[Paul Haney]

Hi again all  what are the best low or non ph powdered pre sprays to use I curently use craftex products the likes of champion is high ph ect but is very good to use  looking for a low or non ph pre spray that is good in dirty marks traffic land areas ect thank you all

[Radek Jablonski]

What is "low" and non ph for you?

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Paul have you had any training yet?

Shaun

[Paul Haney]

Yea shaun done training with prochem when I bought my powermax from them few years ago going to be going to ncca training course start of next year also. The question should of been best powdered ph powder regards

[Tadgh O Shea]

Hi again all  what are the best low or non ph powdered pre sprays to use I curently use craftex products the likes of champion is high ph ect but is very good to use  looking for a low or non ph pre spray that is good in dirty marks traffic land areas ect thank you all

Paul you should ask on here if you can get out for a few days  with a professional carpet cleaner, from all the questions you are asking its shows very much your enthusiasm to learn, if you can book up time with an experienced pro carpet cleaner your learning curve can be drastically reduced, i would also recommend that you need to study up on the pH scale which is often overlooked by many cleaning operators, happy and safe cleaning Tadgh

[john martin]

Hi again all  what are the best low or non ph powdered pre sprays to use I curently use craftex products the likes of champion is high ph ect but is very good to use  looking for a low or non ph pre spray that is good in dirty marks traffic land areas ect thank you all

Powdered detergent mixes are generally on the alkaline side because the usually ingredients like sodium carbonate are alkaline , so u probably wont find a neutral powder .
Ultimate master is around PH 9.5 and the more u dilute it the more it will head towards 8 or so .
I use it on wool and everything and never have an issue , so it would be a suitable allrounder compared to the High PH powder presprays .
You currently use liquid presprays that are designed to be high PH 11-13 . So you want to replace those with lower PH versions to use generally .
I would say chemspec heavy duty soil lifter would be a good lower PH replacement but effective spotter and traffic lane cleaner .
Also the citrus presprays by alltec or restromate  for lighter general use  .
Ultimate master powder or perhaps forumla 90 powder for general use , i dont put those powders in a spraycan if using them as a prespray , its easier to put a bit in your machine cleantank and prespray using a spray lance .

So perhaps switch to the above for general use and keep your high PH craftex products and others like enzall  onboard for the <10% of jobs that might require them .

Too much is made of the PH thing imo  ...  all u need to do is avoid high ph products on fancy house wool
I worked in a laboratory before and we didnt mention PH much at all compared to carpet cleaners !   

[Tadgh O Shea]

Hi again all  what are the best low or non ph powdered pre sprays to use I curently use craftex products the likes of champion is high ph ect but is very good to use  looking for a low or non ph pre spray that is good in dirty marks traffic land areas ect thank you all

Powdered detergent mixes are generally on the alkaline side because the usually ingredients like sodium carbonate are alkaline , so u probably wont find a neutral powder .
Ultimate master is around PH 9.5 and the more u dilute it the more it will head towards 8 or so .
I use it on wool and everything and never have an issue , so it would be a suitable allrounder compared to the High PH powder presprays .
You currently use liquid presprays that are designed to be high PH 11-13 . So you want to replace those with lower PH versions to use generally .
I would say chemspec heavy duty soil lifter would be a good lower PH replacement but effective spotter and traffic lane cleaner .
Also the citrus presprays by alltec or restromate  for lighter general use  .
Ultimate master powder or perhaps forumla 90 powder for general use , i dont put those powders in a spraycan if using them as a prespray , its easier to put a bit in your machine cleantank and prespray using a spray lance .

So perhaps switch to the above for general use and keep your high PH craftex products and others like enzall  onboard for the <10% of jobs that might require them .

Too much is made of the PH thing imo  ...  all u need to do is avoid high ph products on fancy house wool
I worked in a laboratory before and we didnt mention PH much at all compared to carpet cleaners !   

  Hi John, i am sure you will agree products like champion with a pH value of 13.5 need to be used with extreme caution,  for Paul who said he agitates after pre spraying then lets the solution dwell for 15 minutes and rinses with water can lead to disastrous results as water alone will not neutralize cleaning chemicals based on sodium hydroxide, thats why i recommended he should try and get out for a few days with an experienced pro carpet cleaner,  getting out  for a few days with a professional carpet cleaner can be far more beneficial than some carpet cleaning training courses, there is no harm in asking anyway there are plenty of helpful guys on CIU.

[john martin]

well thats why im telling him to use what i use every day  , not because its the only way but because i dont have any issues and clean effective with what i use .
I dont even have any ph 13 stuff on the van at the moment .

But really a lot of the carpets are very difficult to damage by simply a high ph product ,  and most are so thrashed u can only improve them .
Of course avoid using them on good wool etc .

[Tadgh O Shea]

well thats why im telling him to use what i use every day  , not because its the only way but because i dont have any issues and clean effective with what i use .
I dont even have any ph 13 stuff on the van at the moment .

But really a lot of the carpets are very difficult to damage by simply a high ph product ,  and most are so thrashed u can only improve them .
Of course avoid using them on good wool etc .

  Good to see you don't use chemicals with a pH value above 13 even though its not just wool carpet these harsh and aggressive cleaning chemicals can damage, maybe if Paul is anywhere near your area John you might take him out for a few days.

[john martin]

tadgh , someday you must post pics of this chemical damage u talk about  ....   not on countertops ... not on
tile .... not on car hubcaps  ....   just CARPET 

[Paul Haney]

Hi all again I had training with prochem few years ago I do get very good results I don't always use champion  I use there traffic lane cleaner derodrizer  I also have there top grade powder I also put fibre & rinse to keep ph to a min. I've just ordered some prochem power burst and some multi pro  never used there products this is why I'm asking  about other pre sprays and best ways to use them ect and advice on what other people use and how they use it thank you

[Tadgh O Shea]

tadgh , someday you must post pics of this chemical damage u talk about  ....   not on countertops ... not on
tile .... not on car hubcaps  ....   just CARPET 

Hi John, just wondering are you agreeing that sodium hydroxide based cleaning chemicals will cause detrimental damage to countertops,tiles,and alloy wheels,etc. But you are disagreeing that sodium hydroxide based chemicals will not cause detrimental damage to carpets and upholstery, just wondering like.

[john martin]

see how it unblocks your sink tadgh , must be great on greasy trafic lanes ! 

very few products associated with carpets  contain it  , on other surfaces ... im sure with the wrong concentrations ,products used wrongly by the inexperienced will cause damage .

[Tadgh O Shea]

see how it unblocks your sink tadgh , must be great on greasy trafic lanes ! 

very few products associated with carpets  contain it  , on other surfaces ... im sure with the wrong concentrations ,products used wrongly by the inexperienced will cause damage .

  Yes John you are right sodium hydroxide is used in many brands of sink and drain unblocker, but if you used a carpet cleaning chemical based on sodium hydroxide to clean your alloy wheels it would cause damage to them, thats my point.

[john martin]

dont think you'l find a carpet cleaning product  based on  sodium hydroxide .
Can u see any more other than the craftex champion mentioned above ?  i think thats a general cleaning product more than anything also . And the 1% or so is likely to be there for PH regulation , to bump it up to 13 . Its unlikely to damage much when its diluted imo .

Oddly enough , i dont really do hard floors but i got roped into doing a small floor today for an elderly customer , scrubbed it with speed stripper ... then lightened the grout with drain cleaner ... sodium hydroxide rocks !   
 

[Tadgh O Shea]

dont think you'l find a carpet cleaning product  based on  sodium hydroxide .
Can u see any more other than the craftex champion mentioned above ?  i think thats a general cleaning product more than anything also . And the 1% or so is likely to be there for PH regulation , to bump it up to 13 . Its unlikely to damage much when its diluted imo .

Oddly enough , i dont really do hard floors but i got roped into doing a small floor today for an elderly customer , scrubbed it with speed stripper ... then lightened the grout with drain cleaner ... sodium hydroxide rocks !   

  Keep on rocking John.

[Radek Jablonski]

Damage to the wheels? Your going to far.
You must be talking about polished rims, not standard alloys.

On many ocassion you even need very acidic cleaner to get rid of all the brake dust and more.

[Tadgh O Shea]

Damage to the wheels? Your going to far.
You must be talking about polished rims, not standard alloys.

On many ocassion you even need very acidic cleaner to get rid of all the brake dust and more.

Hi Radek, i am talking about standard alloys, you can remove the heaviest of brake dust from alloys with  product's that you don't even need to wear gloves with, if you used an alloy wheel cleaner based on sodium hydroxide without wearing gloves you would chemically burn your skin as well as the alloys, my point is why use such harsh and aggressive cleaning chemicals when really there is no need to if there are safe alternatives that will do the same job but without causing damage to the surface they are being used on.

[Tadgh O Shea]

Damage to the wheels? Your going to far.
You must be talking about polished rims, not standard alloys.

On many ocassion you even need very acidic cleaner to get rid of all the brake dust and more.

Hi Radek, one of the most popular brands of alloy wheel cleaners for years has been Wonder Wheels which is based on hydrochloric acid i know the mind boggles, but again its just another good example on the power of marketing.

[Steve_Knight]

Damage to the wheels? Your going to far.
You must be talking about polished rims, not standard alloys.

On many ocassion you even need very acidic cleaner to get rid of all the brake dust and more.

Hi Radek, i am talking about standard alloys, you can remove the heaviest of brake dust from alloys with  product's that you don't even need to wear gloves with, if you used an alloy wheel cleaner based on sodium hydroxide without wearing gloves you would chemically burn your skin as well as the alloys, my point is why use such harsh and aggressive cleaning chemicals when really there is no need to if there are safe alternatives that will do the same job but without causing damage to the surface they are being used on.

Tadgh

Can you let me know what the "safe" alloy wheel cleaner is please?

Thanks
Steve