[C o z y]

Great post. So, Tony, still going ahead with the apprentice thingy?? 

[zeusweiler]

ok point taken but they are facts!!!, not opinions and thoughts.

i walked into a window cleaning job 10 years ago on the same wage as the rest with no Q's and previous training try doing that with a real trade.

it is a way of exploiting people and gaining cheap labour nothing more, regardless of what you all say.

you are all living on a far distant planet if you think this is a trade and you are imagining yourselves to be something you are not. non of you could answer the points made.

you are looking at it from an employers point of view only. think of the poor chap that has to go to an interview one day and says he did an apprenticeship in window cleaning, LOL is the response.

it also means that non of you lot are time served either unless you have undertaken the same training under a qualified certified mentor.

bunch of jokers....

[Caleb Morley]

John,

In your opinion is an apprentice only a real option if your looking for someone 5 days a week or would it also work if you only needed help on 2-3 days a week?

Cheers for your post and opinion,

Caleb

[Tom White]

ok point taken but they are facts!!!, not opinions and thoughts.

i walked into a window cleaning job 10 years ago on the same wage as the rest with no Q's and previous training try doing that with a real trade.

it is a way of exploiting people and gaining cheap labour nothing more, regardless of what you all say.

you are all living on a far distant planet if you think this is a trade and you are imagining yourselves to be something you are not. non of you could answer the points made.

you are looking at it from an employers point of view only. think of the poor chap that has to go to an interview one day and says he did an apprenticeship in window cleaning, LOL is the response.

it also means that non of you lot are time served either unless you have undertaken the same training under a qualified certified mentor.

bunch of jokers....

Shush, babs, please, remove your self centred views from this post.  No-one really gives a hoot what your views are; please let the grown ups speak and we might learn something useful, rather than reading about how great and clever you are.  We really don't care.

[Tom White]

For those that have shown interest:

- You will need to register as an employer if not already with HMRC
- You will need all things that go with being an employer, employers insurance, PAYE setup and proper employee contracts.
- The apprentice will need to be on a minimum of 30 hour contract, and will be entitled to all usual employee benefits (holidays,sick etc)
- You will be paying employer NIC's on top of wages
- If your apprentice is of a young age you need to adhere to young persons employment laws, such as 2 consecutive days of a week etc
- You have to pay them whilst they are at college.
- The minimum pay is £2.85 or something ridiculous, but your unlikely to get someone decent that will do it for that, I am paying a 16 year old £6 an hour, he is happy with that.
- You will get £1500, £750 after 3 months, then the remainder after 6 months. This only really covers the cost of the days at college.
- What you will hopefully get is an eager person wanting to prove themselves, and will make a great investment to your business.
- They will study the same NVQ that Impact get slated for here on CIU through the college but also small business training such as marketing, accounts, time management etc. Also there are modules on COSHH, H&S, risk assessments, method statements etc.

At the end of the day it is not a way of getting cheap labour, it is a way of getting a person into your business. If they remain with you after the 12-18months then its a good thing, if they move on they will have a CV with work experience and a qualification on it for future jobs which is good for them.

If you don't already employ and are a sole trader you will really have to do the maths, because you will need to work out what this will cost you and if you can afford it. (Wages+NICs+Increased Insurance+Kit+Uniform etc).

Thanks, John, that was a really good post.

Cheers.

[zeusweiler]

Ye ye point taken. then it does sound a touch delusional tho, and my points are valid I don't believe you can legally train anyone if you are not certified yourself no matter how its dressed up.

I won't post on this topic again and let you all get on with it, my apologies

[wfp master]

thread title should be changed.we know theres no such thing.

[john@windows2clean]

a google of the definition of apprentice is as follows:
A person who is learning a trade from a skilled employer, having agreed to work for a fixed period at low wages

Is it a trade?
From our AXA business insurance policy schedule:
Business description
Primary Trade:  Window Cleaners

Am I a skilled employer?
I have the same certification he is studying for and as far as I am aware is the only recognised one currently

Am I paying a low wage?
No - maybe for this reason I shouldn't be calling him an apprentice then.

[Tony Edwards]

John

Thanks very much for your email. It went into junk for some reason

cheers

mate

[suds window service]

I have an apprentice. He is employed as a window cleaner in my business. He is doing a City & Guilds Certificate with the local college. I would class him as a window cleaning apprentice as do his tutors and the college liaison team.

We too have an apprentice. Same as above.

[Washing Windows]

For those that have shown interest:

- You will need to register as an employer if not already with HMRC
- You will need all things that go with being an employer, employers insurance, PAYE setup and proper employee contracts.
- The apprentice will need to be on a minimum of 30 hour contract, and will be entitled to all usual employee benefits (holidays,sick etc)
- You will be paying employer NIC's on top of wages
- If your apprentice is of a young age you need to adhere to young persons employment laws, such as 2 consecutive days of a week etc
- You have to pay them whilst they are at college.
- The minimum pay is £2.85 or something ridiculous, but your unlikely to get someone decent that will do it for that, I am paying a 16 year old £6 an hour, he is happy with that.
- You will get £1500, £750 after 3 months, then the remainder after 6 months. This only really covers the cost of the days at college.
- What you will hopefully get is an eager person wanting to prove themselves, and will make a great investment to your business.
- They will study the same NVQ that Impact get slated for here on CIU through the college but also small business training such as marketing, accounts, time management etc. Also there are modules on COSHH, H&S, risk assessments, method statements etc.

At the end of the day it is not a way of getting cheap labour, it is a way of getting a person into your business. If they remain with you after the 12-18months then its a good thing, if they move on they will have a CV with work experience and a qualification on it for future jobs which is good for them.

If you don't already employ and are a sole trader you will really have to do the maths, because you will need to work out what this will cost you and if you can afford it. (Wages+NICs+Increased Insurance+Kit+Uniform etc).

Really useful post, thanks.

Duncan

[wfp master]

I have an apprentice. He is employed as a window cleaner in my business. He is doing a City & Guilds Certificate with the local college. I would class him as a window cleaning apprentice as do his tutors and the college liaison team.

We too have an apprentice. Same as above.

no college i know of does an apprenticeship for window cleaning.