[Alan Brooker. Aqualink Carpet Care]

What's this I've heard? Woodbridge sell a piece of kit that Super-purifies water (which allegedly is what microsplitting solution is- according to them). Anyone else heard of this?

Alan

[gwrightson]

must have a word with the window cleaning lads then
dont they use pure water  
 geoff

[spinnaker]

I doubt m/s are as simple as purified water,  in the dilution process this would mean adding purified water to un- purified water the result surely being water with impurities in?

Paul

[Karl Wildey]

interesting lack of replies, we all have no idea what we are using. If Alan is right, can we all make life a lot simplier for our selves and make our own m/s.

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys,

I'm pretty sure MS contain a large chunk of STTP, sodium tripolyphoshate or if not another similar sodium salt.

It would certainly be possible to buy some and experiment.

cheers

Doug

[carpetclean]

i am led to believe that micro splitters are just  purified water with a little adative but the addative is not needed and was informed that woodbridge sell a system that makes it. i am also told that some window cleaners use such a system and do not use  detergent just water for a smear free finish !???  i am intrigued to know if anyone has one of the systems fitted for carpets and how good it is.

[BRSL]

I think it's experiment time

How would I purrify water, I already use a water softner wich i see most window cleaners using

maybee we have been agitating tap water ha ha what a scam.

I was with Nick from soultions on Friday and said to him that I had a herd you could almost drink a M/S
So he took a swig from a No 3 didnt look to pleasent though 

James

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys,

To clarify MS are not purefied water but are the phosphate part of the cleaning chemical mix.

They are undoubtedly sodium salts , you can tell this by burning some of the crystals which precipitate out of solution , a yellow flame indicates sodium.

My solution no.2 has a large amount of precipitate , white powder in the bottom , which would indicate a close to saturated solution which is the opposite of the window cleaners wfp water where they lower the TDS , total dissolved solids.

The reason you can drink MS is that they are food grade products , STTP is used in toothpaste and many processed foods.

However no chemical is completely safe and good practice would not recommend trying to impress a customer by drinking MS in front of them.

Ed Crawford , the so called inventor of MS was apparently the first to prove the safeness of his chemical by drinking it.

Cheers

Doug

[Graeme@Access]

Hi,

ooooo a chemistry post, i do love them. 

IT appears that MS are (like Doug says) mainly Sodium tripoly phosphate.  Look at prochems MSDS for its splitter,

http://www.prochem.co.uk/safety%20data%20sheets/sdsc409.pdf
>30% sodium tri poly phosphate
<5% Di sodium Phosphate
<1% Fluorochemical wetting agent.

You got to love prochems honesty and the fact its 4 times cheaper per litre of normal strength splitter than other brands.

Hope this helps
Graeme
Access Cleaning Solutions

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys,

Excellent spot Graeme.

It would appear that the STPP is essentially the cleaning agent ,  with Di Sodium Phosphate acting as a buffer and the flourochemical wetting agent , wetting!!

The wetting is self explanatory and the buffer is used to keep the cleaning agent at its optimum pH when applied to a substrate.

I wasn't even aware Prochem sold this.

Cheers

Doug

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Again,

It would appear Prochem have stolen an advantage by selling the solid ingredients and therby saving loads of money ,  by not transporting water all over the place

Cheers

Doug

[Graeme@Access]

Hi,

We have a tub of Pure Clean and have used it in bonnet with a set of Charly pads.  Results were good, so maybe worth a look if you use a lot of splitters.

It does also save carrying water, which is one of my pet hates.

Cheers

Graeme
Access Cleaning Solutions

[Kinver_Clean]

We clean windows as well as carpets and use deionised water in our pole systems. We aim for zero Total Dissiolved Solids but tolerate up to 5 parts per milliom.
I understand that someone has tried using this on fabrics with result of leaving them very clean but with a lot of colour loss. I do not know where or who told me or who did it. 
A customer of mine says he can formulate 'non detergent cleaning agents' and can supply the ingredients at about £100 per ton, minimum order 10 tons, plus carriage. I think I'll still buy mine in 20 litre lots.

Trevor

[Bernard Hibbs]

Someone should see if they use MS in the USA.  There, at least in some states, they have whats called "right to know" where they have to list the chemicals used in every product. 

You should be able to get hold of it somehow. 

[Doug Holloway]

Bernard,

I believe STPP is banned in the USA and (Sweden) which is why we do not see 'Microspitters' from the states.

Cheers

Doug

[Alan Brooker. Aqualink Carpet Care]

Mornin all,
I thought this stuff was considered food grade. There must be something unpleasant about it for countries to ban its use.

Alan

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys,

STPP was banned in laundry products because it is believed to use up oxygen in water ,  causing polution.

Some claim that the alternatives , principally Zeolite are ineffective and therefore more poluting as larger quantities are required.

With science there are always side effects and claims of safe chemicals etc are marketing only.

Cheers

Doug

[gwrightson]

Doug, im not to sure micro spittwrs are banned in the state!!!
i was of the understanding that they did use them, but they were called a different name,
I may well be wrong, im sure somebody with contacts over there will correct me if i am wrong
 geoff

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Geoff,

I understand they are banned in laundry products but are allowed in other uses such as food , toothpaste etc , not sure where carpet cleaning products fit.

Cheers

Doug

[john rees]

I seem to remember them using them in the states and being called soap free procyon, used to have the link on the pc but it's out of date now I think