[Dave Willis]

must have been somebody else then PAL

[CleanClear]

2nd day went well. I'm impressed. I still get a bit nervous with all the bubbles. I use fan jets so not sure if that makes a difference to what bubbles you produce as opposed to using pencil jets ? I've still no clue as to exactly what its doing to the water but it looks good and feels good and thats enough for me.  I done a nursing home today too, which i also clean inside so i got to scrutinise the results. Spot on.

[Dave Willis]

any idea how many ml you put in per litre of pure?
I've got half a dozen bottles of HG fluid. It's quite thick stuff in neat form.

http://oc.hg.eu/products/show/id/8732/window_cleaner

[Shane sharples]

who . not me  I'm to tight to put owt in my tank MATEY

must have been somebody else then PAL

Everyone's so friendly on here 

[M & C Window Cleaning]

My two penneth.
I've used hot water, hot water with vision, and cold with vision.
Results for me are as follows:
Hot water and hot with vision, I can work considerably quicker.
Cold with vision, I can work a little quicker, emphasis on 'little.'
However, there is no discernible difference to the quality of the finish either to the glass or the frames that I can see, no matter what I use. I've had no comments from customers about how much better it is as I did when I switched to WFP.
Just my observations.

[AuRavelling79]

I clean my van with wfp and "pure" water only. It comes up fine.

Now - if my van is utterly filthy because I've been a lazy git then I will still do the roof and top of the sides and bonnet with pure alone but I will dip my brush in my bucket with some washing up liquid in it and use that on the muddy lower sides and wheels and then rinse off.

Similarly when I used to do conny roofs gutters and soffits - if they were minging I'd dip my brush in detergent and give them a going over then clean my brush (or switch from cill brush to window cleaning brush) and use pure only to finish off.

On 99% of window cleaning I just use pure alone. The only time I would ever use soap would be if I had a minging green first clean and then I'd probably use the immersion heater too. Then I'd rinse my brush and go over in pure.

[CleanClear]

any idea how many ml you put in per litre of pure?
I've got half a dozen bottles of HG fluid. It's quite thick stuff in neat form.

http://oc.hg.eu/products/show/id/8732/window_cleaner

No sorry Dave. I should of done it properly, i.e measure it out . But i never i just squirted. If i had to guess i'd say almost a thimble full. And that was into a 350 litre tank.

[CleanClear]

I'll tell you another good one to try i reckon, and it was using that a week or two ago that got me thinking again about adding stuff. Thats "LimeLite". I have a spray bottle of it, got it from Poundstretchers i think it was, if you read the ingredients on that well that is Limonene based and has the citrus smell. Anyway i found that either squirted on my brush (if going high up), or direct on the glass if ground floor, was great for removing large bird soiling, egg etc... Gives the same smooth feel, same froth.

[Dave Willis]

I've stopped experimenting for now - going to stick with Vision for a few months, see how it goes in the drought and sunny weather we'll get in the spring. 

[dave f]

that's if you have any custys left

[Dave Willis]

I have to beat them off with a stick these days.

[Carl2009]

Interesting thread.

I have used RO/DI cold water Pure Freedom system since starting in 2009. I've never added anything to the tank, nor would I.
I use TFR (Evan's TSR 100 or 200) on green uPVC and most first cleans, and G101 on fly sh*t (the only thing i've found  that does the job) in either hand-sprayers or from a trolley, depending on size of job. The TFR is necessary to soften the algae and ground in dirt on first-cleans, but unnecessary on any future cleans, if regular.

I weighed up moving to hot - and couldn't justify the set up and running costs for the additional speed it would undoubtedly give me mainly on first cleans only.

I saw an improvement in ease of clean (not necessarily speed) when Gardiners brought out the dual trim Supalite - it moved across the glass easier than the single trim, so was easier on the arms and shoulders.

Additives. Necessary, nay essential, for bad first cleans and connies (unless you want to be there for double the time); totally unnecessary imho on most regular maintenance cleans. I use TFR on my van to soften road film and rinse with tap water.  However most windows are not the same as my van which like yours is sprayed directly with all sorts of horrid stuff, unless by a busy road with spray when I accept an additive might help  if added in sufficient volume to the water.

I do wonder if guys are rinsing with water with an additive whether the residue (of which there must be some) will form a microscopic, slightly sticky layer on the glass to which dirt dust and pollen will stick more readily (look at the top of your Fairy bottle). This alone would stop me from using any additive in my tank.

Finally, ppm versus ppb debate a while back, i'll say this. If a window is totally clear at say 004 or 005 ppm (it is, i've tested it on several occasions by accident     )why would it be necessary to move to a ppb system?

[Jonny 87]

Interesting thread.

I have used RO/DI cold water Pure Freedom system since starting in 2009. I've never added anything to the tank, nor would I.
I use TFR (Evan's TSR 100 or 200) on green uPVC and most first cleans, and G101 on fly sh*t (the only thing i've found  that does the job) in either hand-sprayers or from a trolley, depending on size of job. The TFR is necessary to soften the algae and ground in dirt on first-cleans, but unnecessary on any future cleans, if regular.

I weighed up moving to hot - and couldn't justify the set up and running costs for the additional speed it would undoubtedly give me mainly on first cleans only.

I saw an improvement in ease of clean (not necessarily speed) when Gardiners brought out the dual trim Supalite - it moved across the glass easier than the single trim, so was easier on the arms and shoulders.

Additives. Necessary, nay essential, for bad first cleans and connies (unless you want to be there for double the time); totally unnecessary imho on most regular maintenance cleans. I use TFR on my van to soften road film and rinse with tap water.  However most windows are not the same as my van which like yours is sprayed directly with all sorts of horrid stuff, unless by a busy road with spray when I accept an additive might help  if added in sufficient volume to the water.

I do wonder if guys are rinsing with water with an additive whether the residue (of which there must be some) will form a microscopic, slightly sticky layer on the glass to which dirt dust and pollen will stick more readily (look at the top of your Fairy bottle). This alone would stop me from using any additive in my tank.

Finally, ppm versus ppb debate a while back, i'll say this. If a window is totally clear at say 004 or 005 ppm (it is, i've tested it on several occasions by accident     )why would it be necessary to move to a ppb system?

To be fair on vision I've actually found with the latest version windows stay cleaner for longer. Rain water seem to wash the windows clean which is strange.

The dirt from all these storms made my windows filthy, but last night we had heavy rain and my windows are actually pretty clean. Someone could say they have washed them and id believe it.

So vision definitely doesn't leave a sticky residue on the glass that attracts dirt. I've been using vision in one form or another for about 4 years now and I can categorically say that's not the case.

[SeanK]

Interesting thread.

I have used RO/DI cold water Pure Freedom system since starting in 2009. I've never added anything to the tank, nor would I.
I use TFR (Evan's TSR 100 or 200) on green uPVC and most first cleans, and G101 on fly sh*t (the only thing i've found  that does the job) in either hand-sprayers or from a trolley, depending on size of job. The TFR is necessary to soften the algae and ground in dirt on first-cleans, but unnecessary on any future cleans, if regular.

I weighed up moving to hot - and couldn't justify the set up and running costs for the additional speed it would undoubtedly give me mainly on first cleans only.

I saw an improvement in ease of clean (not necessarily speed) when Gardiners brought out the dual trim Supalite - it moved across the glass easier than the single trim, so was easier on the arms and shoulders.

Additives. Necessary, nay essential, for bad first cleans and connies (unless you want to be there for double the time); totally unnecessary imho on most regular maintenance cleans. I use TFR on my van to soften road film and rinse with tap water.  However most windows are not the same as my van which like yours is sprayed directly with all sorts of horrid stuff, unless by a busy road with spray when I accept an additive might help  if added in sufficient volume to the water.

I do wonder if guys are rinsing with water with an additive whether the residue (of which there must be some) will form a microscopic, slightly sticky layer on the glass to which dirt dust and pollen will stick more readily (look at the top of your Fairy bottle). This alone would stop me from using any additive in my tank.

Finally, ppm versus ppb debate a while back, i'll say this. If a window is totally clear at say 004 or 005 ppm (it is, i've tested it on several occasions by accident     )why would it be necessary to move to a ppb system?

To be fair on vision I've actually found with the latest version windows stay cleaner for longer. Rain water seem to wash the windows clean which is strange.

The dirt from all these storms made my windows filthy, but last night we had heavy rain and my windows are actually pretty clean. Someone could say they have washed them and id believe it.

So vision definitely doesn't leave a sticky residue on the glass that attracts dirt. I've been using vision in one form or another for about 4 years now and I can categorically say that's not the case.

Now come on guys do posts like this not show you what sort of numpties these guys are.

[Shane sharples]

When I go back to my customers after a month, I wonder whether they have employed another window cleaner after iv been to clean them properly, I can't understand how they are so clean after a month and I only use pure 

[SeanK]

Interesting thread.

I have used RO/DI cold water Pure Freedom system since starting in 2009. I've never added anything to the tank, nor would I.
I use TFR (Evan's TSR 100 or 200) on green uPVC and most first cleans, and G101 on fly sh*t (the only thing i've found  that does the job) in either hand-sprayers or from a trolley, depending on size of job. The TFR is necessary to soften the algae and ground in dirt on first-cleans, but unnecessary on any future cleans, if regular.

I weighed up moving to hot - and couldn't justify the set up and running costs for the additional speed it would undoubtedly give me mainly on first cleans only.

I saw an improvement in ease of clean (not necessarily speed) when Gardiners brought out the dual trim Supalite - it moved across the glass easier than the single trim, so was easier on the arms and shoulders.

Additives. Necessary, nay essential, for bad first cleans and connies (unless you want to be there for double the time); totally unnecessary imho on most regular maintenance cleans. I use TFR on my van to soften road film and rinse with tap water.  However most windows are not the same as my van which like yours is sprayed directly with all sorts of horrid stuff, unless by a busy road with spray when I accept an additive might help  if added in sufficient volume to the water.

I do wonder if guys are rinsing with water with an additive whether the residue (of which there must be some) will form a microscopic, slightly sticky layer on the glass to which dirt dust and pollen will stick more readily (look at the top of your Fairy bottle). This alone would stop me from using any additive in my tank.

Finally, ppm versus ppb debate a while back, i'll say this. If a window is totally clear at say 004 or 005 ppm (it is, i've tested it on several occasions by accident     )why would it be necessary to move to a ppb system?

Not a bad post Carl, but using a chemical cleaner on a first clean or a conservatory roof is a lot different to what these guys are talking about which is adding 1 or 2ml of it to 100 litres of water.
It wouldn't have enough of the chemical to make any difference.

[SeanK]

When I go back to my customers after a month, I wonder whether they have employed another window cleaner after iv been to clean them properly, I can't understand how they are so clean after a month and I only use pure 

Maybe like Vision the pure is turning the glass into self cleaning.

[jk999]

Dave f your saying trad guys clean better don't make me laugh ,there are quite a few grad guys round me and not one off them can do the job properly don't wash frame, only scrim little windows it's a joke ,five years down line trad cleaners are gonna be rare especially if health n safety clamp down more on ladders a friend of mine is 64 and has just had to go to a machine because he has started to lose a lot of ladder work through health n safety

[Shane sharples]

When I go back to my customers after a month, I wonder whether they have employed another window cleaner after iv been to clean them properly, I can't understand how they are so clean after a month and I only use pure 

Maybe like Vision the pure is turning the glass into self cleaning.

The other thing iv noticed is that some hydrophobic glass has now gone hydrophilic! now is that just coincidence that vision does that too? or does pure do something to glass on its own over time? 🤔

[dave f]

jk999 I am not saying trad guys do a better job at all  I am  just saying all this  about putting stuff in the tank to make supa dupa clean .and almost implying you've a custy for life .like I said I picked up a custy whose cleaner had not done conny window for years and frames until I came along got every thing  as it should be .only to get the built for some one cheaper so imo why go to all the expence  on something that dose not ensure you have a loyal customer there is no such beast hope ive cleared this up for you