[Clever Forum Name]

You should be earning a £1 per ltr of water used so £20 shouldn't break the bank should it

Emptied my tank this morning onto the road. Where's my money?

[Dave Willis]

It's quite possibly an alcohol substitute "borrowed" from the Lithographic printing process. Alcohol is dodgy stuff in print these days and so substitutes have been produced to take the dangers away. These substitutes are used at quite low percentages, lower than alcohol as a wetting agent breaking down surface tension. This is what makes the water look syrupy it increases the viscosity. The bubbles are likely to be another ingredient. If I'm correct then I'm not entirely sure why the second ingredient is added but that's probably the bit that gives a bit more shine. It's unlikely it changes the properties of glass just sheets a bit better.
Jigsaw aren't claiming spectacular results or molecular changes (they are windowcleners) and probably are unsure exactly what their product actually does chemically.

[Window Lickers]

were if it beads it can dry to quick an cause spotting

The above statement is as inaccurate as they come.

Spotting occurs if you havent rinsed adequately. The speed water will evaporate has nothing to do with it. If the water left on the glass is clean water it can sit there all day long drying or dry in a split second. Its whether theres dirt in the water droplets on the glass that is important.

[Window Lickers]

probably are unsure exactly what their product actually does chemically.

Highly likely.

[the king]

were if it beads it can dry to quick an cause spotting

The above statement is as inaccurate as they come.

Spotting occurs if you havent rinsed adequately. The speed water will evaporate has nothing to do with it. If the water left on the glass is clean water it can sit there all day long drying or dry in a split second. Its whether theres dirt in the water droplets on the glass that is important.

no window licker ur rong

[Window Lickers]

So according to your statement your powerless over the cleanliness of some of the glass you clean. On a warm day where the water on the glass creates droplets its going to leave spot marks. You're not much of a cleaner are you.

[ChumBucket]

were if it beads it can dry to quick an cause spotting

The above statement is as inaccurate as they come.

Spotting occurs if you havent rinsed adequately. The speed water will evaporate has nothing to do with it. If the water left on the glass is clean water it can sit there all day long drying or dry in a split second. Its whether theres dirt in the water droplets on the glass that is important.

That's "fred" for you!! is he married to a girl called needle by any chance you think?

[Dave Willis]

That's sharp!
This time of the morning

[dazmond]

I would think because its normally hydrophobic glass where
you have spotting issues and hydrophillic glass the water tends
to sit on the glass like a sheet and when drying tends to evenly
shrinking down or inwards and gives you less chance of spotting.

If they had truly developed a product that makes glass behave
in a hydrophillic way that would be of great interest to me personally
unfortunately i dont think this is the case.

Let's not forget the main aim is to take dirt OFF glass. Hydrophobic means the water will shoot off the surface, taking all of the dirt with it. I don't, and nor do my lads, have any issues with spotting in any glass, whether it appears to be hydrophobic/philic. I think that comes down to technique and water quality, not the properties of the glass itself.

Therefore, a hydrophobic product is more desirable, taking the dirt away as fast as possible. Hydrophilic will encourage the water to stick, keeping the dirt on the glass.

It will be interesting to hear the opinion of others about my previous post...

you ve got it the wrong way round steve!

its the HYDROPHILIC  glass that sheets better and DOESNT leave beads of water on the glass that could potentially pick up dirt in the droplets before drying.

HYDROPHOBIC tends to run like "little rivers" and stays on the glass longer.

i personally dont have a problem with either types of glass.i just tend to rinse a bit more on hydrophobic glass.

[Dave Willis]

 
I get what Steve means, Daz is correct too. Some glass that repels water does seem to clean better than sheeting windows although most of us prefer to see a curtain of water.

[ChumBucket]

That's sharp!
This time of the morning

Always to the "point", you know me!!

[Dave Willis]

eye!

[ChumBucket]

In stitches here!!

[PoleKing]

You should be earning a £1 per ltr of water used so £20 shouldn't break the bank should it

Emptied my tank this morning onto the road. Where's my money?

Bet the road is shiny!

[slap bash]

I'm very interested in this product and if it can improve productivity, everyone should be buying it. I didn't get an answer from Kempy or anyone who makes the product about the exact aim of it. What is the USP?

Also, have any tests been done on a microscopic level regarding the interaction between pure water with this product and pure water alone? Science sells. HOW exactly does it glide quicker, if it actually does? I don't want the formula, but I do want the science.

Does it fill in the microscopic blemishes in smooth glass?
Does it change the chemical viscosity of the water?

I need to know before I go using this on solar panels especially, but I want to know for my other business too.

If it cuts through grime, should we be using this to aid the pressure washing side of our businesses?

I have so many questions that I can't seem to find answers to.

Email me if you don't want it on the forum. I of all people would understand why.

Fan choo! 

Its quite simple they have stumble over something while trying different products on the market and are now bottling it to sell at profit and don`t have any scientific proof to offer and have no specific use outline of what the product can do this is all made up on the hoof.
Rhino says he has the same product but only in 10 liter form been in the big business side only wants to make it big. The truth will always prevail sooner or later.
This is of course just my opinion. And each can make up there own mind. I will just wait and wait for the hype to settle.

[SeanK]

I'm very interested in this product and if it can improve productivity, everyone should be buying it. I didn't get an answer from Kempy or anyone who makes the product about the exact aim of it. What is the USP?

Also, have any tests been done on a microscopic level regarding the interaction between pure water with this product and pure water alone? Science sells. HOW exactly does it glide quicker, if it actually does? I don't want the formula, but I do want the science.

Does it fill in the microscopic blemishes in smooth glass?
Does it change the chemical viscosity of the water?

I need to know before I go using this on solar panels especially, but I want to know for my other business too.

If it cuts through grime, should we be using this to aid the pressure washing side of our businesses?

I have so many questions that I can't seem to find answers to.

Email me if you don't want it on the forum. I of all people would understand why.

Fan choo!  

Its quite simple they have stumble over something while trying different products on the market and are now bottling it to sell at profit and don`t have any scientific proof to offer and have no specific use outline of what the product can do this is all made up on the hoof.
Rhino says he has the same product but only in 10 liter form been in the big business side only wants to make it big. The truth will always prevail sooner or later.
This is of course just my opinion. And each can make up there own mind. I will just wait and wait for the hype to settle.

Took me over twenty replies to try and say what you have said in four lines well said.

[Dave Willis]

I think you'll find Rhino's product is different - him and his mate are selling the stuff to coat the glass with rather than chuck it in the tank from what I saw on here.

[gary999]

I would think because its normally hydrophobic glass where
you have spotting issues and hydrophillic glass the water tends
to sit on the glass like a sheet and when drying tends to evenly
shrinking down or inwards and gives you less chance of spotting.

If they had truly developed a product that makes glass behave
in a hydrophillic way that would be of great interest to me personally
unfortunately i dont think this is the case.

Let's not forget the main aim is to take dirt OFF glass. Hydrophobic means the water will shoot off the surface, taking all of the dirt with it. I don't, and nor do my lads, have any issues with spotting in any glass, whether it appears to be hydrophobic/philic. I think that comes down to technique and water quality, not the properties of the glass itself.

Therefore, a hydrophobic product is more desirable, taking the dirt away as fast as possible. Hydrophilic will encourage the water to stick, keeping the dirt on the glass.

It will be interesting to hear the opinion of others about my previous post...

personally I find hydrophilic glass dries quicker and lets not forget weather
conditions have an effect on what condition the glass dries especially this time of year
when we get a lot of wet and especially windy weather.

I clean a lot of windows on busy roads where you get more than a bit of wind
and is made worse on windy days I have little problem with hydrophilic glass
which dries quickly and I guarantee(and this happened when I used 000ppm)
that with windy conditions blowing, hydrophobic glass where the droplets of water
hang around longer especially this time of year spot I put this down to dirt
in the air attaching itself to the water droplets so I have always bladed this glass
dry.

I like to work in as many conditions as possible so hydrophilic glass is more
preferable to me.

[Clever Forum Name]

were if it beads it can dry to quick an cause spotting

The above statement is as inaccurate as they come.

Spotting occurs if you havent rinsed adequately. The speed water will evaporate has nothing to do with it. If the water left on the glass is clean water it can sit there all day long drying or dry in a split second. Its whether theres dirt in the water droplets on the glass that is important.

So why do people come on here moaning about the wind? If "clean" water can sit of the glass all day why do people get complaints and bad finishes to cleaned houses? If a window takes all day to dry and there is wind about it won't matter?

[SeanK]

I would think because its normally hydrophobic glass where
you have spotting issues and hydrophillic glass the water tends
to sit on the glass like a sheet and when drying tends to evenly
shrinking down or inwards and gives you less chance of spotting.

If they had truly developed a product that makes glass behave
in a hydrophillic way that would be of great interest to me personally
unfortunately i dont think this is the case.

Let's not forget the main aim is to take dirt OFF glass. Hydrophobic means the water will shoot off the surface, taking all of the dirt with it. I don't, and nor do my lads, have any issues with spotting in any glass, whether it appears to be hydrophobic/philic. I think that comes down to technique and water quality, not the properties of the glass itself.

Therefore, a hydrophobic product is more desirable, taking the dirt away as fast as possible. Hydrophilic will encourage the water to stick, keeping the dirt on the glass.

It will be interesting to hear the opinion of others about my previous post...

personally I find hydrophilic glass dries quicker and lets not forget weather
conditions have an effect on what condition the glass dries especially this time of year
when we get a lot of wet and especially windy weather.

I clean a lot of windows on busy roads where you get more than a bit of wind
and is made worse on windy days I have little problem with hydrophilic glass
which dries quickly and I guarantee(and this happened when I used 000ppm)
that with windy conditions blowing, hydrophobic glass where the droplets of water
hang around longer especially this time of year spot I put this down to dirt
in the air attaching itself to the water droplets so I have always bladed this glass
dry.

I like to work in as many conditions as possible so hydrophilic glass is more
preferable to me.

But then you get the same scenario as used in the to clean or not to clean in the rain debates, you could blade the glass
and one shower of rain an hour later and your back to square one.
I used to get very stressed about this same thing until my wife pointed out, it doesn't matter if they get slightly dirty again
when it starts to rain, the windows will still be cleaner than they were before I cleaned them.