[Dave Willis]

What I'm getting at is that Firemen, Teachers, Police or whatever are still relatively fortunate in a) still having a job, b) a reasonably well paid one and c) still having a pension to look forward to eventually.

Most of us have had the pay cuts, the overtime cuts, been told to work 'till we drop the redundancy (with pathetic payouts) and loss of much of our pensions. Teachers in my opinion have little to complain about.

why do you think I'm now cleaning windows?

[robert mitchell]

The pension is not free , we pay more than double what most people pay - public or private sector .

Cant comment on teachers , I dont do there job and Im pretty sure I couldn't.

Everyone has the choice of what career they pursue .

I personally have had some awful jobs in my time , thats why I I pushed myself hard to get a job I enjoy .

[Dave Willis]

What I'm trying to say (nicely) is that most of us have been through it already years ago with no option to strike. many of us were told in our jobs 'if you don't like it then bugger off down the road!'

I lost my chosen career, I lost much of my pension, I lost the choice to retire early - I lost my job. The Firemen are going through what many of us had to endure years ago.

Cleaning windows for me was a desperate move which luckily so far has worked out well.

[Sean Kelly]

Yea we have a pension which we pay into!!

[Dave Willis]

so did I whilst I had a job - many fellow employees carried on contributing, only the employers 'forgot' about passing the payments on to the pension fund.

[Sean Kelly]

No reason to have a go out public sector pensions though is it?? If you know what your worth go out and get it bud

[home6442]

What I'm trying to say (nicely) is that most of us have been through it already years ago with no option to strike. many of us were told in our jobs 'if you don't like it then bugger off down the road!'

I lost my chosen career, I lost much of my pension, I lost the choice to retire early - I lost my job. The Firemen are going through what many of us had to endure years ago.

Cleaning windows for me was a desperate move which luckily so far has worked out well.

Does that make it right Dave,
Same thing that happened to you happened to me and has also happened to a lot more.
At the end of the day if you agreed to do a job for £1000 and the customer decided to pay you £500
would you be happy.
The fire fighters agreed to do a job for the government for an agreed wage and pension ( a contract )
What the government wants to do now is break that contract and pay less than agreed.
Its the same as a customer ripping you or me off.
Doesn't matter if you think they should get it or not a contract is a contract.

[C o z y]

Are these the people who are trying to nick your pensions lads?

[Sean Kelly]

5 letter word rymes with munts

[gary999]

Are these the people who are trying to nick your pensions lads?

unfortunately if this issue gets pushed at this time...they will
get away with it.

[robert mitchell]

Yep thats the greedy lying theives .

[Dave Mills]

Statistically you will be involved in 2 major fires in your life, let's see who you count on if your involved in one

Balls.

45,000 fires in dwellings two years ago. (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/6762/568234.pdf).  That includes ALL fires in dwellings, e.g. chip pan.

If I live to be 70, therell have been 3 million fires in total.  So there's a 1 in 20 chance Ill ever be in even a minor fire in a dwelling.  Increase that to all indoor fires (80,000) and your statistic is still just plain wrong.

[robert mitchell]

As a service we do loads of prevention work and this has caused fire deaths to drop a lot.(apart from in london where it has recently started to climb).

[Geoff]

Well, it seems that they will be too old to climb ladders to fight fires at age 60, so we should see less of them climbing ladders at 60 to clean windows.  Here's a vid showing real geriatric firemen on strike last night.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24780162

[trevor perry]

I thought firemen went through routine fitness tests, surely their fitness is part of their contract to do the job, if a firemen cannot maintain his fitness till the age of sixty then he should be fired as he is no longer fit for purpose this should happen at any age.
  I know some firemen pride themselves in keeping extremely fit and these will have no trouble maintaining fitness well into their sixties others are just pie eating slobs and should be removed from service well before they reach this point

[deeege]

What a disgusting union you guys belong to. Encouraging you not to 'breach the terms of your agreement' to tackle the large dagenham blaze because no lives were threatened.

Fair play to the London firefighters that tackled the blaze but you guys are really starting to lose the publics respect thanks to the actions of your union.

[robert mitchell]

You speak for all of the public do you ?

Apart from this forum we actually have a lot of public support.

The agreement with the government was that we would come off the picket line if life was in danger , there was no life risk.

Trevor , you dont have all the facts .

Most of the people affected by this change have been paying double the average contributions into there pension so they can retire at 55 before they are too old to do the job safely,  the government s own research shows that 85% of firefighters will be unable to pass the fitness tests past thr age of 55 , this is due to ageing not lack of excercise.
As you get older the physiological effects of heat on your body become much worse in your fifties causing all sorts of problems including heart attacks .

The government are stealing from pensions that have already been paid for .

Yet the mps are still trying to push through there own 11% pay rise .

[deeege]

Of course I don't speak for the public as a whole, do you speak for firefighters as a whole?

Was you at the pocket line yourself? How long for?

[trevor perry]

You speak for all of the public do you ?

Apart from this forum we actually have a lot of public support.

The agreement with the government was that we would come off the picket line if life was in danger , there was no life risk.

Trevor , you dont have all the facts .

Most of the people affected by this change have been paying double the average contributions into there pension so they can retire at 55 before they are too old to do the job safely,  the government s own research shows that 85% of firefighters will be unable to pass the fitness tests past thr age of 55 , this is due to ageing not lack of excercise.
As you get older the physiological effects of heat on your body become much worse in your fifties causing all sorts of problems including heart attacks .

The government are stealing from pensions that have already been paid for .

Yet the mps are still trying to push through there own 11% pay rise .

 as for your pensions you should be paid according to what you have paid in and the government has no right to steal from that pot, but is this the case or have the pensions just underperformed and they are not paying what you was told to expect.
  You are right I don't have all the details but I presume firefighters paid so much into the funds because the deal they got offered at the time seemed to good to be true well I guess now you are learning that the deal was to good to be true and like other hardworking individuals are suffering big shortfalls in your pensions, I don't have any answers and feel sorry for any who have been duped.
   The only lesson that can be learned by everyone from this is do not trust the government or any other large organisation to take care of your pension rather make your own provision, currently everyone is going to be enrolled into a new pension scheme where the employer has to add a percentage to the fund , most think this is wonderfull but personally I don't think the funds will exist when its time for them to pay up as the saying goes" fool me once shame on you, foolme again shame on me"

[robert mitchell]

No and I dont pretend to but most firefighters are united over these issues .

I also have the facts rather than just what you read in the paper or see on the news .

Brandon lewis has been using spin and pure lies to try and erode public support while our union ( that have held off from action for over two years now ) are telling the public the facts .

You said the union is losing the publics respect so your inferring  that you are speaking for the public .

If its lost your respect , even though your not in possession of all the facts , thats fine but dont try and speak for everyone .