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Sean Rimmer

  • Posts: 4
? New
« on: December 25, 2003, 09:45:21 pm »
?

Majestic

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2003, 10:03:32 pm »
Do you sell the item in question ??? and what is the difference in price  for a bag ???  Do you know its xmas day , you should be with your loved ones 8)

jonesy5

  • Posts: 55
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #2 on: December 25, 2003, 10:09:55 pm »
You should be with them every day why only one day! :-/

STEVE71163

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2003, 11:54:45 pm »
Hi Dom,
          What size tank will fit in a Escort 55 van ??? And how long would the water in this last  ???

Steve

pure_genius

  • Posts: 47
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2003, 11:39:04 am »
dom

Why use colour change resin?

Are you suggesting that the companies that supply colour change resin are not bona-fide water treatment specialists? ???

or shall i translate that from the dom dictionary its crap and its not on our systems we sell!!

have a guiness its christmas!!!!!  8)

     

Pure_2o

  • Posts: 21
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2003, 04:16:14 pm »
Dominatrix - Is that another part of the Brodex service portfolio ?!?!?  

On this occasion Dom I must agree with you, the most efficient way of testing the output of any pure water system is by using a TDS meter.

At Pure 2O we too use standard MB 400 virgin resin in our industry standard bottle change systems and wouldn't suggest using anything different.

A TDS reading gives the user "peace of mind", as does crash testing !

Finally, I'd like to take this opportunity to wish everyone a happy xmas ( I know it's a bit late ! ) and a prosperous new year.

Cheers, back to the vodka !    ;D
Carl Stacey
Pure 2o Ltd.
www.pure2o.co.uk

STEVE71163

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2003, 04:33:53 pm »
Thanks Dom,
                  I will have to look into this in more detail ::) Does anyone on the forum use a 300ltr tank in an Escort 55 van ???

Steve

Bryan_Dolby

  • Posts: 330
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2003, 08:31:16 pm »
Steve
I have a 300 litre tank Fitted in a ford courier van
been using it for 6 months ;D
Only once had to go home to refill
Do not use all the time still use the tools
Contact me for more info ???

Bryan
Bryan Dolby
( Member F.W.C.)
My opinons are my own and nothing to do with the federation of window cleaners

STEVE71163

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2003, 09:26:59 pm »
Thanks Bryan,
                     I will contact you after the Christmas break and try and get a bit of information from you.  

Steve

Peter Fogwill

  • Posts: 1415
[b][/b]Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2003, 01:52:20 am »
Quote
Technical question for all pole operators to think about:
Some manufacturers use colourchange resin cartridges in their pure water machines to indicate the quality of water coming out of their machines. Bearing in mind colourchange resin costs considerably more than non-colourchange resin, yet does exactly the same job and is no better or no worse than non-colourchange resin at demineralising water ie. reducing TDS, why is colourchange resin used at all? To use an analogy, lets assume a TDS meter is a wrist watch. If someone asked you the time, would you walk outdoors and look for the position of the sun? and say, its about 3pm, or would you check your watch? Similarly, if someone asked you whether your pure water machine was producing good quality water?, would you look at the colourchange filter and say yeah, must be, its still got some life left because the filter has not entirely changed colour, or would you get your TDS meter out, and check it?
 I guarantee if anyone rings up any bona-fide "Water Treatment Company" and asks "what is the correct, accurate, reliable, foolproof way of measuring TDS in water, in the field" and they dont say " a portable TDS Meter" , I'll eat my hat.
 This begs the question, why use colourchange resin at all? Replies/comments not on a post card (Save the Trees Please :)) but on this forum
Dom

If someone didn't have a watch then they would not be able to look at the watch and tell the time.  If you don’t have it you cannot use it.

It may only cost £28.00 for a TDS meter, but some people just want a cheap DI cartridge to mess around with pure water, and the colour change resin is the cheapest way to do that.  Granted most people will go on and want a bigger system for purifying their water, and will end up with a meter of some sort, but until then the colour change resin is the cheapest way to go.

BTW[/u] a dual TDS meter comes as standard on all my small RO systems, as does a colour change DI resin cartridge.  Sometimes you do not realise it is getting so late because you have not checked your watch for a while, you see the position of the sun, this prompts you to look at your watch, and as you thought it is time you were doing what you had to do. Same as colour change resin it is just another visual aid to assure you that you are still producing pure water.

Peter


Mike_Boxall

  • Posts: 1394
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2003, 02:07:00 pm »
Quote
Hopefully this impartial advice helps point people in the right direction and remember, BRODEX sell everything, so our advice is not product driven, just technically and economically correct.


Do you sell colour change de-min resin?

Mike

Peter Fogwill

  • Posts: 1415
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2003, 04:06:06 pm »
Quote
Peter F
It seems that some suppliers of the pole equipment discussed on this forum just cant help themselves and on the guise of providing technical information they have to mention a feature and benefit of a particular system they sell (See Peter F above/Anything OTT post etc etc) Fellas, this transparently negates your impartiality and your technical advice is tainted, so the good and the bad just get painted with the same brush and end up looking the same colour-do not underestimate the intelligence of the users of this forum and their ability to make informed decisions! It is patronising and will ultimately turn them off as prospective customers.

You should know all about that

Quote

  Regardless of blatant product placement by Peter F, the fact that colourchange resin costs 2-3 times that of standard resin, clearly indicates which way to go if you want to save money and use pure water. If you want to experiment with pure water "messing about" as Peter calls it, the cheapest way is to buy a few gallons off a pole operator already established in your area. Talk to them nicely and I'm sure they will accomodate you at a much better rate than the local chemist and a lot cheaper than buying expensive colour change cartridges that you will end up throwing in the bin, because they are disposable!


Mines are refillable, and the customer gets the choice of colour change or non-colour change replacement resin.

What if there is not a pole operator in your area, or you don’t get on with them if they are?? Do you tell them Dom said you were to get it?

Quote


Refillable cartridges are available, colourchange and standard, you'll have to root them out, but they are without doubt the cheapest way to produce low volumes of pure water.


So now you have changed your mind?

Quote

Hopefully this impartial advice helps point people in the right direction and remember, BRODEX sell everything, so our advice is not product driven, just technically and economically correct.    


Yes and a pig just flew by my window.

Peter

Majestic

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2003, 04:24:06 pm »
Peterf
Do you crash test your products  ;D 8)

sham33

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2003, 04:25:34 pm »
Could i fit a 650 litre sytem in a Citroen Dispatch van?


Pure_2o

  • Posts: 21
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #14 on: December 29, 2003, 01:18:08 pm »
Dom,

Why can't you discuss crash testing ?

You're surely not being a chicken, sorry i mean turkey are you ?! ;)

...or is it because you simply don't do crash testing, so can't compete effectively in this area ?

Straight answers only please !
Carl Stacey
Pure 2o Ltd.
www.pure2o.co.uk

Peter Fogwill

  • Posts: 1415
Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2003, 02:32:49 pm »
Quote
Peterf
Do you crash test your products  ;D 8)


Sorry Majestic, I thought I had answered this.

No but I would like to.  I have not been in the business long, although I have been selling trolley systems for a couple of years, I only sold my first van system less than a year ago, OTT were selling systems for many years before they got round to crash test their systems.

There was a meeting last month on water fed pole safety issues, I think hosted by the FED, but unfortunately I didn't know anything about it until it was past, seemingly there was less than half the system manufacturers in attendance.  I would have been there had I been invited, I am all for participating in any of these events.

Peter

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2003, 03:56:20 pm »
Why use colour change resin? This was the original question posed by Sean.

For the first three years the Reach & Wash system used regular MB400 in regular column cyclinders, each system was sold with a TDS meter. Generally we never hear from a customer unless they have a problem, usually the kind of problems we heard of in those days was when a customer would ring up and complain that their system was leaving spots on their customers windows. Our first question was; what is your TDS reading? Common answers where, d'know, lost the TDS meter, d'know the TDS meter is not working, d'know what is TDS?

Despite the training and despite issuing an instruction manual, window cleaners in general just want to get on with their work and pay little attention to maintenance of their machine. So we'd send them a new TDS meter in order to establish if the problem was down to water quality or some other factor. Meter reading comes back high, so we send out new filters and bag of MB400. All very well, but what has happened?

The customer was unable to use the machine with confidence while all this got sorted out, and once it was had to go back over some of his work in order to satisfy his customers who had complained. This situation does little for the reputation of the window cleaner nor the reputation of our Reach & Wash systems.

The solution was to make it a no brainer so we use colour change resin in a clear filter cartridge of our own design and manufacture (Doesn't a company that  manufactures its own filters that have been independently tested by the Water Research Council qualify as a water treatment company?). Now customers can see at a glance if their water quality is OK. This leads to a higher quality window cleaning service from Reach & Wash users than from users of other systems. In turn we get less complaints about water quality which means that our customers get less complaints about the quality of their window cleaning service. These days, on the rare occassion that a customer does ring our first question is; what colour is the colour change filter? if its not blue then the problem is very quick to resolve and the customer has less down time, he also knows how to look out for the same problem in the future.

In window cleaning time is money not the cost of one type of resin over another. TDS meters go out of calibration, get lost, broken, stolen, dropped into buckets of water. Colour change is quick, simple, delivers and causes less down time, and because of this works out to be much, much cheaper. If the old way was any good, then we'd still be doing it would'nt we?

Dom, we're IONIC SYSTEMS LTD not OTT any more!

regards

Reuben

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2003, 05:01:24 pm »
Quote
All Pole Users
Re. Crash Testing...Please refer to the latest press release from the NFMWGC...pure 20/OTT, little tinkers just mischief making...! Poor Peters not up to speed yet, been left in the dark I'm afraid.
Dom


Sean,

What do you mean... "little tinkers just mischief making...!" ?

Regards

Reuben

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2003, 05:22:41 pm »
Sean,

I'd like to clarify that Ionic's Linear colour change filters are in fact refillable. We encourage customers to return spent filters in return for a small refund, because we control the refill process we can ensure that the spent resin is disposed of in an environmentally friendly way and in complience with legislation. This protects our customers from the risk of prosecution that they may face if they dispose of spent resin themselves in an in appropriate way.

We do not encourage the dumping of spent resin that may arrise as a result of customers changing resin themselves.

By making our filter systems easier to use by the inclusion of a colour change DI filter we are not insulting the inteligence of those purchase them. In fact its intelligent window cleaners who choose them! For those who understand window cleaning as well as they understand chemistry, its not a cost issue, at £50 upwards per hour its downtime thats best avoided.

regards

Reuben

Re: Why Use Colour Change  De-Min Resin?
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2003, 05:43:10 pm »
Sean,

The refund is more than £2, and we do not suggest that spent filters should be sent back to us.

You are wrong about the re-fill ability of our filters.

You are wrong about the refund value.

You are wrong about the means of return.

You are wrong about the meaning of the NFMWGC's press release.

You are wrong about the "blank faces" at the meeting that took place at Summerfield House on 3rd Dec 2003.

You are wrong about the validity of our product testing.

regards

Reuben