[dish]

I'm not sure how old this is, but if you have seen it before - sorry to cover old ground.  If you haven't, I'm sure it will annoy you as much as it did me.

http://www.holdthefrontpage.co.uk/funny/2004/12dec/barry145a.shtml

[Grafters Cleaning Services]

hmmm?
interesting

i say don't rise to the bait

you're probally earning more money than the author of the article anyway

thick or not, i'm happy with my chossen profession
jay

[KJG]

I bet you'll find his wife has a different view of window cleaners Probably the reason behind the article however he may have a point Every window cleaner with the last two firms I worked for had a criminal record Some with 7 or 8 stretches behind them. I felt left out with just 2 parking tickets to boast about

[Morph]

  Think nothing of it.
Just a case in point..
I visited a friend in Ireland once.  With his red hair, freckles and broad Dublin accent, he said to me with a glint in his eye, "Y'know the English think the Irish are thick....We'd like them to keep thinking that!"
The Irish economy is stronger than England's, and property prices are higher, and rising!

Prejudice usually has little, or no substance.

[WavieDavie]

If you want to find out exactly when the article was written and then search around Cleanitup, you'll see that it was mentioned on here at the time.

Can't remember what I had for breakfast this morning though!

[windows_chepstow]

Here's Sessuton's link in print:

I know it's hard to believe, but there are some kids so stupid that they can't even get a place at one of Mr Blah's special thicko universities. These youths go off to be window cleaners.

But even there, with only a bucket of water, a ladder and a chamois leather to co-ordinate, they're not safe from the degree-dispensing NuLabour social engineers.

I am indebted to a reader of this column for sending me the following advert for … wait for it … the British Window Cleaning Academy where, for a small fee of £95, aspiring chamois-wielders can take a one-day intensive course resulting in the award of a Level 2 NVQ in Window Cleaning. No, really.

"Learn to squeegee like a pro", they urge, promising detailed instruction in "Waterfed Pole Use and Basic Health and Safety".

Now call me elitist, but how thick do you have to be to need an intensive course in window cleaning? "Dip rag in bucket, rub window, do not fall off ladder" seems to be about it.

And anyway, what are window cleaners apart from off-duty burglars? The whole thing is probably just a sinister front for teaching criminals the latest house-breaking techniques. I think Officer Dibble should take a look.

Personally, I thought it was entertaining.

Remember it's easy to make fun of just about any occupation.  As a soldier I read/heard many a unrine-extraction over how thick we were.

Working in a police station in Ireland for three years, I heard and made lots of 'police/RUC' jokes.  Social workers, teachers, engineers, computer programmers, council workers, shelf-stackers to name but a few jobs, all are the brunt of jokes.

My advice is not to take this sort of thing seriously; it could be deemed that you feel insecure about being a window cleaner.

Don't be like the lady that protests too much!

[gaza]

wish I KNEW WERE SHE LIVED, ; SEND AROUND AN EDUCATED LOCAL MANS SON WHOS THE BIGGEST BURGLER THIS SIDE OF THE TRENT
GAZA

[windows_chepstow]

wish I KNEW WERE SHE LIVED, ; SEND AROUND AN EDUCATED LOCAL MANS SON WHOS THE BIGGEST BURGLER THIS SIDE OF THE TRENT
GAZA

Gaza, (sigh!)

When I say, 'don't be like the lady who protests too much',  it's from Shakespear; but a common enough phrase.

Malc Gould will no-doubt educate us on what play it's from.

From my limited knowledge, some woman was accused of something that was true, and it was known that it was actually true because she 'protested' too much. 

Had it been untrue she'd've said something like, 'What-ever!'  Or something!

It was a bloke who wrote the article and it was written 'tongue in cheek'!  Read the whole article, it's really about Tony Blair and the Nanny State.

There's no requirement for burglars!

[Moderator David@stives]

Window cleaners are honest hard working individuals who take great pride in their work and have a lot to deal with everyday, they are not criminals or high school drop outs in fact quite the opposite, a lot of them have left other careers such as accountants and electricians and from almost all trades and proffessions to become window cleaners.

They are faced with many issues, the working at height directive being one of them.

When you lablel window cleaners criminals etc,you are actually damaging the image of window cleaners who in my opinion have one of the hardest jobs in Britain,certainly the most dangerous.

The BWCA along with Trade associations are their to educate and  help window cleaners work safely within the law and to raise standards within the industry.



David

[gaza]

tosh just carnt see how you evaluate your previous statement ,see I can write profound statements as well,but Im only a w/c. some oink who knows note about nought.but at 50 can out work any youngster ,and still go for a beer at night get to bed at midnight and go graft the next day,iit annoys me when Igo around an estate
and see so many younguns idling about with no intention of going to work.

 tosh keep taking the tablets its not even a parable,its a tort on our hardworking
legite trade.

 gaza

[windows_chepstow]

When you lablel window cleaners criminals etc,you are actually damaging the image of window cleaners who in my opinion have one of the hardest jobs in Britain,certainly the most dangerous.

David

Fishermen have the most dangerous occupation in the UK; probably the hardest too:

http://www.kgfs.org.uk/thesea/

Don't believe the Churchill Insurance rubbish; 'click here for insurance' survey.

Have a google.  Window Cleaners don't even make the top ten.  There's soldiers, firemen, policemen, kebab shop owners etc.

[Moderator David@stives]

Do you know the actual figures for injuries from each occupation ?

[windows_chepstow]

Do you know the actual figures for injuries from each occupation ?

David,

I don't; nor do I wish to know.

I know falls from height is the Number One UK major industrial work-place accident cause.

However that covers anything from a Tesco worker falling from a step-ladder through to painter and decorators to anyone else who works at height.

But saying Window Cleaners have the most dangerous and arduous occupation is wrong.

Quote from the above fishing link:

Fishing, for example, is the most dangerous occupation in the UK. On average there are 10 major accidents a month. 28 vessels are lost each year.

I recently read that a university studied which occupation was the most dangerous and it did actually look at all the available statistics.

It found Fishing.  Followed by numerous other occupations; none of them were window cleaners.

[Moderator David@stives]

Falling from ladders accounted for 19% of fatal and 32% of major falling from height injuries in 2001/02. Statistics indicate that there are around 14 fatalities and 1,200major injuries reported to HSE each year due to falls from ladders. The construction industry has accounted for around 40% of falls from ladders in the past five years. A significant proportion of injuries also occur in the service and manufacturing industries with window cleaners accounting for around one third of falls from ladders in the service sector.6.Statistics indicate that there are an average of 4 fatalities amongst window cleaners due to falls from height each year (the majority of these will involve ladders).

[Paul Coleman]

I'm not sure how old this is, but if you have seen it before - sorry to cover old ground.  If you haven't, I'm sure it will annoy you as much as it did me.

http://www.holdthefrontpage.co.uk/funny/2004/12dec/barry145a.shtml

The funny thing about it is that I can often write as well as the person who wrote that and, if I put my mind to it, would be able to do an equally good p take of journalists.  To me this astonishingly brilliant (ahem !!) piece of investigative journalism is water of a duck's back and written by some wannabe who likes to pick on easy targets. Just wait for the water restrictions.  This pillock will probably go around following window cleaners and label it as the new "Watergate" scandal.  As for the jibe about criminal records - yes I've got one.  So what. It's long spent. I grew up. Big deal.  As for school qualifications.  I don't have any.  So what.  I was capable but needed to leave home in my mid teens due to problems there.  Brown stuff happens.  I tell you what though.  I've had plenty of knocks and they are character building.  Not like that tarty feather bedded journalist who needs an easy target.  I wouldsn't swapo my life for his in spite of all the warts.

[www.mrgutters.co.uk]

we might be chamois wielding boys ! but we earn more in in hour than the idot who it earns in a day , so he can smoke that.

shawn

[Philip Hanson]

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=5144.0

It never ceases to amaze me how some window cleaners seem to be quite happy to accept that our trade is viewed in a 'rougueish' way.  I discovered this when I complained about this news item.

This article, by 'Barry Beelzebub' was a syndicated item which originated with the Bristol daily news paper Bristol Evening Post in December of 2004 and has by now pretty much ended up in most daily's around the UK.

I raised this subject when it was published, and wrote to the newspaper.  In response, not only did they print my letter, but the person who wrote to 'Barry Beelzebub' in the first place wrote in again apologising for causing offense, and explaining why he'd wrote in.  The reason he wrote in is below.

At the time, opinion was mixed as to whether it should just have been 'laughed off' as satire, or if the complaint was worthwhile.

I refuse to accept that window cleaners should just accept the image of the 'off-duty burglar' as humor.  But, this is just my opinion, and as you'll see from the thread linked to above, some window cleaners thought I over-reacted and are happy to be thought of that way.

Ho hum!

-Philip

PS here's why the person wrote to Barry Beelzebub in the first place.

He was the facilities manager of an office building, and had been contacted by a window cleaner who uses a pole system.  The letter from this window cleaner was full of spelling and gramatical mistakes, and referred to the "powerful and scientifically proven cleaning effect of ultra pure water, as used in medical labs".

Understandably, he though this was a hilarious claim and decided to try to find out some facts about it, and came across Ionic's website and the BWCA.

This holds a lesson for us.  Don't make ridiculous claims when contacting potential customers.

This window cleaner had obviously tried to make WFP appear as technical as possible to the point of sounding like a con-man, and of course most people can see through made-up claims.  WFP does need more explaining than conventional cleaning, but it isn't rocket science, and we shouldn't try to impress customers by pretending that it is somehow scientific and technical when it isn't!

Similarly, I have seen letters from window cleaners to customers urging them to contact "our sales department" when they are a sole-trader and the number given is a mobile.  Also "Our poles will reach any height" Really?  that must be how they're cleaning the Empire State Building these days then.  What about the building manager who was contacted by a window cleaner a while back who'd said he'd invested "Over £20,000 on the latest Reach & Wash^tm equipment".  When he turned up, the manager commented how it was difficult to imagine that a few 25 litre barrels in the back of a car had cost £20k.

Really, it does us no favours to try too hard to impress, and it can make us look ridiculous!  Honesty is the best policy, and if you have got something worth shouting about, be subtle about it.  Less is more, as they say.

[Paul Coleman]

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=5144.0

It never ceases to amaze me how some window cleaners seem to be quite happy to accept that our trade is viewed in a 'rougueish' way.  I discovered this when I complained about this news item.

This article, by 'Barry Beelzebub' was a syndicated item which originated with the Bristol daily news paper Bristol Evening Post in December of 2004 and has by now pretty much ended up in most daily's around the UK.

I raised this subject when it was published, and wrote to the newspaper.  In response, not only did they print my letter, but the person who wrote to 'Barry Beelzebub' in the first place wrote in again apologising for causing offense, and explaining why he'd wrote in.  The reason he wrote in is below.

At the time, opinion was mixed as to whether it should just have been 'laughed off' as satire, or if the complaint was worthwhile.

I refuse to accept that window cleaners should just accept the image of the 'off-duty burglar' as humor.  But, this is just my opinion, and as you'll see from the thread linked to above, some window cleaners thought I over-reacted and are happy to be thought of that way.

Ho hum!

-Philip

PS here's why the person wrote to Barry Beelzebub in the first place.

He was the facilities manager of an office building, and had been contacted by a window cleaner who uses a pole system.  The letter from this window cleaner was full of spelling and grammatical mistakes, and refferred to the "powerful and scientifically proven cleaning effect of ultra pure water, as used in medical labs".

Understandably, he though this was a hilarious claim and decided to try to find out some facts about it, and came across Ionic's website and the BWCA.

This holds a lesson for us.  Don't make ridiculous claims when contacting potential customers.

This window cleaner had obviously tried to make WFP appear as technical as possible to the point of sounding like a con-man, and of course most people can see through made-up claims.  WFP does need more explaining than conventional cleaning, but it isn't rocket science, and we shouldn't try to impress customers by pretending that it is somehow scientific and technical when it isn't!

Hi Philip.
I can see your point of view.  I wouldn't be happy being portrayed as an off duty burglar either but I do feel that this article is clearly meant to be satirical.  If it was being presented as a serious assessment of window cleaners, I probably would have responded in the way that you did (had I been aware of the article).  I've seen satirical items about others too such as politicians, publicans, shopkeepers etc .  I've also seen them about people of certain races and religions when it was acceptable to do that many years ago.  Not once have I ever assumed that the people in the above named groups are really like that (well - except the politicians maybe     ) .
To me, complaining about this particular article, in this particular context, would be like a hotel owner complaining about Fawlty Towers.
The most dangerous lies are those that closely resemble the truth.  Satire is just far away from the truth not to fall into this category.
Just my opinion of course which happens to be a bit different to yours.
No problem Philip but I just thought i ought to say it.

Indeed, the writer is even being a bit satirical about himself by using the name Beelzebub (another name for Satan I think).

[Morph]

Accident figures for workers 2004/5

Falls from height:
53 fatal.  3783 major injury.  8906 injury longer than 3 days.

Struck by moving vehicle:
35 fatal.  715 major injury.  1796 injury longer than 3 days.

Note the differences.

Not just more chance of fall from height than being struck by moving vehicle.
Calculate, if you can, how many moving vehicles there are to pedestrians.
Calculate, if you can, how many people working at height are actually using ladders.

Contemplate how much higher the risk must be!

I don't think it's a joke any more.

Do you take extra care when crossing a busy main road?

Do you take even more care when using a ladder?
You certainly should.  You are considerably more at risk of high speed impact, as you hit the ground from 15ft...if you're lucky!!

[Ian_Giles]

When this article was being mooted around on the forum a few months ago my initial reaction was 'Bloody cheek!'
But then on re-reading it you realise it is little more than tongue in cheek satire, with us as the butt of the joke.
After realising that I enjoyed reading the whole article.
If an article prompts a deep reaction then the author has done his job...this article certainly proves that point!

Philip however has raised some good points though, some of us are lucky enough to to be fairly adept with the written word, and think ourselves more than able to pen a posh, professional flyer of some description.
But many will end out writing something that'll make you wince with embarrassment to read.

If you are sending out promotional material, make sure spelling and grammar is correct, get it proof read by someone who will be able to point out the errors.
And don't bullsh*t with the content

Grafters was brave enough to put his new website up for criticism on here, some parts got shot down in flames
But he got a lot of good advice and his website will be the better for it when he puts that advice to good effect.

I going back to work!


Ian