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Frankybadboy

  • Posts: 9022
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2014, 08:44:34 pm »
your all bloody a bunch of amateurs  :P :P :P

Marc Stock

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2014, 10:41:14 pm »
You said that your tank TDS is 3. Is this DI water stored in your tank? Or RO being pumped through the di. As if you are using water that's reading anything above 1, your going to get issues; epscially in the strong sunshine.

SeanK

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2014, 11:18:41 pm »
You said that your tank TDS is 3. Is this DI water stored in your tank? Or RO being pumped through the di. As if you are using water that's reading anything above 1, your going to get issues; epscially in the strong sunshine.



Marc I have used water with a tds of 12 with no problems and I know there are guys who have went a lot higher.

Marc Stock

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2014, 11:51:16 pm »
hmmm.  :-\

really if you are using 'pure' water and it isn't pure. in my opinion theres your issue

SeanK

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2014, 12:05:50 am »
Marc even at 000 ppm your water isn't pure it could still be filtered lower.
You could still have x amount of parts per 10 million so why don't they leave spots ?

dannymack

  • Posts: 1624
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2014, 06:43:56 am »
Marc your defo wrong there as I've used water at a Tds reading of 020 no spotting, seems you must be wasting your earnings if your changing resin more often than you should be by keeping your Tds reading at 000 ?  ::)roll

roundbuilder

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #26 on: April 15, 2014, 08:34:12 am »
Maybe its where your customers are all 8 weekly and with all the dust and sand particles about they are covering the windows and frames a lot more than 4 weekly cleaning would, with all the dust im imagining you would need to treat many like first cleans to bring them up good without spotting??
Thats what i have found with some of my 8 weekly cleans as i too had a few complaints which when i went back to look could see instantly it was where i didnt scrub and rinse enough.

SeanK

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #27 on: April 15, 2014, 08:44:29 am »
Maybe its where your customers are all 8 weekly and with all the dust and sand particles about they are covering the windows and frames a lot more than 4 weekly cleaning would, with all the dust im imagining you would need to treat many like first cleans to bring them up good without spotting??
Thats what i have found with some of my 8 weekly cleans as i too had a few complaints which when i went back to look could see instantly it was where i didnt scrub and rinse enough.


Would agree with this, all my 8 weekly cleans are filthy and covered with a scum that's hard to remove even my 6 weekly
are a lot worse than usual.

Marc Stock

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #28 on: April 15, 2014, 09:04:02 am »
Its just my opinion that's all.

Keeping at  000 is not a waste of money its called due diligence, and minimising risk of complaints.

Its the way I like things done.

8weekly

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #29 on: April 15, 2014, 09:52:34 am »
Maybe its where your customers are all 8 weekly and with all the dust and sand particles about they are covering the windows and frames a lot more than 4 weekly cleaning would, with all the dust im imagining you would need to treat many like first cleans to bring them up good without spotting??
Thats what i have found with some of my 8 weekly cleans as i too had a few complaints which when i went back to look could see instantly it was where i didnt scrub and rinse enough.
I think you may well have a point Mick.

8weekly

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #30 on: July 16, 2014, 07:44:40 am »
Just an update. Since I switched back, no complaints.

Jonny 87

  • Posts: 3488
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #31 on: July 16, 2014, 08:08:33 am »
2 litres per minute flow rate.

Tecbuk brush (awesome for scrubbing)

Decent technique.

Should nearly always be spot free unless it's troublesome windows where you have to adjust your technique.
Vision Technician / Visual Engineer /  Vision Enhancement Operative /...........................................................OnlyUseMeWFP AkA Jonny the Windy Wesher

Alex Gardiner

  • Posts: 7742
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #32 on: July 16, 2014, 08:15:46 am »
I've been going about 5 years and over that time have had the odd complaint, but in the last couple of months I have had 7 or 8 complaints. On Saturday I cleaned my own windows and the result was very poor. Spotting and a couple of streaks.

My thoughts on the causes centre around a few things. I have tested the TDS and it is 3 in the tank in the van.

"Inspired" by some that say windows can be cleaned really quickly I have been moving towards faster times so that is one possibility. I have been skimping on the rinsing.

But I think the problem is with a sill brush and fan jets. The angle of the jets seems to point upwards on the brush and therefore at times the water is spraying upwards slightly. Also, the jets are constantly getting blocked and water is spraying in an uncontrolled way. I accept it may be my technique with fans and sill brushes.

I always clean the top frame & am usually pretty brave with vents too.

I wondered what people's thoughts were or if anyone had any other ideas?

If the angle of the jets are pointing upwards it means that your gooseneck would need adjusting down slightly. The Sill brushes are designed so that the brush jets should be pointing at exactly 90° in use. This will then also allow for correct splay of the brush downwards for Sill cleaning.

If you combine fanjets with a slightly upward pointing angle of brush then it is very possible that any spots are from this. Fanjets always have the tendency to spray around a bit, so need closer rinsing to the glass and being careful not to over spray.

Alex Gardiner

  • Posts: 7742
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #33 on: July 16, 2014, 08:17:08 am »
Just an update. Since I switched back, no complaints.

Is this since you have switched back to pencil jets? These are my favourite as well  :)

You would still need to make sure that the angle of the gooseneck is correct though to get the jets spraying at 90° on to the glass for best results.

Carl2009

  • Posts: 806
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #34 on: July 16, 2014, 08:25:20 am »
Interesting thread.

I've had, I think, 4 complaints in 5 years: 2 the marks were on the inside, 1 was what I thought was a good clean (done with TFR) on a white PVC-framed property, but the glass was not clean when dry, though did clean up nicely on the callback (more later); the 4th I couldn't see what she was on about whether from inside or out  ::)roll.

I use a Superlite with pencil jets on an SLX with a swivel Resi-neck. I did use a Vikan sill brush when I started but, with the Xtel pole, it was like swinging a brick on a bamboo cane. My TDS is always 000, but I live in a soft water area and use both an RO and DI; I change my resin every, say, 18 months. My flow is on 65-ish for a first clean, 54 for maintenance cleans.

I always clean vents on a first clean to get as much dirt out as possible, then regularly thereafter. So it's a wet of the window first, then top frame including vent, then sides and with the swivel on the resi-neck the sill. I don't stress about the sill and no-one has ever commented it's not clean - with the right angle a swivel resi-neck will allow them (and many Veluxes) to be cleaned (Veluxes without collapsing the pole to alter the angle). After i've done the frames I clean the window. I rinse off the glass from the top frame, but only the glass. On most first cleans I return to the first upper storey window and rinse again to make sure that all vent muck has been rinsed away. Ditto on ground storeys. (I charge as much as double for a first clean, so I'm covered. I never price from Google).

On the one clean I had a genuine complaint about I have no idea why it was dirty. It wasn't spotting or streaking or vent drips, but it was dirty (more like lead patination, but def not dry TFR or missed windows). Not all windows were affected and it was a bungalow, so it was easy to see it was "clean" when I finished it originally. I used TFR as there was some algae and the frames were mint when I finished I still have no idea what the residue was, but when I cleaned the affected windows again and let them dry they were perfect.

I'd say that the issue was a combination of the factors already raised. Overspray is a big issue - if there is too much power then the water bounces off the glass. I've not found that brickwork gives me any problems, but the (coloured?) render used on many new houses here in Wales does - it's dreadful. I'd suggest a swivel Resi-neck is a cracking piece of kit and would, as some else has said, suggest you can't clean some windows above connies well without one. It also gets you away from a sill brush. I know nothing of fan jets as i've never (nor would I) use them. Why tolerate a TDS above 000 - due diligence and you know it's not the water. Water does change in TDS out of the tap, so this needs to be monitored, especially in hard water areas. Again to deliver a satisfactory clean vents do need to be done - avoiding the top frame is a cop out in my book. Once done maintenance cleans keep them clean.

Glad your issue is all sorted now.

koopmaster

  • Posts: 498
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #35 on: July 16, 2014, 08:42:22 am »
Alex has a new overspray system coming out soon, I hope this sorts out the rinsing issue for us.

Spruce

  • Posts: 8463
Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #36 on: July 16, 2014, 10:06:01 am »
Alex has a new overspray system coming out soon, I hope this sorts out the rinsing issue for us.

I don't think it is designed for everyday residential cleans. According to the 'teaser' on their website, it is for mainly larger commercial sheets of glass.

Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)

8weekly

Re: Complaints - brushes & jets?
« Reply #37 on: July 16, 2014, 12:54:08 pm »
I've been going about 5 years and over that time have had the odd complaint, but in the last couple of months I have had 7 or 8 complaints. On Saturday I cleaned my own windows and the result was very poor. Spotting and a couple of streaks.

My thoughts on the causes centre around a few things. I have tested the TDS and it is 3 in the tank in the van.

"Inspired" by some that say windows can be cleaned really quickly I have been moving towards faster times so that is one possibility. I have been skimping on the rinsing.

But I think the problem is with a sill brush and fan jets. The angle of the jets seems to point upwards on the brush and therefore at times the water is spraying upwards slightly. Also, the jets are constantly getting blocked and water is spraying in an uncontrolled way. I accept it may be my technique with fans and sill brushes.

I always clean the top frame & am usually pretty brave with vents too.

I wondered what people's thoughts were or if anyone had any other ideas?

If the angle of the jets are pointing upwards it means that your gooseneck would need adjusting down slightly. The Sill brushes are designed so that the brush jets should be pointing at exactly 90° in use. This will then also allow for correct splay of the brush downwards for Sill cleaning.

If you combine fanjets with a slightly upward pointing angle of brush then it is very possible that any spots are from this. Fanjets always have the tendency to spray around a bit, so need closer rinsing to the glass and being careful not to over spray.
Yes, I think in the end I decided it was technique. It always struck me as strange as so little bristle is designed for the glass on a sill brush.

To be hones though, after a couple of weeks of am Etreme brush I don't now know how I managed before with the weight. Love them.