[Colin Cadle]

Hi Lewis
As you know, Axminsters move over time, they stretch & sag dependant upon the humidity & wear.
Axminsters are rarely powerstretched (I certainly never did) as they are unlike a standard carpet's construction due to their natural backings & face fibre .
As this one was 10 years old I would have imagined that you were probably able to pinch up a good 2" in the middle of the room prior to unfitting it?
This would say that any more than a sprinkling of moisture would allow an unfitted & now very problematic clean to allow the carpet to want to tighten up & regain its composure.
IF an Axminster must be lifted to clean then the technician will usually tack it down to stop such a problem & leave it tacked for several days.
I have seen many an Axminster post flooding that has kept its shape & the only saving grace was the correct fitting of grippers & door profiles.
Sadly if it has shrunk 6" then even when fully dry it will not go back, certainly not long term & power stretching will tear the weft before it's back in place.

[John Kelly]

If you do have to replace this you are only liable for like for like, not new for old.
A lot of people forget this when dealing with commercial insurance. How much is a 10 year old carpet worth zilch.

[clinton]

Johns right with the carpet value.

If your client is wanting a new carpet well they wont get what they want..

[Phil @ Extreme Clean]

what bonnet are you using 2 litres seems a lot to put on carpet by bonneting maybe it's been overwet which has caused the shrinkage.

[L.Doubtfire - The Blade Runner]

It`s the 2 liters of shampoo that’s caused it.I did`nt think
It was too bad,that amount.When I was in the CCA ( now NCCA)
Many `moons`ago,the CCA used to class it as `professional negligence`.
I had a similier complaint when I was with them.
The complaints officer ( unethical to name him really) recommend
I compenstate the customer,£30 I think it was,might have been £50
Though.My customer wanted £100.
The letter the CCA wrote as I recall stated there was a high likleyhood
Of there being some kind of fault because of the alarming amount
Of shrinkage incurd.
This customer is oaky with it I think.The carpet might have to be
Re-fitted in perhaps a small box room.
I personally have never seen or experienced shrinkage like it.
 

Lewis  Doubtfire

[Paul Redden Countryfresh]

I would say your ins would only give market value ie £0, but as a gesture of goodwill
you would put a remnant down or re-fit in a smaller room plus some freebie cleaning.

Good luck

[Dave_Lee]

Right if it is an Axminster of that age, it is probably an Acrylic pile. There used to be lots of them. Quite an open weave so easy to wet the backing, and yes shrinkage could be a problem with them.
At least they were not as expensive as a wool mix Axy and i doubt it has any value left. Of course your custy won't see it that way, but best of luck.
Dave.

[Simon Gerrard]

If you ruin a customers carpet you are liable to replace it. You could, as some have stated, insist that because of the age of it it isn't worth anything, but if they pursued it through the courts you're unlikely to win and may end up with substantial legal costs on top of everything else. I'd offer to replace it, albeit with a carpet of lesser quality.
Simon

[L.Doubtfire - The Blade Runner]

Like Simon say`s I should replace the carpet.Like the CCA say`s
Albeit all that time ago on another claim `its professional negligence.``
`Ive got to bite the bullett`.
Nearly 40 years at this game and I`m still making mistakes like this.
I decided this afternoon,I`m gonna pack carpet cleaning in.It`s official

 
Lewis  Doubtfire

[Ian Gourlay]

After reading your other problem I was going to suggest that

Two incidents in a short space of time incrediable

[Doug Holloway]

Hi Guys

Lewis,

Why don't you find a local CC and sub it to them, might make you a few bob without all the hassle.

Cheers

Doug

[robert meldrum]

Easy Ian, Lewis has been brave enough to share a hellish experience which should serve as a warning to others that things CAN and WILL occasionally go wrong.

In my very long time in c/c I reckon I've been lucky rather than meticulously professional on many occasions.

Only had one shrinker when a guy working for me failed to properly close a lid on a return tank and over wet a carpet.

Lewis.............with over 40 years in c/c you must be nearly as old as me  

[Richard Basey-Fisher]

After reading your other problem I was going to suggest that

Two incidents in a short space of time incrediable

bit harsh  IMO   if lewis has been 40 years he has obviously done things the right way.

as constructive as usual ian .

[Colin Day]

It's posts like Lewis' that are the "Golden Nuggets" of information on CIU for which we should all be grateful. It takes a lot to admit fault thanks to the self righteous attitude of some members.  I remember some prat giving me grief after I admitted I'd buggered a job up about 2 years ago... (BTW, not having a dig at Ian, because I don't think his post is derogatory in any way...)

It goes to show that 40 years in the game, something can still come back and bite you in the back-side. Lewis' post is a fair warning to us all that he could easily have kept to himself.

I see why you would want to pack it all in Lewis, I've felt like that when I've had awkward times as I'm sure most of us do. In fact I wanted to pack in oven cleaning a while back because I managed to rip a seal and had to buy a new one. I felt the same when I cleaned an oven-door glass in the dip tank, when it shattered into hundreds of tiny pieces. The new glass cost me more than the oven clean cost the customer....

Don't let this situation deter you, obviously getting the insurance involved will perhaps be more hassle than it's worth. Do right by your customer, brush yourself down and crack on....

Best wishes... Col.

[Steve Rothwell]

Good post Colin

 

[Ian Gourlay]

For those who think I was harsh I apologize unreservedly to Lewis

Lewis and I have exchanged emails in the past  and it was I that encouraged him to keep posting and share his experience.

I just felt two in a week unusual and wonder if in actual fact these are situations that have happened over the years?

[Phillip Mold]

Like Simon say`s I should replace the carpet.Like the CCA say`s
Albeit all that time ago on another claim `its professional negligence.``
`Ive got to bite the bullett`.
Nearly 40 years at this game and I`m still making mistakes like this.
I decided this afternoon,I`m gonna pack carpet cleaning in.It`s official

 
Lewis  Doubtfire

Lewis we all have bad luck. I'm typing this with crossed fingers. After five years at this with a few small mistakes and a steep learning curve I had two jobs go bad in a week a couple of months back. I just have to believe that two out of over a thousand jobs is a acceptable slip up rate and its just dammed back lick they happened so close together.

Carry on, no one is perfect. We all make mistakes, the only stupid people are those who carry on making the same one!

[Buckland]

Its inevitable that problems will crop up at some time and good luck Lewis in sorting it out. Its how you deal with them that counts...


Last year we came a cropper with a customer's shower by stupidly using it as an ordinary fresh water supply (no outdoor tap) for a tm that temporarily had no water tank in it - made the mistake of stopping half way thro rinse job to do something else and syre enuff leccy showers do not like being treated like garden taps! Seal blew on shower and basicly knacked leccy shower - lucky it was only a fairly cheap one - I got plumber in on the monday and new shower had to be fitted after replacement seal failed as well - cost me 175 quid in all and I didnt charge for the job obviously.

[Tom Bennett]

I had to submit an independent report after a suite was cleaned wet instead of dry.
This eventually ended up in the small claims court, the company that cleaned the suite lost the case, the person that owned the suite was expecting it to be replaced with new.
The judge wasn't having any of that and awarded what he thought the suite was worth, taking it's age into account, which was considerably less.
I think you'll find that would be the case in this instance.

[L.Doubtfire - The Blade Runner]

No need to apoligise Ian,no need at all.Whatever goes wrong on a
Job,is a direct result of the cleaners actions.For which,the cleaner
Is liable.
For years now I`ve been averaging 3 complaints for every 9 jobs done.
The last three years it has dropped to 3 complaints for every 8.
Complaints of one thing type or another,nothing on the scale of course
Regarding the 2 `threads`I`ve written in about.
I think someone `up there`is telling me my `time is up`,when am I gonna
Learn and `bite the bullet`.It`s a young mans game,especially when you
Offer a take away service.I`ve enjoyed it funnily enough,working alongside
And doing jobs with most of the local ServiceMaster guy`s.
The last 12 to 18 months I will describe as nothing short of a glorified
Working nightmare.

Lewis  Doubtfire


P.S.

The very first general secretary of the then CCA ( now NCCA) only lived
About 3 miles away from me at the time.
She booked me to clean her carpet,a few months later booked me to clean
Her 3 piece suite.A couple of weeks after that she recommended me to her
Mother,who as I recall made lovely fruit scones and coffee while I cleaned
Her suit also.Many moons ago,so it seems,those were the days,for all you
Fella`s and gal`s thanks for all your help and encouragment,it`s appreciated.
Thought I`d just put this in to show it`s not been all bad news.
Although my `steamer`will be now redundant,hope I`ll be welcome to
Contribute should I feel the need arise.
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