[wpclean]

Which cleaning forum has the best unbiased reviews for equipment ?                    

I have been a member on here for a bit, but if I am honest do not believe all the so called impartial reviews regarding poles especially !

I do not want name names but some members on here are like sales reps for a company while still claiming to be one of the usual normal window cleaners on here.

It really upsets me because not only is it dishonest but it can add extra cost when not necessary.

I know it is bad manners to name other forums, but I would like to know which words to google regarding unbiased cleaning equipment reviews ?

[Panorama]

I would say I'm a junior member on here, and to be honest , the forum has been a godsend for me regarding equipment. Before I purchased wfp I honestly thought that ionics were the only company that done wfp, I purchased a pure freedom DIY unit  I bought a gardiners clx on advice on here, as well as watching demos on YouTube. I've bought an aqua dapter ,again, through recommendation on here. My brushes are all gardiners , once again through recommendation on this website. If it wasn't for the fact of this website and I hasten to add , listening to all the members who have a lot more years experience than me regarding water fed pole, I honestly would say that I would of wasted a lot of money .

[Pope vader]

the choice you have are

http://www.morfm.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=2

http://www.w.com/windows/water-fed-poles/

the problem you have is that certain suppliers have got fans for there great gear, which is deserved,   but one pf the probs on here is that ionics use to have plants and admitted they had plants on here  so they could make the worlds greatest poel and no one would believe them

[R W C™]

I think you should of looked at all the other forums before putting that whole comment as I think if that's your view which I'm guessing is aimed at gardiners youll come too the conclusion that all the forums are biased then, or maybe a lot of us have tried lots of poles and the Gardiner poles are the best out of the lot.

[richard jagger]

It is advisable to do a little lurking on forums to see who`S ADVICE YOU CAN TAKE AS ALL ADVICE IS NOT ALWAYS GOOD.

[H S and Son]

It really upsets me because not only is it dishonest but it can add extra cost when not necessary.

Who says it's dishonest; so someone has an opinion it doesn't mean they're being dishonest, are a plant or represent a company. They might just prefer one company to another and the service and equipment they offer.

I do, as do most on here I expect, Im not being dishonest when I express my opinion.

[mci services]

It is advisable to do a little lurking on forums to see who`S ADVICE YOU CAN TAKE AS ALL ADVICE IS NOT ALWAYS GOOD.

you can say that again a while ago you were telling us to spray with carbon tet, are you still using it?

[Alex Gardiner]

Interesting question this one - and I think that there is no clear-cut answer.

The value of a forum is directly related to the quality and integrity of the 'posters'. As this cannot be tabulated it is not possible to answer your question. A good guide to their integrity is - does this poster who has just posted a 'rave review' or a 'trashing review' post under a nickname with no contact details, no website and no way of knowing who they are. Is it one of their first posts? Have they a history of commenting a variety of manufacturer's products?

For example -  over the last two years someone joined this forum using a similar user name to me and proceeded to consistently trash Gardiner products and praising a newly launched direct competitor - I knew already for a fact which company this person represented and when CIU Admin tried to contact this user - amazingly the email he had given was false!

This highlights the issue. As far as my company is concerned we have never posted under a pseudonym, we have never asked clients to post praising our products in order to receive favour or products. All of our clients that choose to post are genuine product buying clients who have to part with their money for our products. These clients/posters are also quick to tell us if they do not like something publicly or privately!

What I have learned from these forums is the value of an honest and experienced forum user. When they post something about a product I always listen, if they do not like something we make I listen even more carefully and if they come up with an idea to improve something I pay attention.

On all of the UK forums there are some very experienced and canny window cleaners. My advice is to look back at key product posts and compare certain posters answers with your own experience. You will start to build a pattern as to who to listen to and who to ignore. I for one value the collective experience of the many of the posters on this and other forums.

[George P]

Good post alex

[spongebob]

Interesting question this one - and I think that there is no clear-cut answer.

The value of a forum is directly related to the quality and integrity of the 'posters'. As this cannot be tabulated it is not possible to answer your question. A good guide to their integrity is - does this poster who has just posted a 'rave review' or a 'trashing review' post under a nickname with no contact details, no website and no way of knowing who they are. Is it one of their first posts? Have they a history of commenting a variety of manufacturer's products?

For example -  over the last two years someone joined this forum using a similar user name to me and proceeded to consistently trash Gardiner products and praising a newly launched direct competitor - I knew already for a fact which company this person represented and when CIU Admin tried to contact this user - amazingly the email he had given was false!

This highlights the issue. As far as my company is concerned we have never posted under a pseudonym, we have never asked clients to post praising our products in order to receive favour or products. All of our clients that choose to post are genuine product buying clients who have to part with their money for our products. These clients/posters are also quick to tell us if they do not like something publicly or privately!

What I have learned from these forums is the value of an honest and experienced forum user. When they post something about a product I always listen, if they do not like something we make I listen even more carefully and if they come up with an idea to improve something I pay attention.

On all of the UK forums there are some very experienced and canny window cleaners. My advice is to look back at key product posts and compare certain posters answers with your own experience. You will start to build a pattern as to who to listen to and who to ignore. I for one value the collective experience of the many of the posters on this and other forums.

Samson/Alex
I know we shouldn't take things too seriously in the world of window cleaning...........but. It's fun for some to change their username faster than they change their phone or pole I also use another forum which deals with the world of forex trading. The biggest problem on there is the scamming that goes on to seperate the newbies from their investment pot.  To prevent this the admin only allow one user name and should anyone try to change this they are banned for life.This is all about ip addresses etc and way over my head. It is american based and very well policed. I have no idea how much this would cost but it certainly keeps everyone honest and upfront. If you join as a normal trader but come up with a product you wish to sell you are moved to a commercial section and are then unable to post in the day to day posts. It just stops someone trying to get one over on the honest bloke new or old.

I don't fill in my profile as I currently get about 30 mails a day from currency trading companies who will make me richer than Hector Riva if I only give them my credit card details so don't need anymore thanks.
Andy

[d s windowcleaning]

Interesting question this one - and I think that there is no clear-cut answer.

The value of a forum is directly related to the quality and integrity of the 'posters'. As this cannot be tabulated it is not possible to answer your question. A good guide to their integrity is - does this poster who has just posted a 'rave review' or a 'trashing review' post under a nickname with no contact details, no website and no way of knowing who they are. Is it one of their first posts? Have they a history of commenting a variety of manufacturer's products?

For example -  over the last two years someone joined this forum using a similar user name to me and proceeded to consistently trash Gardiner products and praising a newly launched direct competitor - I knew already for a fact which company this person represented and when CIU Admin tried to contact this user - amazingly the email he had given was false!

This highlights the issue. As far as my company is concerned we have never posted under a pseudonym, we have never asked clients to post praising our products in order to receive favour or products. All of our clients that choose to post are genuine product buying clients who have to part with their money for our products. These clients/posters are also quick to tell us if they do not like something publicly or privately!

What I have learned from these forums is the value of an honest and experienced forum user. When they post something about a product I always listen, if they do not like something we make I listen even more carefully and if they come up with an idea to improve something I pay attention.

On all of the UK forums there are some very experienced and canny window cleaners. My advice is to look back at key product posts and compare certain posters answers with your own experience. You will start to build a pattern as to who to listen to and who to ignore. I for one value the collective experience of the many of the posters on this and other forums.

well said alex .

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

samson, can i ask what piece of equipment you looking to purchase?

[Mike #1]

samson mate they may seem like unbiased reviews to yourself ,   But people can only review the products they have tried and tested ,  i have always wanted one of those poles that we are not mentioning ,   But they were out of stock so i bought   a very close second IMO  which i am over the moon with ,   But i will never buy brushes from any other company because they are the best brushes on the market today IMO


  WHICH IS A CARBON ELITE 35 FT  ,  But the end caps are the worst not thick enough and a bad fit which is why i will always use a squash ball as a end cap ,  no  matter what pole i buy in years to come
        
                

[Paul Coleman]

Definitely trawl the back posts to see who appears to give balanced viewpoints - pointing out both pros and cons of various products.  That is the most reliable guide IMO.  Being wary of someone's opinion who has very few posts is a good idea - especially if there is a positive reply from someone who also has very few posts as they may well be two people representing the same company (or even one person using two user names).  The lack of an email address/website may be a guide.  However, some (such as myself) choose not to make an email address public on the profile due to spambots.  Also, not everyone bothers with a website.

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

Interesting question this one - and I think that there is no clear-cut answer.

The value of a forum is directly related to the quality and integrity of the 'posters'. As this cannot be tabulated it is not possible to answer your question. A good guide to their integrity is - does this poster who has just posted a 'rave review' or a 'trashing review' post under a nickname with no contact details, no website and no way of knowing who they are. Is it one of their first posts? Have they a history of commenting a variety of manufacturer's products?

For example -  over the last two years someone joined this forum using a similar user name to me and proceeded to consistently trash Gardiner products and praising a newly launched direct competitor - I knew already for a fact which company this person represented and when CIU Admin tried to contact this user - amazingly the email he had given was false!

This highlights the issue. As far as my company is concerned we have never posted under a pseudonym, we have never asked clients to post praising our products in order to receive favour or products. All of our clients that choose to post are genuine product buying clients who have to part with their money for our products. These clients/posters are also quick to tell us if they do not like something publicly or privately!

What I have learned from these forums is the value of an honest and experienced forum user. When they post something about a product I always listen, if they do not like something we make I listen even more carefully and if they come up with an idea to improve something I pay attention.

On all of the UK forums there are some very experienced and canny window cleaners. My advice is to look back at key product posts and compare certain posters answers with your own experience. You will start to build a pattern as to who to listen to and who to ignore. I for one value the collective experience of the many of the posters on this and other forums.

You shouldn’t have posted on this thread; this thread is for the customers not manufactures, if the forum wants to have integrity it needs to remove manufacturers that come on the forum to push there products at every opportunity and hijack threads that they don’t need to post on such as this thread.
 
A good guide to integrity is not whether the poster is using a pseudonym name, because many forum members have pseudonym names and I’m sure they have integrity as well, and if any individual opinions and/or review of equipment are positive or negative or even indifferent, so what, that’s what forums are for.
 
Just because an individual may choose to post under his company name, this doesn’t automatically grant him integrity; with regard to integrity in a commercial sense the first issue is not to take the customer for a ride, surely that is the starting point before you can claim to have any integrity in business
 
Looking back at key product post is actually a very good thing to do –
 
Claims have been made carbon fibre has gone up in price, UK government website tells a different story of how carbon fibre has been coming down in price over the years. The current influx of new Cf poles on the market seems to back this up.
 
New carbon fibre poles costing 2-3 times the price of current CF poles, with no real explanation as to why they cost more
 
Claiming all tooling cost run into thousands of pounds, when it’s not always the case
 
Claims of tooling cost, when they don’t exist or those cost have been wavered
 
Manufacturers or suppliers claiming you have to buy in thousands of units at a time to be in business; no you don’t, that an out right lie
 
Some of the research and development claims are actually non existent; you only have to ignore the marketing and look more closely at the product to see this.
 
Then of course you have trading on your rep for a the quick buck, low and very poor quality (so called equipment) such as bent pieces of metal or other material named gutter scoops then marketed and, knocked out for £50 at a time (£50 is still a lot of money to me)
 
Now I’m not a salesman and in some peoples eyes I may lack integrity, what I am repeatedly told is that I am to honest (which can be also be a detrimental thing) I guess that just to bad for me, but if any equipment is rubbish or over priced or I think has misleading claims I will point this out if I feel there is a need to.
 
Fortunately I don’t sell or manufacturer anything, god forbid you would even consider I was trying to win customers on forums, my products that’s if I did make any would speak for themselves, anyway I like to keep my integrity intact, thank you (hence this statement) A few of you and I do literally mean only a few; do need to learn to read between the lines.
 
 
Sincerely my best, Alex

Would you be so kind as to explain as to why your products "TECBUK" including the aeriel brushes are so expensive?

Surely the tooling for these things must be a pittance?

I look forward to your answer Ewan, oops, I mean Alex, oops, sorry ah-haaam  Richard!

I think your integrity is pretty much shattered mate & the way in which you have tried to conn us & gone about things  is utter disgusting to be frank! However, it was quite entertaining sussing you out! :

[Alex Gardiner]

You shouldn’t have posted on this thread; this thread is for the customers not manufactures, if the forum wants to have integrity it needs to remove manufacturers that come on the forum to push there products at every opportunity and hijack threads that they don’t need to post on such as this thread.
 
A good guide to integrity is not whether the poster is using a pseudonym name, because many forum members have pseudonym names and I’m sure they have integrity as well, and if any individual opinions and/or review of equipment are positive or negative or even indifferent, so what, that’s what forums are for.
 
Just because an individual may choose to post under his company name, this doesn’t automatically grant him integrity; with regard to integrity in a commercial sense the first issue is not to take the customer for a ride, surely that is the starting point before you can claim to have any integrity in business
 
Looking back at key product post is actually a very good thing to do –
 
Claims have been made carbon fibre has gone up in price, UK government website tells a different story of how carbon fibre has been coming down in price over the years. The current influx of new Cf poles on the market seems to back this up.
 
New carbon fibre poles costing 2-3 times the price of current CF poles, with no real explanation as to why they cost more
 
Claiming all tooling cost run into thousands of pounds, when it’s not always the case
 
Claims of tooling cost, when they don’t exist or those cost have been wavered
 
Manufacturers or suppliers claiming you have to buy in thousands of units at a time to be in business; no you don’t, that an out right lie
 
Some of the research and development claims are actually non existent; you only have to ignore the marketing and look more closely at the product to see this.
 
Then of course you have trading on your rep for a the quick buck, low and very poor quality (so called equipment) such as bent pieces of metal or other material named gutter scoops then marketed and, knocked out for £50 at a time (£50 is still a lot of money to me)
 
Now I’m not a salesman and in some peoples eyes I may lack integrity, what I am repeatedly told is that I am to honest (which can be also be a detrimental thing) I guess that just to bad for me, but if any equipment is rubbish or over priced or I think has misleading claims I will point this out if I feel there is a need to.
 
Fortunately I don’t sell or manufacturer anything, god forbid you would even consider I was trying to win customers on forums, my products that’s if I did make any would speak for themselves, anyway I like to keep my integrity intact, thank you (hence this statement) A few of you and I do literally mean only a few; do need to learn to read between the lines.
 
 
Sincerely my best, Alex

Hi "Alex." I wondered how long it would be before you turned up - usually within 12 hours of me making a substantial post. You must 'lurk' under another name and then pounce when you feel the time is right

Your last posts were deleted by CIU Admin as they were blatant attempts at self promotion. When they tried to contact you they couldn't because your email was false. Your previous posts that have survived were back in July (14th) when you were once again having a go at me and Gardiner pole systems - each time you only logged on for minutes to post an attack and then quickly logged off (just like today!). I think that anyone with half a brain cell knows your game by now. It is actually worth clicking on "Alex." profile and then clicking on his last posts (obviously it does not show the posts that CIU deleted) to see the nature of his postings.

I think to all other readers this highlights the problem with trusting certain posters - some have an obvious agenda and like this chap stick to it with boring regularity.

As I know who you actually represent I have even less respect for you and your product. Be honest about who you are - use your 'real' name and a 'real' email and then there may be some valid reason for a dialogue. Currently you just make me laugh when you have a rant, such as the above, about industry issues. If you were a genuine poster raising questions then I would consider addressing some of them. You will also notice that my above post was discussing the exact issue raised by Samson- there was no promotion of my firm or any of our products in my post. However by you wading-in the effect is that my profile and that of my company has been raised - so for that alone I should probably thank you  

[Alex Gardiner]

Definitely trawl the back posts to see who appears to give balanced viewpoints - pointing out both pros and cons of various products.  That is the most reliable guide IMO.  Being wary of someone's opinion who has very few posts is a good idea - especially if there is a positive reply from someone who also has very few posts as they may well be two people representing the same company (or even one person using two user names).  The lack of an email address/website may be a guide.  However, some (such as myself) choose not to make an email address public on the profile due to spambots.  Also, not everyone bothers with a website.

There are good reasons for not listing an email or website. With yourself and many others who do not list these details it is still fairly easy to see whether you are genuine and reliable. Looking back at the  history of your posts and the informative nature of what you post, it is easy to build up a picture of you and other users. I am sure though that you did use a genuine email when creating your account with CIU unlike our friend who has just joined us.

[Dave Willis]

How bizarre. I think Gardiners poles get a lot of acclaim on this site purely because they are so good and affordable. The annoying poster seems to have the memory of a gold fish regarding prices. Carbon poles were far more expensive five years ago.
The bent piece of metal he refers to was probably a gutterscoop Alex tried due to pressure from myself, we thought it might be possible to scoop out gutters from the ground with window cleaning poles. It wasn't a real success in reality. However Alex got one or two made up and welded from aluminium. of course they were going to be expensive, they wern't mass produced and considering the materials and man hours to make it I doubt Alex made any profit.
Gardiners are always popular because they listen and try different areas (remember vacuums and van mounts?) and make the products we want. I have many gardiners products and would say none of them are perfect but they are pretty dammed close. Why people choose to come on here just to knock a company and do nothing else is beyond me, maybe it's jealousy who knows?
I don't tend to have a go at products I haven't even used but I might moan about their prices or marketing techniques.
I've never owned anything from Ionics - don't like the fact I have to register just to view their catalogue.
Won't touch Brodex simply because of the way they tend to bombard you with texts or emails with 'special offers'
Facelift - don't know much about them just always thought they were pricey.
Pure freedom - no problems with them.
Tecbuk - I've bought from them but to be honest any following they might have had is being destroyed on this site by one moron.
Several other companies out there that I've never tried.

[mikecam]

Which cleaning forum has the best unbiased reviews for equipment ?                    

I have been a member on here for a bit, but if I am honest do not believe all the so called impartial reviews regarding poles especially !

I do not want name names but some members on here are like sales reps for a company while still claiming to be one of the usual normal window cleaners on here.

It really upsets me because not only is it dishonest but it can add extra cost when not necessary.

I know it is bad manners to name other forums, but I would like to know which words to google regarding unbiased cleaning equipment reviews ?

Well what a conundrum!!! Sounds like you're biased already! 

[Lee GLS]

It's funny "Alex." saying that prices are to high for certain products, his company currently sell a small bent peice of metal with a bit of Velcro stuck to it for clean bird pop off windows, which when it came out was over £20, but has been reduced a little, now that is what I call rippIng the customer off.