[PoleKing]

Answering the original post, IMO you cannot rush your cleaning with WFP. I would keep doing what you are doing.
Decide what sort of business you want too run.
Here are your options=

Low cost splash and dash.
Or
Higher priced do more than is expected sort of job.

We went for the second option, we have a superb customer retention rate, we charge more then double than some in our area. We clean around 2.5 standard 3 bed's an hour on average. We are currently setting up our 5th full time van. (this has been achieved in 4 years)

Hope this helps.  

That's the sort of advice you should listen to. ^^

Don't set yourself a target of x houses an hour, set yourself a daily target of how much you want to earn. That's how I plan my day, whether it be 15 lower priced jobs or just 6 higher priced jobs. I don't care how many houses I do an hour or a day, as long as I hit my target earnings and I do a quality job, I'm happy and customers happy.

Were you the person that cleans the insides for free?

Indeed 8 weekly I do the odd internal for free, maybe 1 a month the uproar that caused  
What does that have to do with this post

It gives a better picture of the kind of business you're running.
It helps people make a decision on whether they want to follow your advice on the forum.

You must've missed my question, Chris. Have you ever cleaned in the manner you're so vitriolic of Tosh admitting to?

yes poleking theres 1 house I clean in that manner every 6 weeks or so, my own
Would I clean a paying customers house that way, no.

So, and this is my point, you've only cleaned one house in the manner Tosh described but cuss him out for it. You've not tested it enough to see if it's acceptable.

How do your windows come up?

[PoleKing]

I answered 'correct' to your question poleking not too 8weeklys question too chris. Although we clean the odd inside window for free. Mainly kitchen windows for older people who cannot reach.  A free gutter clean for an old lady led too a nice commercial contract.
I know alot on here think its mumbo jumbo 'american' nonsense, but I believe, Do more than is expected of you and you will never ever be short of work, friends and love. Seems to be working for me, although working tomorrow, valentine's day and our wedding anniversary, the love bit might be out the window lol.  

I do the odd kitchen window for old ladies for free.
And I've done a free gutter clear for a volunteer lady.
I've no problem with the odd freebie.
Under promise and over deliver is not a bad way to run a business at all.

My only issue with your posts of late is that you're tradding quicker than WFPing.
But I won't start that row again. It's only just calmed down.

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

LOL poleking.
I am thinking back to when I used to trad, 24 years ago, the same size houses where done in 15 mins BUT we never cleaned frames only wiped sills. There again it was £1.50 a pop. House now cleaned for £10 takes 25 mins, we could do glass only in 5 mins but that's not what I have set up my business to do. A local company to me, 1.5 mile away has 10 vans, glass only, they clean 40 to 50 houses a day per van.   

[chris turner]

The last time I cleaned my windows this way, there was spotting. That is the truth, the sun was out and there was spotting coming down from the top of the frames. Exactly what I expected from the amount of effort I put into the job.
They were clean enough to get the missis off my back though, no way would I expect to get paid for that sort of quality.

[PoleKing]

The last time I cleaned my windows this way, there was spotting. That is the truth, the sun was out and there was spotting coming down from the top of the frames. Exactly what I expected from the amount of effort I put into the job.
They were clean enough to get the missis off my back though, no way would I expect to get paid for that sort of quality.

My point though, is your demographic.
One house isn't enough to call someone else out on bud.

And, there's splash & dash and taking half an hour on a 3 bedder and also a massive area between the two.

[chris turner]

The last time I cleaned my windows this way, there was spotting. That is the truth, the sun was out and there was spotting coming down from the top of the frames. Exactly what I expected from the amount of effort I put into the job.
They were clean enough to get the missis off my back though, no way would I expect to get paid for that sort of quality.

My point though, is your demographic.
One house isn't enough to call someone else out on bud.

And, there's splash & dash and taking half an hour on a 3 bedder and also a massive area between the two.

One house is more then enough to check on the quality of your work.
Would you suggest I go clean 20 houses this way then come back and give my opinion?
The guy has openly admitted he doesn't clean the frames unless there dirty and is advising someone that clearly is struggling for technique to aim to clean windows in 15-20 secs.
Is that good advice in your opinion poleking?

[Tom White]

The guy has openly admitted he doesn't clean the frames unless there dirty and is advising someone that clearly is struggling for technique to aim to clean windows in 15-20 secs.
Is that good advice in your opinion poleking?

Yes, it's good advice because that's all it needs.  Any idiot can work far harder than they need to; but that's just stupid.

There's not much to wash off a regular clean; once over with a brush - glass only unless the frames look dirty (which is rare) - and a quick rinse with a fast flow.

You might be frightened of working quick, but charge a good price, work quickly - don't over egg it - there's really no need, and it's job jobbed.

I can't remember the last complaint we had.

[rosskesava]

Yes, it's good advice because that's all it needs.  Any idiot can work far harder than they need to; but that's just stupid.

There's not much to wash off a regular clean; once over with a brush - glass only unless the frames look dirty (which is rare) - and a quick rinse with a fast flow.

You might be frightened of working quick, but charge a good price, work quickly - don't over egg it - there's really no need, and it's job jobbed.

I can't remember the last complaint we had.

It depends on where you live.

Some times of the year here in Brighton, mainly summer time, I can get away with doing just that. Other times, I could not. Try cleaning salt of glass in 20 seconds, you won't do it. It's the same in many other coastal areas.

Then there's the seagull poos. Try and wash that off in 20 seconds. Sometimes one dollop can takes ages even with a scouring attachment. It can dry like concrete.

When I do the work I have in London, the glass is usually clean. It's the tops of the frames and the sills that are rank and black with pollution.

My point is that how quick you can work is not the same all over the country.

[Walter Mitty]

I usually try to ensure that any horizontals on the frames have a quick brush (assuming that the seals are OK) because I've found that this is where a problem may occur.  I always do sills as dirt will drop onto them.  Often there is no problem anyway once I get past the first couple of cleans.
Recently I had to backpack everything for a full circuit as my van was in dock for weeks - they had trouble finding the fault.  Due to the hassle of working that way (compared to my van mount) and not wanting to lug around loads of water, I avoided frames for one circuit except where it was obviously necessary.  No harm done.  All the framework every time is not needed IMO - with the possible exception of very high pollution areas.

[chris turner]

Good points there.
I'm in the south east, the highest polluted area in the country and it really shows on windows. There's always a layer of dust and dirt around the frames and not cleaning them would be asking for trouble.
Tosh apologies if I came across as being ignorant, I guess when it comes to my cleaning methods I am slightly ignorant in that I think my way is the best way.
There are a number of factors that determine just how quick a window can be cleaned which will vary for all of us, location, equipment used, types of windows being cleaned, the individual speed of the user and we all have our own targets In place.
I just think the best advice you can give someone learning the trade is to concentrate on becoming a quality window cleaner first, it's not good for them or there business to tell them to miss frames or clean windows in seconds. That's something they need to learn for themselves depending on the above factors.

[PoleKing]

The last time I cleaned my windows this way, there was spotting. That is the truth, the sun was out and there was spotting coming down from the top of the frames. Exactly what I expected from the amount of effort I put into the job.
They were clean enough to get the missis off my back though, no way would I expect to get paid for that sort of quality.

My point though, is your demographic.
One house isn't enough to call someone else out on bud.

And, there's splash & dash and taking half an hour on a 3 bedder and also a massive area between the two.

One house is more then enough to check on the quality of your work.
Would you suggest I go clean 20 houses this way then come back and give my opinion?
The guy has openly admitted he doesn't clean the frames unless there dirty and is advising someone that clearly is struggling for technique to aim to clean windows in 15-20 secs.
Is that good advice in your opinion poleking?

I would say never form an opinion based solely on on house.

My opinion on whether Tosh's advice is good or not is neither here nor there.
It's an alternate opinion. The OP should listen to as many opinions as he can find and form his own based on that.

[PoleKing]

Good points there.
I'm in the south east, the highest polluted area in the country and it really shows on windows. There's always a layer of dust and dirt around the frames and not cleaning them would be asking for trouble.
Tosh apologies if I came across as being ignorant, I guess when it comes to my cleaning methods I am slightly ignorant in that I think my way is the best way.
There are a number of factors that determine just how quick a window can be cleaned which will vary for all of us, location, equipment used, types of windows being cleaned, the individual speed of the user and we all have our own targets In place.
I just think the best advice you can give someone learning the trade is to concentrate on becoming a quality window cleaner first, it's not good for them or there business to tell them to miss frames or clean windows in seconds. That's something they need to learn for themselves depending on the above factors.

It is , mate. For you.
It may work for someone else too.
It may not.
The point is, he won't know until he tries.
Note the OP never said he has any issues with quality. Only speed.

Its trial and error. Go faster. Faster. FASTER!
Too fast, slow down a bit.
He won't know how fast he can be until he has gone too fast and come back down to the sweet spot between speed and quality.

[Window Lickers]

Scrub the top horizontal frame and where it meets the glass a couple of times thoroughly and rinse well - you've done 75% of whats required.

[Stoots]

Answering the original post, IMO you cannot rush your cleaning with WFP. I would keep doing what you are doing.
Decide what sort of business you want too run.
Here are your options=

Low cost splash and dash.
Or
Higher priced do more than is expected sort of job.

We went for the second option, we have a superb customer retention rate, we charge more then double than some in our area. We clean around 2.5 standard 3 bed's an hour on average. We are currently setting up our 5th full time van. (this has been achieved in 4 years)

Hope this helps.  

To be honest as close to high cost splash and dash as is possible without creating complaints..just maximise profit i suppose

[rosskesava]

Scrub the top horizontal frame and where it meets the glass a couple of times thoroughly and rinse well - you've done 75% of whats required.

That is such a good point.