[Rob Lewis]

After 15 years working for a branch of a well known franchised carpet cleaner (Ch**D*y), I am shortly to go "independent". 

I have a dangerous amount of knowledge of "conventional" Hot Water Extraction techniques (i.e. Some, but not a lot!) - but have been doing a lot of research.

I would like to stay with a cleaning solution that self-buffers and not have to be too concerned about neutralizing after extracting etc.  My feeling is that the less you spray on the carpet (and the more that you extract), then the less drying time there will be - which is a major concern to me.

With this in mind, I am considering using Alltech Ultimate Master powder as my "normal" pre-spray/rinse running through an Alltech Evolution machine (600psi pump - 3KW Steammate - twin Vacuums). Obviously I will also carry other pre-sprays  etc for differing degrees of soiling.

If I had my way, I would have an Ashby's Enforcer, but they won't say whether the Ultimate Master will do damage to their pumps, whereas the Alltech machine is allegedly built to take a powder based solution - it is also considerably cheaper

I would appreciate any constructive feedback on the choice of machine/chemical - I am well aware that there are as many different choices as there are professional cleaners - but any comments will be gratefully received.  Thanks in advance!

[neil 47]

I use hwe and lm and have been pushing lm this pas month and 90% have gone for the lm I ,m not as tired and I haven't had any problems . Customers love it and so do i.

As for solutions for your needs don't think you would go wrong with spm ,colloid cleaner no need for acid rinse . 

[Ian Gourlay]

well ive been using Ultimate master in ashbys machine for years but there is always a possibilty if you Bought an Enforcer they could blame UM

Why the Evolution  I only ask because before i bought my £100 Rotary i was thinking of getting one

[*Hector*]

As Neil says... try sticking with what you know.... LM cleaning... I have been doing that in domestic properties for years, and not HWE.... Never had a complaint. More than happy with the results, as were the custards....

[Rob Lewis]

Neil/Hector: I intend to stick with Low Moisture/Bonnet Buffing etc, but for upholstery cleaning & "nasty" commercials, I'm going to need something with more grunt.

Ian: The reason for the Alltech machine is mainly because they (Alltech) have been incredibly helpful and supportive.  I went to their open day in the Summer and more recently to a free Training day - and they are a really nice bunch.  I had a good play with the machine and it appears really well put together and high quality - although the look of the fibreglass casing does take a bit of getting used to.

They are not too far from me if I need repairs (though not as close as Ashby's)

Frankly, there's something about the attitude of Ashbys that bothers me. I don't think they really care/appreciate that this is a big step for me and I need to get it right. Alltech, on the other hand can't do enough to help.

The Evolution appears to cover all the bases for me - and can handle hard floor/tile cleaning (allegedly) - which I might try later on.

I don't think its a BAD choice, but its questionable if it the RIGHT choice!  Ya pays ya money...........

[Rob Lewis]

Hector - Which LM method /chemicals do you use??

[wayne zabel]

Rob do CD not use HWE.I thought they did

[Rob Lewis]

Wayne - Yes, they do - but its a complicated twin pump, twin tank machine and a 2 part cleaning solution that eats through pumps and costs an absolute fortune.  The "old" CD system used LM Spray & Buff (tho you can still do that if you have to with the current solution), it is not the approved method any more.  I'm not getting any younger/fitter & I find lm methods less painful.

Apparently the next version of the chemical is a one-part one, like the one for the TM franchises, but it won't work so well as a lm solution.

[clive ware]

Rob, Ashby`s have always been like that. I don`t know how they keep going to be honest. Derek Ashby was always nice and helpful but the rest of the family aren`t!! Years ago, I bought a Ninja from them. The first job I did, I had water pouring out of the water pump. They told me to send it back but I had to pay for the carriage each way and the machine was damaged in transit so they told me, and charged me to repair the wheels. Funnily enough, I`ve never even been tempted to buy another machine from them.

[Adrian Walton]

They use the same pump so i can't see a problem.

[john martin]

After 15 years working for a branch of a well known franchised carpet cleaner (Ch**D*y), I am shortly to go "independent".  

I have a dangerous amount of knowledge of "conventional" Hot Water Extraction techniques (i.e. Some, but not a lot!) - but have been doing a lot of research.

I would like to stay with a cleaning solution that self-buffers and not have to be too concerned about neutralizing after extracting etc.  My feeling is that the less you spray on the carpet (and the more that you extract), then the less drying time there will be - which is a major concern to me.

With this in mind, I am considering using Alltech Ultimate Master powder as my "normal" pre-spray/rinse running through an Alltech Evolution machine (600psi pump - 3KW Steammate - twin Vacuums). Obviously I will also carry other pre-sprays  etc for differing degrees of soiling.

If I had my way, I would have an Ashby's Enforcer, but they won't say whether the Ultimate Master will do damage to their pumps, whereas the Alltech machine is allegedly built to take a powder based solution - it is also considerably cheaper

I would appreciate any constructive feedback on the choice of machine/chemical - I am well aware that there are as many different choices as there are professional cleaners - but any comments will be gratefully received.  Thanks in advance!

So what scared you off using UM with an Ashbys machine  ...  could be searching old posts ... same small number individuals that had issues mentioning it several times ?  ... might be a changed formula for UM since ?
I can not see anything in UM that is not in other similar products so i do not believe it causes any problems any more that any other products .
Today i used UM in the Enforcer in the first house .. as a prespray and a rince .
Then i used it as a rince after Enzall for a hotel function room .
UM is great all round honest no BS product that gives great quick results .

I think i would be just as happy with an Evolution ... so if you are getting good service  from Alltec , go with their products .
The Enforcer has some nice features  ...  i think is only ' great ' when the performance is increased a bit  , i would recommend the booster Ashbys have on thier FB page at the moment ... or modify it a bit like i did .  

[Tadgh O Shea]

After 15 years working for a branch of a well known franchised carpet cleaner (Ch**D*y), I am shortly to go "independent". 

I have a dangerous amount of knowledge of "conventional" Hot Water Extraction techniques (i.e. Some, but not a lot!) - but have been doing a lot of research.

I would like to stay with a cleaning solution that self-buffers and not have to be too concerned about neutralizing after extracting etc.  My feeling is that the less you spray on the carpet (and the more that you extract), then the less drying time there will be - which is a major concern to me.

With this in mind, I am considering using Alltech Ultimate Master powder as my "normal" pre-spray/rinse running through an Alltech Evolution machine (600psi pump - 3KW Steammate - twin Vacuums). Obviously I will also carry other pre-sprays  etc for differing degrees of soiling.

If I had my way, I would have an Ashby's Enforcer, but they won't say whether the Ultimate Master will do damage to their pumps, whereas the Alltech machine is allegedly built to take a powder based solution - it is also considerably cheaper

I would appreciate any constructive feedback on the choice of machine/chemical - I am well aware that there are as many different choices as there are professional cleaners - but any comments will be gratefully received.  Thanks in advance!

Hi Rob, i would also recommend the colloid chemistry very safe and effective, and no need to worry about acid rinse.  Best of luck with your new venture.   Regards Tadgh

[john martin]

No need to worry about an acid rince for UM either ... and youl get home quicker ...having done a better job 

[Tadgh O Shea]

No need to worry about an acid rince for UM either ... and youl get home quicker ...having done a better job 

Hi John, i used ultimate master for years used to buy it from Hi-Tec in Enniskillen back in the early 80's if i am honest i could write paragraph after paragraph with the difficulties it caused, but you know what they say John, there is no future in the past.

[Carpet Dawg]

go on then, what difficulties?

[Tadgh O Shea]

go on then, what difficulties?

Hi Carpet Dawg, in my eyes Ultimate Master is old school technology, i am not even going there, just my two cents worth, i will even say again i am not going there. Tadgh

[Rob Lewis]

John - it wasn't anyone on the forums that put me off running UM through the Enforcer, it was ashbys themselves.  When I asked if I could use um with their machine, they said they said they'd only recommend using plain water in the machine, or modest amounts of liquid detergent - and gave me a link to one of their own products. No explanation as to why (or indeed, whether) um would damage the machine.  Alltech say it won't cause a problem, but I really need to hear that from ashbys, as if I go ahead and buy an enforcer, they may use it as an excuse for not honouring the warranty. TBH, if I was in the business of selling equipment, I would try a bit harder than Ashbys are.  The enforcer looks like a good bit of kit, but I can't deal with a company that seems at best unhelpful and at worst protectionist.

Ooo...I think I've just made a decision!

[Rob Lewis]

Tadgh/Neil - which colloidal products do you use/recommend?

[Radek Jablonski]

Tadgh, do something good to the Ireland economy and this industry and sell some good equipment and tools on normal prices, so I will no need to order them in UK. As if anything is beeing sold here somethimes has nearly double price.

[john martin]

go on then, what difficulties?

Hi Carpet Dawg, in my eyes Ultimate Master is old school technology, i am not even going there, just my two cents worth, i will even say again i am not going there. Tadgh

There are no issues with UM .

Tadgh , i think you are all about selling your well diluted plant detergent which u buy cheap in concentrate , add some tap water and sell for 60 euro for a small container .