[geefree]

I am continuously getting new customers (and keeping them) , because the customer decides to change, as the existing window cleaner is terrible,

For example, will not clean the frames , sills  etc...

deliberately does not clean an odd window (strange one that, and very shabby)

The other day i sat and watched a guy with all the professional wfp set up ,

carefully put his brush up to the top of the glass on an upstairs window, turned on the water, and slowly wiped along the top of the glass, avoiding the top frame....

then to my amazement , started brushing up and down at speed.

The water was splashing on the dirty frame above, which will run down on to the glass as dirty water !!

He did not rinse at all,...  nor did he wipe the sill.!

It really does amaze me that people spend all that money on a system that can clean the whole thing brilliantly in a couple of minutes, yet carefully avoid dirt .... which they are really paid to clean off... and is obviously slowing them down and  must be leaving streaks.!

Why not get the lot off?

Trad guys too, why not wipe the frames and sills?  it takes seconds.

I should not complain really as i pick up lots of work from poor cleaners,

and i aint naming any names, but some of the comments in the " Extra mile! topic really hit home  just how shabbily people will work, with total disregard towards the people  who pay their wages,

Not to mention a totally inability of how a business should be run, with some comments actually going in the opposite direction of an " Extra mile"

Im not preaching here i just felt i had to say something , because some guys who clean shoddily may be on here, and that may help them realise why they are not building as quick as they definitely could be  

Word of mouth travels fast, and it takes years to build a reputation and days to lose it !

Rant over  

[d s windowcleaning]

have you been spying on me gazza 

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

I've been wfp over 7 years. I'm bursting at the seams with work & it still rolls in. I never lose any work due to quality issues, I have built a superb reputation which generates work continuously. I have gained some VERY good contracts from previous wfp'ers who did a poor job of the glass as well as trad'ers.

And guess what?  only 1% of all my work gets the top frame cleaned! They all do though, get lovely clean, spot free glass!

[H2GoKent]

The guys who think wfp is a magic wand can make it a hard sell for the rest of us.
I've had quite a few say 'oh no not that broom thing'

I always clean the upper frame. That way you can work much quicker rather than having to carefully brush up to the edge just to avoid bringing the dirt off the frame down.

[geefree]

I dont expect people to agree nor disagree with me personally, simply making a point of how poor some guys work , and expect to gain business,

But i do find it hard to understand , how pure water on splashing on a dirty frame , will not not run on to the glass and leave streaks., in fact why  leave the top frame in the first place,?

I could not do a first clean for example, and leave a top frame filthy

1. it would stand out and make me look very poor.

2, i would be scared of any dirt dripping from accidental water,.

Easier to get it off, and looks beautiful.

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

I dont expect people to agree nor disagree with me personally, simply making a point of how poor some guys work , and expect to gain business,

But i do find it hard to understand , how pure water on splashing on a dirty frame , will not not run on to the glass and leave streaks., in fact why  leave the top frame in the first place,?

I could not do a first clean for example, and leave a top frame filthy

1. it would stand out and make me look very poor.

2, i would be scared of any dirt dripping from accidental water,.

Easier to get it off, and looks beautiful.

1. it wouldn't, you're paranoid!

2. I'm more scared of dirty water running out of the vent after I've left!


To be honest, I was forced to hone the technique of this method. Much of my work are large country houses, farm houses, listed building etc with old wooden sash windows set directly in to stone surrounds. Cleaning the top frame isn't an option if you want clean glass also. These are not done every 4 weeks either. Farm houses especially, every clean is like a first clean.

Because of this, I can now clean any window perfectly without cleaning the top frame & without getting water on to the top frame. First cleans, for me don't take much if any longer than any other clean. If something stands out like a sore thumb then I'll usually address it for my own sake, other than that, only twice in over 7 years have I been asked to clean the top frame.

I've only ever sold myself as a window cleaner & never made the rod for my back of promising the world to any customer via wfp, I've never needed to if I'm honest.

Each to their own, but by not cleaning the top frame doesn't necessarily mean a non-perfect job of the glass.

[mci services]

yep I am with winpo clean on this, do it right and the top frame isn't a problem. and if you watched me work you will not see me rinsing either as I rinse on

[lee_dewing]

I have the odd complaint, i find 2% of people i will never please wether they think i come to early, late, wfp dries streaky (yet to see this, think it's custy code for want you on ladder )

[lee_dewing]

Yes i am a poor window cleaner.

I'd like to be a pound behind you lot.

[geefree]

Rinse on.... is not rinse ...just an extra scrub , otherwise the whole clean is rise on.!

[Paul Coleman]

I am continuously getting new customers (and keeping them) , because the customer decides to change, as the existing window cleaner is terrible,

For example, will not clean the frames , sills  etc...

deliberately does not clean an odd window (strange one that, and very shabby)

The other day i sat and watched a guy with all the professional wfp set up ,

carefully put his brush up to the top of the glass on an upstairs window, turned on the water, and slowly wiped along the top of the glass, avoiding the top frame....

then to my amazement , started brushing up and down at speed.

The water was splashing on the dirty frame above, which will run down on to the glass as dirty water !!

He did not rinse at all,...  nor did he wipe the sill.!

It really does amaze me that people spend all that money on a system that can clean the whole thing brilliantly in a couple of minutes, yet carefully avoid dirt .... which they are really paid to clean off... and is obviously slowing them down and  must be leaving streaks.!

Why not get the lot off?

Trad guys too, why not wipe the frames and sills?  it takes seconds.

I should not complain really as i pick up lots of work from poor cleaners,

and i aint naming any names, but some of the comments in the " Extra mile! topic really hit home  just how shabbily people will work, with total disregard towards the people  who pay their wages,

Not to mention a totally inability of how a business should be run, with some comments actually going in the opposite direction of an " Extra mile"

Im not preaching here i just felt i had to say something , because some guys who clean shoddily may be on here, and that may help them realise why they are not building as quick as they definitely could be  

Word of mouth travels fast, and it takes years to build a reputation and days to lose it !

Rant over  

To me it looked like much of the stuff on the "extra mile" thread was about not getting sucked into doing freebies.  For me anyway, this does not equate to not doing the windows well.
I will admit to not doing all the frames all the time though.  IMO it just isn't necessary.  In fact, sometimes it is just too risky on some jobs.  I have some jobs where I know water will get in if I do the top frame.  You just get to remember which jobs they are after a while.  Also, I have some jobs where, if I did the top frame, there would be a very good chance of nudging the tile hanging.  I'm not prepared to risk that.  However, on jobs where it is too risky to do top frame, you are absolutely right in saying that you must ensure that you don't splash the top frame while cleaning the rest of the window.  I can't understand people leaving sills either.  That sounds really shoddy even to a slob like me.
I don't get any appreciable complaints about quality either.  Most years I get none.  I might get one or even two in a very bad year - so I suppose I must be doing something right.

[geefree]

Anyway , you get my point

[Londoner]

The world is full of strange people, strange customers, strange window cleaners. Most of the complaints I have heard about window cleaners just comes down to plain lazyness most of the time. They want the money but can't be bothered to do the work.

[bobby p]

 everybody has bad phases ,especially when your minds on something else . who cares really ,as long as 90% of the time you are doing a good job


from what i know its only when a window cleaner hits the bottle and /or smoking dope that the problems get critical 

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

IMO If you are advertising that you clean the frames as well as the glass then that is what you should be doing.
Clean all the frame top to bottom at the end of the day you are charging (or should be) a higher price because you are cleaning everything.

Its like taking your car in for a full valet and polish and the cleaners leaving the bonnet!!

Do a 'top' job in fact 'do more than is expected of you' and you will be amazed with the results!
    

[poleman]

for gods sake!!! its industry best practise to clean the frames!! how close is close before you splash that top frame! thing is once the frame has been cleaned next time it only takes seconds to clean! come on guys get cleaning them frames or your just build up problems for future

To coin a phrase we are window cleaners not glass cleaners.

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

for gods sake!!! its industry best practise to clean the frames!! how close is close before you splash that top frame! thing is once the frame has been cleaned next time it only takes seconds to clean! come on guys get cleaning them frames or your just build up problems for future

To coin a phrase we are window cleaners not glass cleaners.

On the other hand, how close is close between the frame & a sandstone lintel?

Only the very best skilled operators can clean without doing the top frame. We are known as "WFP virtuosos"

[poleman]

well the gap between the glass and frame is zone but between the frames and wall is a hell of a lot wide that is for sure!!!

I have to agree some frames cant be cleaned with WFP I have some old wooden ones but in 95% of jobs frames have to be cleaned!

clean them frames chaps its industry best practise and your giving your customers a much better job which your going to retan there custom for years to come!

[Paul Coleman]

well the gap between the glass and frame is zone but between the frames and wall is a hell of a lot wide that is for sure!!!

I have to agree some frames cant be cleaned with WFP I have some old wooden ones but in 95% of jobs frames have to be cleaned!

clean them frames chaps its industry best practise and your giving your customers a much better job which your going to retan there custom for years to come!

OK.  I will jump up and down with glee as the lowest course of tile hanging crashes to the ground.  .
IMO so long as it's done usually, I see no harm in not doing frames sometimes when needing to speed up (sills excepted).  Of course if there is something on the frame like bird poo I will clean it off.  Mind you, I don't make frame cleaning part of the marketing.  Indeed, on frequent clean jobs, I even tell the customer that frames will be cleaned as necessary rather than saying I will do every part of the frame every time.  So, top frame most times.  Other parts sometimes - especially if visible debris on it.  Sills every time.  I see nothing wrong with that so long as you haven't promised the customer more.

[Craig 72]

Personally I will scrub the frames spotless on the first clean and then find that there might not be a need to do it again for ages.Still get great results.There are a fair few frames I do that the seal of window joins at the top of the glass.If you do the top of the frame the water can collect in here in some cases and leave hideous run marks.Far better to clean up to the seal and then rinse very carefully.