[Dave Willis]

Oh yes .......... another friggin' Vision thread.

I have to admit straight away I was never a fan of the 'Vision Boys', I didn't like the way they appeared to use the forum to get rich quick and their approach reminded me of the other great con - 'Magica One Go' so I made it my mission to basically take the pee out of them. Around the same time I started adding GG4 to my tank and later Ecover multi cleaner. GG4 in particular seemed to replicate the results everyone was getting with Vision (although I'd never tried it).
Then I started to get a white slime in my tank after several months so began to get a bit jittery about GG4.
Anyhow, I got my hands on some 'new improved Vision' and gave it a try.

As far as Jigsaws website goes I'd say they were fairly accurate with their claims. A small amount (2ml per 100ml of pure) definitely makes a difference to pure water. It makes it foam and gives a little slip on the glass. It seems to give extra shine to both glass and plastic frames and seems to give a whiter finish to upvc. Is it quicker? difficult one that ......... I'd say no it can't possibly be quicker, the water may look to cascade quicker down the glass (but you'd be hard pressed to measure it) the water appears to react better particularly to hydrophylic glass but I don't think it dissolves dirt any quicker (again hard to prove). The only way it would make you faster is if it boosts your rinsing confidence I think - you may rinse faster and clear off to the next pane believing it's better.

To be perfectly honest - I like it!
You don't need it.
I think it's expensive.
I would like it a tad stronger (more like the original version I'm told).
But I think David Kemp and his buddies are on to something, probably won't change the world of waterfed poling but it's there to try if you want to - choice is yours.
Good stuff.
PS. I don't know what's in it - I managed to replicate the smell of it with a couple of products but still haven't a clue. 


I might add I've been paid pooploads of money and free Vision for the next thirty years by David Kemp.

[Smurf]

People that like vision and use it like me any many others they tend to keep quite now in fear of ridicule.

[Clever Forum Name]

lol

[tlwcs]

I had 1 of the first launch and to be fair never got on with the bubbles. I still have half a bottle somewhere.
What I don't understand is how 3 guys bring to market a product that seems to be well received for it then to be revised more than once and then for 2 of the founds to drop out.
All a bit strange IMO
Tony

[Rich Wilts]

I use GG4. This product is a miracle cure-all. It's been known to shovel snow from customers paths, prevents water on patios from freezing, even down to -85°C, occasionally manipulates you into writing drivel about Vision on cleaning forums, it collects outstanding payments and to top it all the uPVC window frames shine all the more.

You Vision boys are so yesterday.

[Smurf]

I use GG4. This product is a miracle cure-all. It's been known to shovel snow from customers paths, prevents water on patios from freezing, even down to -85°C, occasionally manipulates you into writing drivel about Vision on cleaning forums, it collects outstanding payments and to top it all the uPVC window frames shine all the more.

You Vision boys are so yesterday.

 

[jk999]

I use GG4. This product is a miracle cure-all. It's been known to shovel snow from customers paths, prevents water on patios from freezing, even down to -85°C, occasionally manipulates you into writing drivel about Vision on cleaning forums, it collects outstanding payments and to top it all the uPVC window frames shine all the more.

You Vision boys are so yesterday.

there's always one

[Smudger]

People that like vision and use it like me any many others they tend to keep quite now in fear of ridicule.

The forum will  have those that will always try to rubbish any new idea, or anything that does not fit their "criteria"  - history is full of them, they were even given a name "ludites"

If vision and gg4 work for those who use it, then more and more will take it up ( just like WFP ) if it doesn't then it will disappear like a deloren stainless steel car..

Darran

[AuRavelling79]

David Willis - Poacher turned Gamekeeper! 

[SeanK]

People that like vision and use it like me any many others they tend to keep quite now in fear of ridicule.

The forum will  have those that will always try to rubbish any new idea, or anything that does not fit their "criteria"  - history is full of them, they were even given a name "ludites"

If vision and gg4 work for those who use it, then more and more will take it up ( just like WFP ) if it doesn't then it will disappear like a deloren stainless steel car..

Darran

Rubbish, people spend millions on over the counter tooth bleachers/whiteners every year even though the evidence is there
that proves they don't work it the same with many products.
The evidence is also there to prove that these additives don't work and its not hard to find, I wondered after Kempy asked
Dave to contact him on the last Vision post how long it would be until we read something like this.
Use your logic Darran these guys would tell you that GG4 doesn't work and yet you get the same effect using it so does
that make the Vision guys ludites.

[Smudger]

David Willis - Poacher turned Gamekeeper! 

👍

[Smudger]

No it makes them buisness men, trying to promote their product over a rival

Think you need to check up the meaning of luddite  - I'm sure you have a paper based dictionary somewhere about the house 

Darran

[Smurf]

I'm more of a troglodyte myself 

[SeanK]

No it makes them buisness men, trying to promote their product over a rival

Think you need to check up the meaning of luddite  - I'm sure you have a paper based dictionary somewhere about the house 

Darran

I think you need to check out what happens to a concentrated product when its over diluted and then come back and tell
others that they are not wasting their money putting any of these products into their water.
It seems like your afraid to read the truth encase it ruins the magic or that you might end up feeling foolish.

[Smudger]

There are worse things to be 

I'm sure your cave has many mod cons !!! 

Darran

[SeanK]

I wonder what it took for Dave to sell his soul ? I mean you wouldn't be much of a person to be as critical as
he was on their product if it was just about taking the pee.

[Smudger]

No it makes them buisness men, trying to promote their product over a rival

Think you need to check up the meaning of luddite  - I'm sure you have a paper based dictionary somewhere about the house 

Darran

I think you need to check out what happens to a concentrated product when its over diluted and then come back and tell
others that they are not wasting their money putting any of these products into their water.
It seems like your afraid to read the truth encase it ruins the magic or that you might end up feeling foolish.

What I will say is, well before vision, I noted that on a good percentage of properties with White upvc frames that had been cleaned every four weeks by WFP looked "dull" clean but "dull" one or two customers commented on this ( initially I thought they had just got used to them being clean ) so what I did was give them a first clean again ( using g101  - diluted ) and the frames were definitely brighter. We took time out to first clean other dull frames with the same results, then, vision arrived I used it and it definitely brightened the frames, I think it's far to expensive for the qty you get, and Dave suggested gg4 changed to that - since then, I've been more than happy with the  frames and not had a single comment from customers that the windows don't look as good as they once did. These people are the ones who's opinions I care about they pay my bills - they are also unaware of vision and whether I'm using it or not so I think in this case practical experience trumps theoretical case studies.

But I'm happy to have a read so please post the links thx

Darran

[Dave Willis]

They could be wasting their money I suppose but that's up to them. I'll most likely get some more in when this bottle runs out - like I said I do actually quite like it. I'd agree with Seank - it's unlikely to clean much better in such small doses but I'd be happy if it could be proven either way. I do like what it does to pure water though.

As for the mystery of two partners leaving the company - who knows? But my guess would be that there's simply not enough profit in it for three versus the hassle to market it/bottle it and post it out.

[Smudger]

I wonder what it took for Dave to sell his soul ? I mean you wouldn't be much of a person to be as critical as
he was on their product if it was just about taking the pee.

Dave has a very dry sense of humour, and by his own admission had not tried vision, he has, and now learned his lesson 
and a clever move by them

Darran

[Rich Wilts]

I use GG4. This product is a miracle cure-all. It's been known to shovel snow from customers paths, prevents water on patios from freezing, even down to -85°C, occasionally manipulates you into writing drivel about Vision on cleaning forums, it collects outstanding payments and to top it all the uPVC window frames shine all the more.

You Vision boys are so yesterday.

there's always one

Thats what they said to Einstein.