apply some tfr to you he top of the frame and rubber seals and scrub older seals full of crib and washing up liquid from the trad  brigade will run black - keeps scrubbing until water goes clear then wash entire window as normal, no runs no drip marks and when you return for the next clean these seals will run clear water - same as vents etc

Preparation is key for good easy ongoing cleans

Darran

[The Jester of Wibbly]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

[Smudger]

Frames are important part of the job

Darran

[Splash & dash]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

This thread is certainly showing who does the job properly customers and potential customers do watch us working , I had a customer who had cctv on his property phone me and thank us for doing all the windows and frames on his house at the time he was at his main property in Australia he sacked the previous wi Dow cleaner as he wasn’t doing the bathroom windows and missing out frame tops , we didn’t realise we were being filmed at the time but it just goes to show doing a thorough job each time weather the customer is there or nor payes off

[nathankaye]

There's alotof silly nonsense talk on this thread, especially saying how skipping on top frame is poor workmanship and how someones customer would complain if they themselves missed the top frame. What a load of ollocks.

My work is cleaned on a 4week rotation and for arguement sake I have done a video showing how clean my windows and yes how clean my frames are.  Therefore I dont need to clean the top frame or even the frame on every visit when they pay me to clean their glass window! Because of this they may be cleaned every 8 weeks instead and the only exception to this are my houses out in the sticks where the frames do in deed  need cleaning every visit. This is simply common sense.

In the past when I was trad cleaning, I gave my customers 2 prices. One for the windows to be cleaned and a double price for the frames to be cleaned as well. This made business sense, as it took longer to clean frames trad way and windows and it made money. Thats what running  a  business is all about, making money.

Lol
Funny how ONLY your house  needs the frames cleaning......

Please make he frames are cleaned every visit too risky trying to leave a dirty tide line along the top which will bing down dirt when the t gets wet - part of our customer service is to clean the entire frame so it’s done every time if cleaned correctly you won’t get run lines

On first cleans apply some tfr to you he top of the frame and rubber seals and scrub older seals full of crib and washing up liquid from the trad  brigade will run black - keeps scrubbing until water goes clear then wash entire window as normal, no runs no drip marks and when you return for the next clean these seals will run clear water - same as vents etc

Preparation is key for good easy ongoing cleans

Darran

Sorry Darren,  but you may have miss read my post.
" my houses"   as in plural and part of my round.    Not in the meaning of my actual home I live in.

[Simon Trapani]

Yep, been a real eye opener & explains a lot of peoples problems with runs, spotting,  fan jets, amount of jobs done in a day etc. All of frames & glass for me every time on every job as if the customer is stood behind me. Vents every time also. Some cleaners can’t even be bothered to turn their brush head down to rest square on the glass especially in confined spaces. They’re shooting water up the glass ffs.

Robbo’s comments are spot on as are Reflection’s.

If we’re talking parts per million affecting the clean then you have to clean the top of the frames. You can’t rinse to the top rubber on the first floor or above & not pick up any dirt. You can’t be that accurate. Even if it’s light dust it will affect it. Yes you might get away with it sometimes, especially those that clean 4 weekly. And yes you’ll get the odd bad seal or badly painted wooden window but they are few and far between. Too many splash & dashers.

[Dry Clean]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

This thread is certainly showing who does the job properly customers and potential customers do watch us working , I had a customer who had cctv on his property phone me and thank us for doing all the windows and frames on his house at the time he was at his main property in Australia he sacked the previous wi Dow cleaner as he wasn’t doing the bathroom windows and missing out frame tops , we didn’t realise we were being filmed at the time but it just goes to show doing a thorough job each time weather the customer is there or nor payes off

SHOCK, after reading that in future I will think twice when peeing in the customers flower beds, who I'm I kidding when you need to pee you need to pee.

[nathankaye]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

Were tbey trad cleaners or wfp though?  Im guessing trad as all the houses that have wfp cleaners should have nice clean frames.  Beit if they are cleaned 4wkly 8wkly

[The Jester of Wibbly]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

Were tbey trad cleaners or wfp though?  Im guessing trad as all the houses that have wfp cleaners should have nice clean frames.  Beit if they are cleaned 4wkly 8wkly

Not sure as i did not want to quiz her too much.  She's booked me 4 weekly. 

On investigation the top frames and sills were a total mess.  The side frames seemed ok other than needing a maintenance clean.   So I assume it was wfp. 

However no matter what the method is the customer has a right to a quality service. 

[Simon Trapani]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

Were tbey trad cleaners or wfp though?  Im guessing trad as all the houses that have wfp cleaners should have nice clean frames.  Beit if they are cleaned 4wkly 8wkly

Or obviously not Nathan. Because from what we’ve been reading on this thread, not every wfp’er is cleaning all of the frame all of the time, including yourself. Could have been either.

[nathankaye]

Bit of a coincidence today relating to this thread.  I was cleaning a house on a private estate when a lady from the house opposite came out and said to me "after watching you clean l would like to join your round please because I saw you clean frames too and they look fab" 

She went on to say my last window cleaner only cleaned the glass and felt it was not right and felt cheated. 

Honestly.  This DID happen this morning and made me chuckle to myself.

Were tbey trad cleaners or wfp though?  Im guessing trad as all the houses that have wfp cleaners should have nice clean frames.  Beit if they are cleaned 4wkly 8wkly

Or obviously not Nathan. Because from what we’ve been reading on this thread, not every wfp’er is cleaning all of the frame all of the time, including yourself. Could have been either.

Myself and ones who have said they skip frames or the top of the frame have done so because they are clean. Therefore this person would see she had clean frames and clean windows. So if the frames are dirty then its fair to say its a traditional cleaner.

When I was trad, when it came to cleaning the frames and especially the top frame it took ages. Also when doing the upstairs top frames you hadto make sure you had plenty of water on your mop and in the bucket on belt to do a good job. Then using the wet scrim, i would finish cleaning the frame.   If a was just cleaning the windows, i would mop the glass, but the ends ofthe mop would also wet the side frames and so after blading the water off I would again use the wet scrim for the sill and a quick wipe on the side frames. But not every trad cleaner would do this

[Simon Trapani]

I cleaned glass & sills only when trad else I would’ve been there all day.

[Splash & dash]

Yep, been a real eye opener & explains a lot of peoples problems with runs, spotting,  fan jets, amount of jobs done in a day etc. All of frames & glass for me every time on every job as if the customer is stood behind me. Vents every time also. Some cleaners can’t even be bothered to turn their brush head down to rest square on the glass especially in confined spaces. They’re shooting water up the glass ffs.

Robbo’s comments are spot on as are Reflection’s.

If we’re talking parts per million affecting the clean then you have to clean the top of the frames. You can’t rinse to the top rubber on the first floor or above & not pick up any dirt. You can’t be that accurate. Even if it’s light dust it will affect it. Yes you might get away with it sometimes, especially those that clean 4 weekly. And yes you’ll get the odd bad seal or badly painted wooden window but they are few and far between. Too many splash & dashers.

Exelent post glad Ime not the only one who feels this way , come on lads it’s not difficult to do a proper job I think this may explain why window cleaners are viewed by many as unskilled up your game and prove you are professional and charge accordingly