[Dominic]

Sorry for the tone but I just rang up the HSE and spoke to an inspector to get an interpretation of the regs. I said to her that I've invested in a pole system because I felt it was the right thing to do and basically it seems that ladders are no longer the safest option. Then I said its hard to convince customers to go for a big change (WFP) when there's still people running up and down ladders like I did for ten years. So then I asked what the HSE are doing about everyone who are still using ladders unsafely. She said ladders aren't banned which we all know and at the moment it is not reasonably practicable for everyone to use pole systems because they are too expensive for some window cleaners. Then she said it's down to resources and they did a two week campaign last year and they'll probably do another one next year. But basically there's not much they can do until people fall off. Same old story " don't grit the roads till we have a ten car pile up ".

This will probably please ladder users but it pi**** me right off because I've invested money trying to follow the law and the law is completely ambiguous as usual. I just wish it could be clean cut i.e NO LADDERS

As far as affording a pole system I thought that is why most new businesses get a small loan etc.

Now I know I'm biased because I've switched to poles but I wish all you ladder users would just get with the whole pole thing cos it's safer and you earn a lot more money also you'd make my life a lot easier.

cheers

Dom

[sunshine windows]

Hi dom,

I can understand your frustration at the HSE. I'm sure you won't be disappointed for too long though if you say you'll be going round faster than normal earning more money.

I'd love to change over to the wfp system but am a bit weary of how a lot of my customers would take to it (or not, as may be the case). Especially in this weather when all the water that drips from the system will probably freeze over. Then you get old Doris moaning at you that you're causing a hazard.

How are you finding it with your customers. or are you doing mainly commercial stuff anyway.

sunshine

[stuart webster]

Try camomile tea, it has a calming effect.

[John Conroy]

Just do whats right for you and your customers and it be fine

[*Chris Browne]

What about the ones that heve bought new ladders?


chris

[John Conroy]

They got big surprise coming new regs regaring the use of ladders in weeks

[windows_chepstow]

Don't worry about your customers and using a WFP.

Out of around 350 customers I've lost ONE customer who - after I gave her a good grilling - finally admitted that she didn't like her wooden frames getting wet.  She thought that the water might damage them.

I did point out that when it rains; her frames get wet and there's no difference.

Anyway, before I go drivelling on... don't worry about traditional window cleaners.  There's plenty of places where I clean windows which also have trad users and I haven't lost any accounts.

[Sir Squeaky]

Now I know I'm biased because I've switched to poles but I wish all you ladder users would just get with the whole pole thing cos it's safer and you earn a lot more money also you'd make my life a lot easier.

I'm not ruining my round with inferior kit and paying big money for loads of hassle just please you.

What an offensive post.

Serves you right for jumping on the bandwagon before finding out the facts.

[windolene]

Hi,

One reason I have not gone over to wfp is the environmental aspect..wasting 3 litres of water to get one. that will soon empty the reservoirs.

Kevin.

[neil100]

You stick to your guns Squeaky.

This as been my fifth week wfp, I am still on my first cleans and they are a nightmare. I only have 2 full days left before I start on second cleans. I am impressed with some of the work we have done  the windows look like they have had a make over.

But the most common question every customer as been asking is, Are you enjoying it more. The short reply NO.

I know it takes time to adapt,My son loves wfp but I still prefer traditional

I may be safer but I have had a lot of sleepless nights with phsyical complications that wfp has brought with it.

If someone is happy with Traditional then stay with it and work within the law.Their is a lot more hassle with wfp. Tradtional is so easy without any flack. If your good and fit stay with it.

My attitude may change over the comming months, but you should only change to wfp if thats what you want. dont be forced into it.

Nel.

[windows_chepstow]

I spent around £850 on my WFP kit; probably £200 more than I needed to.

I reckon I earn at least £500 per month more than I was before.  AT LEAST.

I took Monday off to post some flyers, print off some mail shots and chill.

Tuesday I had a nice easy day.  We only worked for one-and-a-half hours.  (We work calander-monthly mostly; and we were up-to-date; so at the end of each month if we're ahead of ourselves we can take time off).

Wednesday and Thursday We both worked; hard.

Today (Friday); I mainly only worked; hard.  (Wor Lass helped me with a pub doing the insides and two houses before abandoning me to get her hair cut-and-a-colour-put-in-it-or-something).

But we've earnt more this week than we would've using ladders had we grafted hard for a whole week. And I only worked really for three days; Wor Lass; two days.

WFP is brilliant.  I earn from 20% to 50% more than I did using ladders, and I use an entry-level system and do 'tops only'; mostly.

When you get onto your fourth and fifth clean you're flying.

I honestly feel sorry for you lot who use ladders.  They're such hard work and very slow too.

[neil100]

Why dont you clean bottoms with wfp Tosh?

Nel.

[windows_chepstow]

Why dont you clean bottoms with wfp Tosh?

Nel.

A backpack only holds around 20 litres of water, so doing tops only cuts down on filling up time.

Also cleaning ground floor with an 18 ft pole is a bit of chore and so is carrying a shorter 4 ft pole along with the 18 ft one; so is swapping them over.  Remember my round is mainly bottom-end residential; terraced houses and semis; and my system is entry-level.

So it's easy to whip down a row of terraced houses; doing all the 'tops' first.  Then when you've done four or five of them, return to the first and start squeegying.  You don't need a bucket of water near you.  The windows are wet which helps and you can fill your bucket-on-a-belt with a bit of water too.  And use outside taps/puddles/etc to wet your T-Bar.

Do the same round the rear.

Not only that, I mostly work with Wor Lass who follows me around cleaning the ground floor; but even when she's off; I still squeegie the bottoms.

I promise you; even if you do 'tops only (mostly; leaded and Georgian excepted)'; it's quicker and easy and does a class job.  I've been using the WFP for around five months now, and I'm still impressed with the speed and standard of job it does.

There's some here who 'slag' the WFP without ever having used one.  I think they're either jealous or frightened.

I can't believe people can be negative about a safer method to clean windows which is quicker and easier.

When I found out about pure-water cleaning and was still on ladders; I wanted to get one.

It has honestly transformed our working regime for the better.

Am I drivelling on again?  Be honest!

[mattstanley]

Not at all Tosh - I just can't believe you use puddles to wet your T-Bar! 

[windows_chepstow]

Not at all Tosh - I just can't believe you use puddles to wet your T-Bar! 

It was a tip I got from this forum.  It works.  Try it.

[mattstanley]

On the theme of the thread - my mate (who works in construction) went on a Working at Height course, run by a very high profile organisation.  He asked the instructor about window cleaning etc etc, and he was honestly told that too many people have over reacted, splashed out on wfp, when this isn't necessary in many cases - remember, this was a very high profile organisation who should know their onions.  Many will disagree with this but, unless the HSE specifically say ladders are a no-no and wfp is the only way, there will always be ladder users.

Basically, as has been said, you've got to do what is right for you.  I have a system similar to Tosh, but only use it for difficult jobs to ensure my safety.  I would love to do all jobs with it but am holding off because I think we're going to run into serious water supply problems in the South East, and we'll be back on ladders anyway.

[mattstanley]

I don't doubt it works, but do the customers see you doing it?  Mine would wonder what I was doing.

I use a small washing up liquid bottle with a quantity of my GG4 mix in it (stashed in my pouch), to save lugging a bucket around the back.

[dish]

They got big surprise coming new regs regaring the use of ladders in weeks

What's the inside information regarding new ladder regs then?

[Franky2020]

The way I see it , it is everyone to their own. if you want to use ladders and feel safe doing it carry on,youre only likely to harm yourself . However if you want potentially more earnings and dont feel safe up a ladder go for wfp. Whats the problem?  

[supernova77]

Oh dear - Another argument about WFP v Trad  

At the end of the day once you are used to WFP it is easier, quicker and safer than using ladders - and that's a fact!

Today for example I cleaned a £35 account, it used to take me about 1 hour 10 mins to clean trad, I did the whole house (tops and bottoms) with WFP and it took me 40 mins!

The thing is... In about 5 years time more window cleaners than not will be using WFP, and wondering how they ever managed with the trad method. And then another 10 years after that neally everyone will be using a completely different method and wonder how they ever managed with WFP!