[Paul Coleman]

i'm lost.

The way i read it was he was just giving you a few tips on maybe keeping your customers happy?

You've got a lot to learn about Malcolm then Steve.
He's always on the wind-up or offensive. I'm known him on here long enough to know when he's being sarcastic! Trust me, it wasn't nice. He knows I didn't need anyone's "help", that's why he did it.

Malc Gold be sarcastic??

Nah, never   

[cat9921]

As a customer what would you choose? Two window cleaners turn up and quote the same price and are both experienced and very good at their chosen method, one is WFP the other is trad, I know which one I would choose, the one which leaves instant results without having to wait hours for you windows to dry   and yes I am WFP     If I was never in until evening then I would probably not give a toss but choose trad anyway  

That can depend on the house  : if the trad window cleaner came to clean a house and said sorry I can not clean the one above your conservatory and in the winter the roof is too wet to go on so we'll just do bottoms and I missed that one out this time because there was a car in the way ........... and the WFP cleaners says not a problem and windows will stay cleaner for longer as well

Then which one do you think is offering the better choice ?

Squeaky Clean is not negative just honest the most people would prefer trad and trad is a excellent tool.....

if you go over to WFP you will lose customers but you will pick up work more suitable for WFP...

WFP is my prefered method to clean the windows ... But I have both tools and use what tool I need for the job 

Adders

[Sunshine/Cleaning]

I'm well aware this will start a Trad vs WFP debate, but that's part of it.

My point is this...

Are customers running out of patience with water fed pole cleaning?

It seems to me that's case, certainly in my experience.
I'm still gaining more work than I'm losing, but I have lost a fair few this year.
Most have said they're not happy with wet or "unfinished" windows.

I know it's not a quality thing, as no-one has any particular complaints, just the initial result.

When I've mentioned it to neighbours or friends of these people they've all said "Well I'm happy enough, but if I'm honest I preferred the old way"
Or "I did prefer the proper job you used to do, but understand you have to use this method now"

Now most of these are customers who I've had for years and have been done WFP for 3 and a half years now.

Could it be that they put up with it at first to avoid conflict and try to get on with it, but now the patience is wearing thin and they've had enough...?

I'm not overly concerned, as I get new work all the time anyway, but I can see many more who are "putting up with it" and will surely cancel soon.
I see a big opening for local trad cleaners...

Thoughts...? 

I think you have a point but maybe for a different reason. Maybe as things get tighter customers feel that WFP is the expensive option as they see all the tools needed. And with new trad cleaners about who don't know how to price for sustainable income, maybe they are hoping for a cheaper job.

[Sir Squeaky]

Roger,
You can always pass them my number. I'm happy to do them trad!

I'd be happy to if that's what they want mate. No probs.

And thanks Stuart and Cat. Good replies.
I think that's a very good point Stuart, it's probably them trying to cut corners.

On the opposite side of things I picked up two good sized ones today in the same street as a moaner, and they were both happy with the pole.
That said, so were the others at first... we'll see!

[darren clarke]

is ur area being knocked and you losing to new people, who are cheaper

[Sir Squeaky]

is ur area being knocked and you losing to new people, who are cheaper

I think areas are always getting knocked really.
Possible in some cases, but I don't think so in some, as they've said they're going to try and find a trad cleaner.

[darren clarke]

they might have already found one,  a newbie starting out who does trad,   i have had custy say they want to cancel for what ever reason, then find out they got a cheaper wc

[A & J Owen Window Cleaning]

We had one customer who absolutely refused to let us use wfp - so we did it trad. Today he was at his daughters who we do wfp - he was so impressed he said he would give it a go. The key thing is we listened and let him come around to it when he was ready.

If the customer doesn't like it we don't use it on their windows - simple as that. If there are dangerous access windows we just use it at that and explain why - no issue.

Thing is - it isn't always a perfect finish with wfp - whether people on here like it or not. At it's best it's fantastic - but sometimes the result is quite poor - for a variety of reasons.

The other thing that people on here should consider is that customers don't always complain they don't like wfp - they just look elsewhere and stop their wc without explanation. We have been approached several times by customers who don't like wfp and asked if we'll do it trad - I bet they hadn't said a word to their window cleaner - just stopped him.

[cat9921]

We had one customer who absolutely refused to let us use wfp - so we did it trad. Today he was at his daughters who we do wfp - he was so impressed he said he would give it a go. The key thing is we listened and let him come around to it when he was ready.

If the customer doesn't like it we don't use it on their windows - simple as that. If there are dangerous access windows we just use it at that and explain why - no issue.

Thing is - it isn't always a perfect finish with wfp - whether people on here like it or not. At it's best it's fantastic - but sometimes the result is quite poor - for a variety of reasons.

The other thing that people on here should consider is that customers don't always complain they don't like wfp - they just look elsewhere and stop their wc without explanation. We have been approached several times by customers who don't like wfp and asked if we'll do it trad - I bet they hadn't said a word to their window cleaner - just stopped him.

Not true there are windows that give problems i.e Spotting and so on

But there are ways to get this up to trad standard 

adders

[Matthew Bateman]

Thing is - it isn't always a perfect finish with wfp

Not true there are windows that give problems i.e Spotting and so on

Same thing mate

[gary999]

my answer to original statement by squeaky. is in this
economic climate some are going to feel the pinch and will
find any excuse  to cancel and wet ledges and windows is
a covenient excuse especially with the ladder boys still around.

more and more are turning to wfp locally by me so will be
become a less opportunistic excuse in the long term.

only problem with more wfp,ers is more competition i would
of rather stayed a rarity, with more cleaners using wfp the
standard of there work will come up and less will want to
switch to me!

[Sir Squeaky]

You make a lot of sense when you're not talking about football Gary!

[gary999]

You make a lot of sense when you're not talking about football Gary!

how dare you!! from a chelsea glory hunter...err sorry.. fan!
and all : :

[Tom White]

We had one customer who absolutely refused to let us use wfp - so we did it trad. Today he was at his daughters who we do wfp - he was so impressed he said he would give it a go. The key thing is we listened...

I love tradesmen like that.  Last year when I had my chimney swept, the chimney sweep tried to use a new fangled brush on a pole; ruddy big bog brush it looked like to me; so I refused to have them done like that.

Luckily enough he was a right soft touch and he brought round his four-year-old son and we did it the good old fashioned way, fnaaar fnaaar.

I love telling the plumber we use how to do his job too; it really brightens up his day.

[AuRavelling79]

Now now Tosh - you'll be on Roger's "naughty-step" with me if you carry on like that! 

[A & J Owen Window Cleaning]

this a good debate on what is a simple situation to a thread what the custie want they get and shown by a few comments posted that a few should grow up a bit

[dai]

Roger, I bet the ones that moan are the ones you converted from trad, probably in their 70's. I have had the same mate, in fact lost quite a few to a new young trad guy.
The younger ones are OK about it, and as stated elsewhere most of them are out when their windows get done.
The newer clients are no problem either, they knew what they were going to get.
Some of those fussy old uns hate WFP, you know the ones that used to inspect every window for the slightest squeegee kick, these now have to wait until the glass dries, by which time your gone.
I am amazed by how quick people forget that their frames are being done every time, you would think they were self cleaning.
Forget about them Roger, they belong in the past.

[Sir Squeaky]

You're spot on Dai.
Like I said, I'm not bothered. I pick up more than I lose anyway, just pointing it out in case others had seen similar happen.

[darren clarke]

Roger, I bet the ones that moan are the ones you converted from trad, probably in their 70's. I have had the same mate, in fact lost quite a few to a new young trad guy.
The younger ones are OK about it, and as stated elsewhere most of them are out when their windows get done.
The newer clients are no problem either, they knew what they were going to get.
Some of those fussy old uns hate WFP, you know the ones that used to inspect every window for the slightest squeegee kick, these now have to wait until the glass dries, by which time your gone.
I am amazed by how quick people forget that their frames are being done every time, you would think they were self cleaning.
Forget about them Roger, they belong in the past.

that could be the problem,  they have paid u have gone and they forget by the time u come back

[Ian101]

Not read all of the replies so may have missed something but the way I see it (I know i've only been going since June this year and still a newbie really) and this is no way a high and mighty comment / go stuff yourself mr/mrs customer type of reply or a rant of any sorts BUT what has it got to do with the customer how we choose to clean their windows ??

would they tell a plumber how to plumb (well apart from Bob Plumb  ) in their new bathroom or the gardener how to mow the grass or what type of mower to use ??

Its OUR safety and OUR choice of work method .... i'm currently still on ladders but will be WFP very soon and cant wait to sell me ladders on ebay as will only do WFP from the change over day .... Ive been getting concerned over how my customers are going to take the change but now the way Im looking at it is I firmly beleive that I can do just a good a job with WFP as I do with trad and if I had an accident would they give a stuff about me - a few would im sure but most customers concern would be findind another windie 

So who cares if theyre tiring of WFP - not me .... I CARE too much about my safety ... my long term well being and providing an income for my family ...

Some windies on here may say its got a lot to do with the customers as its their windows that are getting cleaned however I would not want to do business with a customer whos priority is  their choice of  window cleaning method over my safety.

Like I say not meant to be a high and might reply but if the odd one dont like it then fine no worries let them go find another windie .... me I will go and find 2 more customers that are ok with it