[NWH]

Run of the mill work is normal houses in culdesacs terrace houses flats  council or ex council etc the stuff a canvasser will 9 times out of 10 get you people that have had WCs before and then sacked them off. This all looks lovely on paper but some on here are making sound like you've got prats queuing up to give them 20-30 grand so they can go and clean someone else's work,any person with half a brain would either buy a round so they haven't got to pay someone 20% for the privilege lol. If your getting people to do this good on ya but to say it's a great opertunity is unrealistic. I wonder how many people who have done this job before return to it and buy a franchise.

[Ian Lancaster]

To everyone who keeps saying franchising won't work or isn't worth buying into, you are entitled to your opinion and have every right to voice that opinion.

But opinions don't alter facts, and these speak for themselves.  There are 25 franchise businesses around the country all operating my system and in various stages of development.  Additionally there are many more who have devised their own systems.

I appointed my first franchisee in 2006, so our 10 year anniversary is coming up this year.  We are still a viable and lucrative organisation and will continue to be so.  If franchising were so beset with problems and if 'no-one in their right minds' would buy a franchise then we would have collapsed years ago.

No matter how much you would like to be able to say 'I told you so' that won't change the fact, demonstrated by years of experience that franchising works, and works very well - at least as well as employing.  Both methods have problems, of course they do but no business on earth that has personnel other than the principle is problem free but if everyone had the attitude 'it'll never work' there wouldn't be huge multinationals and modest SME's

[Dave Willis]

Well said that man 

[Smurf]

It's still interesting to find out that some can keep 100% of add-on/new  work they gain themselves and others have to still pay a percentage though. Can anyone that is running a franchise business explain their reasoning behind this please?

[Ian Lancaster]

I don't know of any franchised organisation that allows franchisees to build an independent customer base.  This would undermine the Franchise Agreement and render the franchise unworkable.  I think you may have misunderstood when (was it Mick Kent?) said he didn't charge royalties on 'extras'.  He was referring to 'one off' jobs such as gutter clearing/fascia cleaning etc.  We charge royalties on all regular work of whatever nature.  If during the working day a franchisee is asked to do a 'one off' and this doesn't prevent him from completing his day's regular work then we turn a blind eye.  If the job were a 'repeat', i.e. regular then he would be expected to add it to his customer base and pay royalties on it.  This is covered in the Franchise Agreement.  It doesn't make sense that a franchisee would be encouraged to build a separate round.

[ChumBucket]

So really you don't have a clue what they get upto then Vin?

No you're quite right.  They are all fleecing me mercilessly.  Did you read my post?

By the end of 2017 two of them will be at the VAT limit so if they do have work on the side they'll have the Vatman to answer to rather than me.

Vin

By the end of 2017 I'll be prime minister!!

[Smurf]

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it don't take long to figure out what services make the most profit as domestic run of the mill window cleaning is not high on the list compared to other services if priced right.

[Nick Day]

This is a very interesting subject.
The real issue is "goodwiil" i.e who owns it?
In the late 1990's the courts in the U.K decided that any goodwill built up by the franchisee is owned by the franchisee. This is a case involving Pizza Express.
The Australian courts have ruled that all goodwill is owned by the Franchisee. It would be interesting to see if the courts in this country would also decide the same. I suspect they would.
But it also raises the question, if a person is doing your work, with your name is he a Franchisee or subcontractor.
The phrase involving a barge pole springs to mind.

[Perfect Windows]

* [EDITED] Changed my mind.  Not worth the argument.

[NWH]

My charity is support the franchisee they need all the help they can get lol.

[davids3511]

* Changed my mind.  Not worth the argument.

I don't know why you bother in the first place.

[Perfect Windows]

* Changed my mind.  Not worth the argument.

I don't know why you bother in the first place.

I know.  I haven't posted in ages and I really should know better.  I gave up offering advice quite some time ago but occasionally I crack.

Back to the shadows...

Vin

[NWH]

I could put someone off buying into a window cleaning franchise as quick as I could put them off buying an ionic van with thermopure system in it for 30 +k.

[davids3511]

This is a very interesting subject.
The real issue is "goodwiil" i.e who owns it?
In the late 1990's the courts in the U.K decided that any goodwill built up by the franchisee is owned by the franchisee. This is a case involving Pizza Express.
The Australian courts have ruled that all goodwill is owned by the Franchisee. It would be interesting to see if the courts in this country would also decide the same. I suspect they would.
But it also raises the question, if a person is doing your work, with your name is he a Franchisee or subcontractor.
The phrase involving a barge pole springs to mind.

You haven't actually read that case though, have you? It was allowed because Pizza express was a soft franchise setup at the time. They provided no training, no uniform, no operations manual and the franchisees paid for their own advertising. They also didn't pay a lump sum to buy into the franchise in the first place. None on this would apply with an Ian Lancaster franchise setup.

[ChumBucket]

* Changed my mind.  Not worth the argument.

I don't know why you bother in the first place.

I know.  I haven't posted in ages and I really should know better.  I gave up offering advice quite some time ago but occasionally I crack.

Back to the shadows...

Vin

It was bliss then you went and ruined it!!

[davids3511]

* Changed my mind.  Not worth the argument.

I don't know why you bother in the first place.

I know.  I haven't posted in ages and I really should know better.  I gave up offering advice quite some time ago but occasionally I crack.

Back to the shadows...

Vin

Really by now you should have accepted that you're wrong, it'll never work. And don't forget, leaflets don't work either.

[ChumBucket]

This is a very interesting subject.
The real issue is "goodwiil" i.e who owns it?
In the late 1990's the courts in the U.K decided that any goodwill built up by the franchisee is owned by the franchisee. This is a case involving Pizza Express.
The Australian courts have ruled that all goodwill is owned by the Franchisee. It would be interesting to see if the courts in this country would also decide the same. I suspect they would.
But it also raises the question, if a person is doing your work, with your name is he a Franchisee or subcontractor.
The phrase involving a barge pole springs to mind.

You haven't actually read that case though, have you? It was allowed because Pizza express was a soft franchise setup at the time. They provided no training, no uniform, no operations manual and the franchisees paid for their own advertising. They also didn't pay a lump sum to buy into the franchise in the first place. None on this would apply with an Ian Lancaster franchise setup.

I suppose we'll not know until it's tested in a UK court. I can't imagine how much the franchises will be worth if it goes in favour of the franchisee!!  

[Nick Day]

That is why these things go to court.
You have to assess the risks for yourself.
The problem here is the risk.
You are all talking about the franchise fee. This fee needs to reflect what you (franchisor) is putting in.
You cannot just guess a number.
If you decide that getting the work is part of that fee, then you cannot charge for getting work and then keeping it. After all the Franchisee has paid you for that work.
No matter what is said here or opinions given, a contract has to be fair and cannot overrule tax or employment laws.

[Perfect Windows]

I could put someone off buying into a window cleaning franchise as quick as I could put them off buying an ionic van with thermopure system in it for 30 +k.

I'm interested why you're so against the idea of rewarding people who work with you.  Your posts above are full of complaints about the type of person you get when you're employing.  Well, there's a very old phrase, "Pay peanuts, get cretins".  Our franchisees earn a great deal of money for working three day weeks.  Why would they shirk or disappear or not be keen to learn when they are making a lot of money and are in control of what they do?

I know the standard response on here is that something you don't even try to understand can't work or that you're talking tripe if you dare to suggest that you might be successful.  However, if you actually gave it some thought, you might just see that a franchise attracts the sort of person you might be happy to trust to do a good and reliable job.

I know the noisy ones on here are unpersuadable and that some people on here never, ever do anything but snipe (and seem weirdly proud of the job!) 

However, I found my first franchisee on here and he was well-met indeed.  I'd trust him to the end of the earth and he's earning a good living (soon to be exceptional with the number of customers we're going to gain over the summer).  Hopefully someone else reading this thread might contact me about a franchise;  I'm sure they'll end up very happy.  In fact, I'll do everything in my power to make them so.  At the moment we only franchise in Southampton so if you're out there wondering whether to dip your toe in the water, contact me.  If you do I'll pass you straight to the franchisees to discuss how they are doing.

Vin

[Clever Forum Name]

i think its great what Vin/ian/kent kleen has done.

If i was new to window cleaning and read this thread i would jump onto this. I think i would be better off with Vin than doing my own work