[MWC]

Being able to do a job is a lot different to knowing a job

A lot of people in all industries are only able to do a job and this is why people don't understand what knowing a job is about.

[roundbuilder]

Being able to do a job is a lot different to knowing a job

A lot of people in all industries are only able to do a job and this is why people don't understand what knowing a job is about.

Im lost what do you mean.

[DG Cleaning]

It doesn't take long to even train yourself so you are out and earning at a decent rate.

[roundbuilder]

http://m.schoolleaverjobs.co.uk/Job/134273/Apprenticeship-Trainee-Window-Cleaner

Well well it seems i was wrong.

[8weekly]

Modern apprenticeships are just a way of getting cheap labour. The term "apprentice" is prefered to the old stye YOP type of thing. It isn't an apprenticeship in the way it used to be.

[DG Cleaning]

Everybody's opinions are different clearly.

Yes it takes short time to show someone how to clean windows, but doing it correctly is something else.

Over the years I have employed lads who train everyday and where very fit lads, who didn't realise how hard using ladders over the course of a day was.

I'm old school, so I obviously look at it slightly different maybe, but speaking as someone who has employed many staff, it is difficult to get good lads.


I'm sure it is hard to get good lads but the ones with half a brain will see an apprenticeship in cleaning windows for what it really is.
I imagine it will always be hard to find good employees, not many people leave school and have an ambition to wipe windows.

[Neil Gornall]

I have an apprentice, he is almost 19. He joined us in feb this year and is proving a real asset.  You guys who say things like "you can train wfp in a day" or "its taking advantage" really are stuck inside your little box.
Sure I taught him the very basics in a day but if your running things as a business then I think there is so much more for the youngsters to learn. Good communication with the customer is not learned in a day it takes months if not years. Some of you out there don't have it now even after years of being a shiner.
Andrew was sruggling to find work as all the polish have taken the jobs he would normaly do as a school leaver. He now has a trade, confidence, experience, and the self belief that he is employable.
I have a hard worker who at first did not earn me much but I only have to pay him a low wage so that did not matter. Soon the govt will give me a grant which I will put towards training uniform and such. He is a real asset and at the end of his apprentiship he will be offered a full time job on a mans wage. I trust him to do a good job which is why I am laying on a beach sunbathing as I write this happy in the knowledge he is working hard for my company earning for us both.

[C o z y]

Over here, there's an apprenticeship in commercial cleaning. It's a 2 and a half year thing and ends with a sort of certificate the same as any other trade. The trainee learns all about chemicals and their PH rates etc etc. The reason this is a recognized trade is because of the damage that can be caused by using incorrect chemicals or dangerous over use of them etc. PART  OF the training involves window cleaning and all the H&S stuff that this involves etc.

There is no independent apprenticeship for a window cleaner here. But that's because it wouldn't last more than a few days to explain the H&S stuff that's involved.

I used to drive HGV, but that never involved Abnormal loads and the H&S laws regarding that. So driving 150 tonne loads wasn't needed to call yourself a lorry driver. Its the same with window cleaning really. Any mong can clean a window to a decent standard without having to go 2 days a week to college and 3 days a week on practice jobs.

Some people will always try to "big up" whatever they do to earn a crust, and call themselves "vision enhancement technicians", but we're all on the same job as Stan Ogden.

Apprentice window cleaner, a classic.  

[Neil Gornall]

Cozy. You may be on the same job as stan Ogden but please don't say we all are.
Sure we clean windows and the end result is the same but the methods used and potential jobs are nothing like stan did.
But i suppose its easier to assume we are all the same if you are an under achiever rather than admit you could have done better :-)

[g.brookes]

Neil and archer thank you for your replies..  It would be good to chat to trade some ideas etc. 
The rest of you are like broken records.
Any one else that can actually help me with the subject of this topic, your comments would be greatly appreciated.

[Frankybadboy]

iam shocked that I agree with archer on this,

yes easy to use a pole on domestic,but try getting them to use a pole over 60ft and do a good job

so many aspects of window cleaning to learn when you do a wide range of jobs,

I will say I still learn every day 

[C o z y]

Cozy. You may be on the same job as stan Ogden but please don't say we all are.
Sure we clean windows and the end result is the same but the methods used and potential jobs are nothing like stan did.
But i suppose its easier to assume we are all the same if you are an under achiever rather than admit you could have done better :-)

I could bite there, but I won't   I know you see me as an underachiever, even though I''ve paid off my mortgage doing simple window cleaning. I see window cleaning as a means to an end. I don't see anyone in this game as a "Richard Branson" type of guy. Some have a few vans on the go etc. But we aren't life and death sort of people. If we don't clean Mrs Smiths windows, or Lloyds bank's windows, the world will still carry on.

Now plumbers, or leccies, or brickies, that's a different matter. I expect some egoes will be damaged mate, but we just clean windows. And that's it.

Some of the firms that do contract cleaning here have over 600 vehicles on the go, and that's not even the firms who work national. They see window cleaning as a by product of a cleaning contract and just subby it out. They buy and sell firms with a few vans.

That's the way I see it. Bottom of the food chain in the public eye. I don't care though, I only work 12 to 15 working days a month, and live a nice easy stress free life.

Stan Ogden or Richard Branson, big it up all you want mate  

[Dave Willis]

It takes years to 'waggle' a brush and a further year to learn how to open and close a valve. People don't realise the skill involved.

[roundbuilder]

Cozy. You may be on the same job as stan Ogden but please don't say we all are.
Sure we clean windows and the end result is the same but the methods used and potential jobs are nothing like stan did.
But i suppose its easier to assume we are all the same if you are an under achiever rather than admit you could have done better :-)

I could bite there, but I won't   I know you see me as an underachiever, even though I''ve paid off my mortgage doing simple window cleaning. I see window cleaning as a means to an end. I don't see anyone in this game as a "Richard Branson" type of guy. Some have a few vans on the go etc. But we aren't life and death sort of people. If we don't clean Mrs Smiths windows, or Lloyds bank's windows, the world will still carry on.

Now plumbers, or leccies, or brickies, that's a different matter. I expect some egoes will be damaged mate, but we just clean windows. And that's it.

Some of the firms that do contract cleaning here have over 600 vehicles on the go, and that's not even the firms who work national. They see window cleaning as a by product of a cleaning contract and just subby it out. They buy and sell firms with a few vans.

That's the way I see it. Bottom of the food chain in the public eye. I don't care though, I only work 12 to 15 working days a month, and live a nice easy stress free life.

Stan Ogden or Richard Branson, big it up all you want mate  

Well written and i couldnt agree more.

[C o z y]

It takes years to 'waggle' a brush and a further year to learn how to open and close a valve. People don't realise the skill involved.

OK, you got me there Dave. It can be difficult. Maybe a 3 year course and 2 days a week in college would be right then.  

[Dave Willis]

Imagine, as a parent having to tell somebody that your Son is doing really well - he's just left school and landed an apprentiship .................................................................... in window cleaning  



Could be worse I suppose - your daughter could be an apprentice scrubber ............................ of solar panels!

[C o z y]

I would be interested to know what kind of work we are all talking about, because I don't believe anyone can be taught window cleaning that easy, yes some of you can but you have either got it, or you haven't, pretty simple really.

Please tell me what scale work we are on about ?

Houses ?

If you're talking about abseil work, or cherry picker, those are extra quals that can be taught in a very short time. Not enough to stretch a learning curve of over 3 years!!! One and 5 day courses for those kind of work. Hardly an apprenticeship, I think you'll agree?

[g.brookes]

archer its g.brookes@brookesandsonswindowcleaning.co.uk  bit of a mouthful i know!

[telfordwindowclnr]

I have an apprentice, he is almost 19. He joined us in feb this year and is proving a real asset.  You guys who say things like "you can train wfp in a day" or "its taking advantage" really are stuck inside your little box.
Sure I taught him the very basics in a day but if your running things as a business then I think there is so much more for the youngsters to learn. Good communication with the customer is not learned in a day it takes months if not years. Some of you out there don't have it now even after years of being a shiner.
Andrew was sruggling to find work as all the polish have taken the jobs he would normaly do as a school leaver. He now has a trade, confidence, experience, and the self belief that he is employable.
I have a hard worker who at first did not earn me much but I only have to pay him a low wage so that did not matter. Soon the govt will give me a grant which I will put towards training uniform and such. He is a real asset and at the end of his apprentiship he will be offered a full time job on a mans wage. I trust him to do a good job which is why I am laying on a beach sunbathing as I write this happy in the knowledge he is working hard for my company earning for us both.

+1 in many ways, including sitting on the beach today while the boys are earning! 

[telfordwindowclnr]

Interesting thread this. Just for clarification, do some of you think you can teach someone everything there is to know about window cleaning in a couple of hours or days? It's not a trick question, but consider your answer carefully...it may affect your credibility on here....