[nathankaye]

We often get debates on here about pricing and a days wage, one area compared to next.
Seems some people put some extra effort into travelling to go make some money if desired amount cant be found in ones own area.   Sounds like a good plan to me, if your able to do so. Lets face it tho, its not like how some move countries and leave families inorder to find money to send back home tho is it.

[jonboywalton75]

We often get debates on here about pricing and a days wage, one area compared to next.
Seems some people put some extra effort into travelling to go make some money if desired amount cant be found in ones own area.   Sounds like a good plan to me, if your able to do so. Lets face it tho, its not like how some move countries and leave families inorder to find money to send back home tho is it.

Talking to a Romanian taxi driver in Bath last week
Earned £300 a year back home
Been over here 6 years earns £4000 a year and thinks it's a Kings ransom

[AuRavelling79]

I've an awkward one to quote for tomorrow.  She's had at least three other local window cleaners before me and I've heard one of them (Ian Giles) moan about her, so I'm going to charge high, charge an initial cleaning fee, and be ultra ultra clear and direct with regards frequency.  I'm guessing she's running out of local window cleaners to mess about, so hopefully will be more 'positive' with me.

It's a big place, they've tennis courts 'n' stuff, but the customer is absolutely drop dead gorgeous too; she's a fitness instructor, tall, curves in the right places, long blonde hair; really fit.

Wor Lass thinks we shouldn't quote for the job though. 

I reckon she's used to "dazzling 'em" to get her way.  Your lass is right. I'd let her do the negotiations! (Tho' you might sneak a quick pic to see whether forum members agree with your assessment of the owner - all in the interest of objectivity, of course!)

[SeanK]

We often get debates on here about pricing and a days wage, one area compared to next.
Seems some people put some extra effort into travelling to go make some money if desired amount cant be found in ones own area.   Sounds like a good plan to me, if your able to do so. Lets face it tho, its not like how some move countries and leave families inorder to find money to send back home tho is it.

Yep 20/25 miles from me I could demand two maybe three times the money I get now, its not much different to my own area
wealth wise there just seems to be a shortage of shiners and customers who are used to paying more.
Thing is I'm happy with having my work on my doorstep and with what I earn but I would be lying if I said I haven't been tempted
at times.
Certainly if I was starting out in life it would be a no brainer.

[EandM]

I've just encountered one.

New customer, house needs cleaning by the weekend, arranged to clean it this morning. Arrived and no sign of customer, Cleaned windows, left invoice and then received 3 missed calls and finally a text :

Apparently the windows are still dirty (despite the use of Virosol and two soaks before rinsing) and I'd quoted a maximum of 2 hours but cleaned it in just over 1...as customer was in but obviously hiding! I have offered to rectify any issues but as I'm old and tired something tells me it's better just to write it off.

Followed that up with another new customer who was delighted and has booked in for six weeks time.

[Smurf]

I would have not cleaned it myself if the customer did not answer the door. I treat first cleans as one off's so they have to be present and make full payment before I leave.

Looks like you have been stiched up like a kipper there bud.

[Smurf]

Getting back on topic I think the main problem with pricing is matching the customer’s expectations with the job in hand.
Some customer expectations are way too high so needs addressing on the site survey and quote.
Regards to time the job takes I've found it's irrelevant really if the customer is happy with the end results.

[EandM]

I would have not cleaned it myself if the customer did not answer the door. I treat first cleans as one off's so they have to be present and make full payment before I leave.

Looks like you have been stiched up like a kipper there bud.

I think you're probably right. I've asked what the problem is and have received no less than 14 photo's that show...well very little actually except that there is still some render in some of the corners.

Brown, grained upvc  - will spray on Sandtex upvc cleaner get that out or does only work on smooth plastic ?

[Smurf]

So in a nutshell he was expecting a builders clean for the price of a normal window clean. Hmmmm..was he asian by any chance?. 

[Ian101]

The penny dropped on me a few years back after reading, posting and experiencing bad customers and it goes like this

The world is full of great window cleaners and bad window cleaners along with great customers and bad customers - it only goes wrong when a great window cleaner takes on a bad customer and a bad window cleaner takes on a great customer the trick is putting great with great otherwise that's when the problems start.

I along with everyone else on here consider myself to be a great window cleaner so its why Ive been zero tolerance to messers for last 4 years and never been as happy and earned as much since then.

 

[Ian101]

however as great as my residential customers are by November I will be commercial only 

[EandM]

So in a nutshell he was expecting a builders clean for the price of a normal window clean. Hmmmm..was he asian by any chance?. 

No and it was a her.

I was asked to remove the render that seems to be all over the windows and the frames but told not to worry about the paint spots ...? 90% of the render was successfully removed with Virosol, an extra soak and a good scrub & rinse. The render that's left is either embedded or etched into the frames. To clean with upvc cleaner, if that will even work on grained plastic, will make the original price look like a downpayment - which I'm sure they won't pay either. I'm happy to write the job off as I don't possess the patience or time to deal with anyone like that. In 25 years of working I've only encountered 3 people with this mentality so i suppose I should be grateful. Last message complained that I hadn't dried the windows - counts to 10.... I encountered the father in law, who lives in the annex, who was a posturing sort and the conversation, although polite, led to me expect trouble. He has a different window cleaner, who she doesn't like, who is also cheaper - I invite you to draw your own conclusion on the topic of conversation after I left this morning...

[EandM]

The penny dropped on me a few years back after reading, posting and experiencing bad customers and it goes like this

The world is full of great window cleaners and bad window cleaners along with great customers and bad customers - it only goes wrong when a great window cleaner takes on a bad customer and a bad window cleaner takes on a great customer the trick is putting great with great otherwise that's when the problems start.

I along with everyone else on here consider myself to be a great window cleaner so its why Ive been zero tolerance to messers for last 4 years and never been as happy and earned as much since then.

 

I like your thinking   

I just have zero tolerance.

[AuRavelling79]

So in a nutshell he was expecting a builders clean for the price of a normal window clean. Hmmmm..was he asian by any chance?. 

No and it was a her.

I was asked to remove the render that seems to be all over the windows and the frames but told not to worry about the paint spots ...? 90% of the render was successfully removed with Virosol, an extra soak and a good scrub & rinse. The render that's left is either embedded or etched into the frames. To clean with upvc cleaner, if that will even work on grained plastic, will make the original price look like a downpayment - which I'm sure they won't pay either. I'm happy to write the job off as I don't possess the patience or time to deal with anyone like that. In 25 years of working I've only encountered 3 people with this mentality so i suppose I should be grateful. Last message complained that I hadn't dried the windows - counts to 10.... I encountered the father in law, who lives in the annex, who was a posturing sort and the conversation, although polite, led to me expect trouble. He has a different window cleaner, who she doesn't like, who is also cheaper - I invite you to draw your own conclusion on the topic of conversation after I left this morning...

Had to be done by the weekend eh? Still plenty of time to go and put the dirt back on for them. 

[Spruce]

however as great as my residential customers are by November I will be commercial only 

Why have you chosen to put all your eggs in one basket if I may ask Ian?

I have recently pondered this as I see that 2% of my customers are commercial but account for 25% of my turnover.

What I haven't estimated is the time to turnover ratio of commercial against residential.

We once lost a big commercial clean we used to do when the owners declared insolvency. Thankfully we got paid the full amount but loosing that hurt financially for a while. Annually, it was our biggest job we have had in the 14 years of window cleaning.

.

[Ian101]

however as great as my residential customers are by November I will be commercial only 

Why have you chosen to put all your eggs in one basket if I may ask Ian?

I have recently pondered this as I see that 2% of my customers are commercial but account for 25% of my turnover.

What I haven't estimated is the time to turnover ratio of commercial against residential.

We once lost a big commercial clean we used to do when the owners declared insolvency. Thankfully we got paid the full amount but loosing that hurt financially for a while. Annually, it was our biggest job we have had in the 14 years of window cleaning.

.

Hi Spruce - no problem.

The simple answer is commercial pays more if done correctly as your 2% / 25% shows also wont just be cleaning windows but will be doing other exterior at height cleaning along with commercial pressure washing.

Longer answer is expansion and longevity  - this is just my opinion but the effort and time required to grow a multi van residential operation is massive and expensive compared to the reward that you get back, vat issue on residential  and I think eventually you will hit a limit on what can be earned with residential plus no barrier to entry or very low cost so competition can set up easily plus staff can and will jump ship to go on their own so lots of little fires to constantly fight.

Commercial not without problems obviously and you do need some cash in the bank to keep things rolling when you have people on 90 days but effort v reward is better in my opinion plus once you have done a few jobs worth a few grand chasing around doing windows for £10 a pop seems pointless (just my opinion)

I may be wrong but we will see but in need of a new challenge after 7 years.

[dazmond]

if your planning to stay as a sole trader you cant beat having your eggs in hundreds of different baskets!you lose one or two and it isnt a problem.lose a commercial contract worth thousands of pounds and it could hurt a lot and almost put you out of business.

theres still good money to be made out of residential with minimal stress/hassle.i do have some commercial but their offices/childrens nurseries/childrens homes etc(no contract work).

i very rarely have problems with customers.if i do i drop them but its rare as hens teeth.

[lal]

I've just encountered one.

New customer, house needs cleaning by the weekend, arranged to clean it this morning. Arrived and no sign of customer, Cleaned windows, left invoice and then received 3 missed calls and finally a text :

Apparently the windows are still dirty (despite the use of Virosol and two soaks before rinsing) and I'd quoted a maximum of 2 hours but cleaned it in just over 1...as customer was in but obviously hiding! I have offered to rectify any issues but as I'm old and tired something tells me it's better just to write it off.

Followed that up with another new customer who was delighted and has booked in for six weeks time.

There is no way on a first clean for a new customer that i would start cleaning the windows, if they didn't answer the
door or weren't there, i would try ringing their phone, if still no joy, i would just walk away, Zero tolerance for messers.
Lal

[Arnold Palmer]

There is no way on a first clean for a new customer that i would start cleaning the windows, if they didn't answer the
door or weren't there, i would try ringing their phone, if still no joy, i would just walk away, Zero tolerance for messers.
Lal

Seriously?

We never meet a substantial percentage of our customers because they are out at work when we visit, even on the first clean.

[slap bash]

It`s not the labour charge that cost so much but all the equipment one need to do these jobs. Just filtering the water to clean a conservatory,  costs a lot of money as well as the rest.