[andyM]

Well it can't be Project X, someone else has already got that one.
It must be Project Y or Z ? 

[Pope vader]

first off you dont own the custys,  if they want to go with some one else then that is up to them

if some one is undercutting you, then so what, it is called business,  every business does it why should wc be any different,  all you ever read on here is about wc making £200 a day and moaning am going to have to put up my prices like it is a skilled trade, and wc are in short demanding,  i have picked up loads of commecial lately because wc have put up there prices  blaming fuel, vat  etc,  and are only at the jobs 20 mins and business are saying i aint paying that

i think a lot of wc are scared of actually having to go out and get more work,

[Neil Gornall]

I can also guess who this is. I lost a job to them yesterday.

Not a major job, 3 bed with a large conny the whole length of the back of the house.

Job was underpriced at £11 so this company has gone in at around £10 I guess.
For that they also include the garge door.  :

Good luck to them at those prices if they can make a living. after paying 2 mens wages, fuel (30 mile round trip) VAT (if registered yet) bank charges, (30p if custy sends a cheque) they will be lucky if they make 4 quid out of it.
 

[Tom White]

i think a lot of wc are scared of actually having to go out and get more work,

I wouldn't say that scares me, but I don't like having to repeat work, and getting new business that's been poached by someone undercutting would mean repeating work (getting new work).

It takes absolutely no brains to undercut, however and fortunately, in my experience, customers tend to stick with the devil they know, and price is just one of the variables that they factor in when changing their window cleaner.

Other factors are:

Will this new window cleaner be reliable?
Will this new window cleaner do a good job?
Will this new window cleaner somehow be a pain in the bottom?

I think these things are 'unknowable' till after the changeover, and that's what puts off some folk when switching window cleaners; so is it worth the risk for a few quid?  Of course, for more prestigious contracts there's more scope for undercutting, but then there's health and safety issues to be considered.

Personally, and this is purely my opinion, undercutting isn't a good way to attract new business, and the only business you'll get is customers who're the type who know the price of everything, but the value of nothing.

[MNWC]

I live in a thirty mile radius of Boston and i think i know the company your talking about. Its not the first time ive heard the same story either.
 
However undercutting is not illegal but it is immoral and it will come back to bite them on there arse.

Its always best to get on with other windies even if its just a raised hand when driving in the opposite direction.

Although these windies work in my town they have never undercut me (i hope)  

THEY WOULDN'T DARE  

[SunShineCleaning]

I'm with Tosh on this one.

Price is only one factor. I would be unfazed if someone did this with my customers. I don't want 'price-shopping' customers, I don't need them as I have too many anyway.

Is it unethical? No I don't think so. I change energy companies each summer to get the best price, so I would be a hypocrite to suggest other wise.

However, with anyone that comes to your house, you become a bit fussy with who you want turning up.

I don't have the cheapest accountant, I have one I trust.

[Perfect Windows]

I'm with Tosh on this one.

Price is only one factor. I would be unfazed if someone did this with my customers. I don't want 'price-shopping' customers, I don't need them as I have too many anyway.

Is it unethical? No I don't think so. I change energy companies each summer to get the best price, so I would be a hypocrite to suggest other wise.

However, with anyone that comes to your house, you become a bit fussy with who you want turning up.

I don't have the cheapest accountant, I have one I trust.

Well, as the proud owner of a customer who left a £3.50 windy for me at £20, I don't fear undercutters at all.  (In case you're at all concerned for her, I cut the price to £16 when I realised that even for me it was a bit excessive!).

Vin

[Neil Gornall]

I'm with Tosh on this one.

Price is only one factor. I would be unfazed if someone did this with my customers. I don't want 'price-shopping' customers, I don't need them as I have too many anyway.

Is it unethical? No I don't think so. I change energy companies each summer to get the best price, so I would be a hypocrite to suggest other wise.

However, with anyone that comes to your house, you become a bit fussy with who you want turning up.

I don't have the cheapest accountant, I have one I trust.

I agree with what you say but the parent company of the window cleaners in question (dad) is putting me through a city and guilds at the moment, thats all about the right way and the wrong way to run a business. (so the customer trusts you) !!
I think if you ask 90% of window cleaners they would say this is not the kind of practices we want in this industry, Its counter productive for everyone involved yet here they are saying "do as I say not as I do"
hypocritical?

[mac74]

What a small amount of customers dont realise is that they are buying a service, not a like 4 like product - a window cleaner is a window cleaner in some eyes, but most of the time as they say u get what you pay for - ive watched a trad window cleaner do say a £12 house for a fiver but you can see why, no scrim work, frames, sills or doors etc, but if thats what the customer wants then fair enough. Ive picked up more work by this example charging more and doing the job right, than the other way around! Ive been out cleaning when some1 over the road has said "weve got a window cleaner, but how much do u charge"  Ill say why are u not happy with him? "yea but u might give me a better price"  Ill straight knock em back, and tell them that if you've got a good 1 id keep him! (But if they said he was poop then i would just price as normal without undercutting as most of the time im dearer anyway), Whats the point theres enough work out there! Thats what id call a mercenary customer, bcos u know a few months down the line they'll do the same 2 u! If your prices are fair and you have a good report with your customers and then they will stick with u 4 life!!! Thats my take on this business 

[GB Window Cleaning]

I'm with Tosh on this one.

Price is only one factor. I would be unfazed if someone did this with my customers. I don't want 'price-shopping' customers, I don't need them as I have too many anyway.

Is it unethical? No I don't think so. I change energy companies each summer to get the best price, so I would be a hypocrite to suggest other wise.

However, with anyone that comes to your house, you become a bit fussy with who you want turning up.

I don't have the cheapest accountant, I have one I trust.

I agree with what you say but the parent company of the window cleaners in question (dad) is putting me through a city and guilds at the moment, thats all about the right way and the wrong way to run a business. (so the customer trusts you) !!
I think if you ask 90% of window cleaners they would say this is not the kind of practices we want in this industry, Its counter productive for everyone involved yet here they are saying "do as I say not as I do"
hypocritical?

why do you want to get qualified neil out of interest?

[scud]

  I also posted on the thread, my post was deleted and the post locked with just their advertising their Facebook page.

  Marcus, you know who they are and that they are in your area as I believe you sold them a round.

  To my knowledge they haven't had a job off me yet, but they have managed to upset pretty much every cleaner around Spalding, I asked if they taught Risk asessments for the Health and safety side of upsetting the wrong people, which they have managed to do.

  It is wrong to ask prices then offer to do it for less, it is further out of order and hypocritical to preach good practices in a class room and then go out with underhand practices.

  I hope they have some good "safe cleaning" days and their practices do not "impact" on them.

  Perhaps they will see this thread and sort themselves out before this thread dissappears because we are obviously criticising some of window cleanings VIP's.

[Pope vader]

has any one got a link to the thread in question

[NJWindowCleaning]

What I have heard of some undercutting they only charge the lower price for a few Months to get the work and then every visits after that they up the price by slightly every month or two.

So what am I as one of my mates who's a wc and he hadn't cleaned this house since February and I tried to get hold of him to find out why, I tried contacting him by phone and left voice message on his answering service and even went round to his house but he wasn't there and left a card asking if it was ok but nothing came back.

So went to price it up and I didnknow that i was £3.00 more than him and got the job and on the first clean when I went back to be paid she asked if I could change the frequency from four weekly to three weekly.

So does that mean I am a overcutting  

[NBwcs]

"However undercutting is not illegal but it is immoral and it will come back to bite them on there arse.

Its always best to get on with other windies even if its just a raised hand when driving in the opposite direction.

Although these windies work in my town they have never undercut me (i hope"


Given the amount of very unhappy windies in Spalding at the mo, theres a very good chance it will bite them on the arse and soon, as a group we generally get on fine,odd bit of disharmony now and again but most "play the game" the way you should, building up rounds in a respectful manor. These tossers are well out of order, lost some myself to them, but im fairly laid back, I cant say the same for some of my colleagues.

[luther1]

Clean safe window cleaning. Yes or no?

[groundhog]

It's crystal clear to me who the company is because they advertise on here and are always banging on about the training courses they offer  
Sounds very underhanded to me if this is true.

That explains why the post I made on the thread about their training courses was deleted!!!!!  

[mikecam]

If you live within a 30 mile radius of Boston then there is a good chance you are experiencing undercutting right now.
I posted on here yesterday regarding this but my post was removed and the thread was locked so I assume the company involved may have something to do with this forum?
What is the general feeling towards undercutting?
This company is going around both business and domestic saying “do you want a window cleaner?” If they are told by someone that they already have a cleaner they say “how much are you being charged? Whatever it is we will beat it”
In my book this is wrong. Especially as this company promotes good working practices nationally.

YES undercutting is acceptable (to me). I'll charge whatever i feel like as long as i can make a profit. I don't see any contradiction between 'competitive pricing' and promoting good working practice. Infact i'll go so far as to say that the only thing that stops many undercutting is the fear of retaliation/retribution for doing so.
 WHat you are asking in laymans terms is...is it ok for someone to work for a price cheaper than me? And the only person qualified to give that answer is the guy with the purse strings. You're obviously disgruntled as it might cost you work. What this means ultimatley to you is that have to up your game to compete, you don't sound like you want to. Tough, live with it.

[Neil Gornall]

If you live within a 30 mile radius of Boston then there is a good chance you are experiencing undercutting right now.
I posted on here yesterday regarding this but my post was removed and the thread was locked so I assume the company involved may have something to do with this forum?
What is the general feeling towards undercutting?
This company is going around both business and domestic saying “do you want a window cleaner?” If they are told by someone that they already have a cleaner they say “how much are you being charged? Whatever it is we will beat it”
In my book this is wrong. Especially as this company promotes good working practices nationally.

YES undercutting is acceptable (to me). I'll charge whatever i feel like as long as i can make a profit. I don't see any contradiction between 'competitive pricing' and promoting good working practice. Infact i'll go so far as to say that the only thing that stops many undercutting is the fear of retaliation/retribution for doing so.
 WHat you are asking in laymans terms is...is it ok for someone to work for a price cheaper than me? And the only person qualified to give that answer is the guy with the purse strings. You're obviously disgruntled as it might cost you work. What this means ultimatley to you is that have to up your game to compete, you don't sound like you want to. Tough, live with it.

I can see your point and understand, however if you live in an area with two or three people with your attitude prices just get lower and lower until everyone is working for the same money as 20 years ago.
where is the good in that?

[bobby p]

folk on this forum are basically the nice guys. but out on the streets are hordes of undercutters who arent into computers or niceness  . if you live in a small rural town i imagine you should be worried if an undercutter crew gets going, but if a big town not such a worry

[mac74]

NG is right on the money, if a wc went direct to my clients to under cut me it would be hard not to take it personal, i think i would want to fill there head in!