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shammy davis jnr

  • Posts: 543
what will i need
« on: October 19, 2007, 07:50:07 am »
ok guy here is the senario
i have a 1000ltr thermo ,unit  thats it i have five employees
when i do the change over should i a have one van mounted our for mainly domestic what would you do to maxamise what you have i have enough work then some to keep them going 40hrs a week trad and two vans
do i
A.put tanks in the vans and let them work from them with trollys our back packs ,
B.buy a big van for my comercial only and decant in to two smaller tanks
c.keep one squad trad while introducing the wfp to my custys
d.have the thermo in the garage just as a refil stop ...
no bs just guys in the know answer plz
 as im starting in feb wfp but just dont know what way to go
and what if how many custemers should i exspect to lose by the change  ie 7% etc
i dont mind finding out my self but at this size it could prove costly
so fore armed is fore warened i supose
so come on my wc buddies give the davis some good answers to this senario
many thanks
shammy davis

Alex Gardiner

  • Posts: 7742
Re: what will i need
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2007, 08:19:28 am »
What a great place to be in. Lots of work and a Thermo 1000 litre unit (£8-15k).

If you are serious about switching over to WFP with that many employees then forget the backpack/trolley route. (Option A)

Only go down the route of Option C if you have enough work that will always stay Trad, i.e, a lot of commercial inside work, otherwise just make the switch completely.

Both of your other two options are feasible, albeit with losing some of the advantage of a thermo pure system.

If you go for Option D then I would switch off the heating on the Thermo-Pure as it will be of no value. If you choose this route to run 3 vans from, then you may need another tank (IBC 1000litre £35) as a secondary storage. If you then have 3 vans with a 500 litre tank in each, you simply fill up each morning and go off to work whilst your system will replace the water in about 6-7 hours.

Option B would also be feasible and would have the advantage of utilising the Thermo-Pure in at least one of your vehicles. Decanting would take a bit of time - you would either need a 12v sub pump to stick in the thermo tank and pump across to your other tanks or rig up a multi fill system so that overnight the system filled all 3 tanks at once.

What I would do is the following: (only my opinion)

There are two real options when it comes to running multiple vehicles with WFP.

Option 1

Have a suitably large holding tank at base (either 1 or 2 IBC tanks £35-70) with a suitable RO system feeding them. A couple of 300gpd RO-Man units (£500) would do if you have good water pressure or one 4040 system (£650). Then have a Submersible pump and hose (£70) to fill all three of your vehicles tanks each morning. You could fit whatever size tanks you think would work in your vehicles. I would say a minimum of 500 litres for a two man domestic round team, 300-400 litres for a one man team and 800 litres for a two man commercial team. This is the cheapest and most reliable method of running multiple teams.

Option 2

Have a tank and overnight RO system in each vehicle. If you are on good water pressure then a simple 300gpd RO-Man system in each vehicle (£750) with shut off valves. Or a 4040 system in each van (£1950). This does give the option of the vans filling in separate places and even topping up if needed. The disadvantage is cost and a lack of a reservoir of water for quick refilling.

Using your Thermo-Pure.

You could fit the Thermo in with either system, Option 1 would give you the advantage of using the good 4040 base on the Thermo, all you would have to buy would be a 1000litre IBC and sub pump.

Fitting it into Option 2 would save you having to buy one of the RO systems and would mean that one van used the heating part.

I presume that the Thermo-Pure is second-hand (otherwise it would be rigged up in your van already by Ionics). If so, why not sell it and this would completely fund all of the parts (RO's, tanks, pumps, vehicle tanks etc) for either option above.

Just my thoughts having spent 7 years running a multiple vehicle set-up. I use Option 1.


shammy davis jnr

  • Posts: 543
Re: what will i need
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2007, 09:18:42 am »
i thank you for your insight this gives good food for thought but would you not kit out the thermo in a large van ie the flag ship all sining version for demo,s etc ie for building more comercial work ,which will take time ,
so how would you do it this considered i mean could it be sitting in the drive from time to time so could i use  it to fill the others our decant as you say into a sholts container in garage ,i am new to this so any more help will be very much appreciated
the unit its self has only done 30 hrs work long story but is virtually brand new just so i have my mind set as to which way i am going when im ready to start in feb

Re: what will i need
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2007, 09:30:50 am »
i thank you for your insight this gives good food for thought but would you not kit out the thermo in a large van ie the flag ship all sining version for demo,s etc ie for building more comercial work ,which will take time ,
so how would you do it this considered i mean could it be sitting in the drive from time to time so could i use  it to fill the others our decant as you say into a sholts container in garage ,i am new to this so any more help will be very much appreciated
the unit its self has only done 30 hrs work long story but is virtually brand new just so i have my mind set as to which way i am going when im ready to start in feb
Use the thermo pure in a big van and aim that for your commecial work, singing and dancing is good, use IBC's at base to make water and pump in like Alex said, this way your lads will not have to remember to do it and also you will always have water

Alex Gardiner

  • Posts: 7742
Re: what will i need
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2007, 09:45:01 am »
Sounds fine.

Set up a large Van with the Thermo-Pure as your Flagship vehicle as you say.

The easiest way then, as window washers says, would be to set up a separate 1000litre IBC (£35)with an overnight 300gpd RO (£250) (if your water pressure is good or 2x 300gpd if not) this would then get pumped (£70) into your other two vehicles. This would be far easier to use than having to fiddle around with transferring from your Flagship van.


tonylee

Re: what will i need
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2007, 01:26:02 pm »
hi
i did not lose any customers when i changed to wfp.
before i changed i told everyone of my customers that with the current h. and s. laws i was considering the change to a new safer working practice.
i explained the benifits and that it would cost me to set up and that i would not be passing on the cost to them.
i asked each one to support me for the first three cleans explaining that the first couple may leave white spots and after the first three cleans i would swap back if they were not satisfied.
the first week of my 4 weekly cycle was a complete nightmare, i would not take anyones money untill they had dried and with 30% i had to do 1 or 2 windows again. two or the houses needed to be completely redone.
one of these houses tried to cancell at this point but i reminded him that he had agreed to give me three goes and re-did him there and then for nothing.
the second week of the cycle i was getting better and had a lot less to redo.
18 months on i oftan ask people if their happy and ask them if they would like me to change back. without excetpion they all say no and like the benefits of clean frames and glass that stays cleaner longer.
i did exspect to lose 10% of my 200 customers but lost none its all in the communication
tony.

shammy davis jnr

  • Posts: 543
Re: what will i need
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2007, 02:00:49 pm »
all sound advice i thank you for the posts so far on this matter

mark dew

  • Posts: 2901
Re: what will i need
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2007, 02:10:26 am »
i would not take anyones money untill they had dried and with 30% i had to do 1 or 2 windows again. two or the houses needed to be completely redone.

That's the best safeguard you could have for not losing customers due to the quality of the finish.
If you do this i would be suprised if lost anymore than 1/2 a dozen (to pluck a figure from the air). As there is bound to be someone or 2 who won't like wfp period. Not after being used to seeing nice clean dry windows when done trad.
It's better that you or your teams check these yourselves as some people think its the end of the world when they see a wfp finish with spots the 1st time. And if you rely on them to tell you, they are just as likely to cancel than to ask you to come back.
I lost i think 3 due to finish (and not doing the above) after the 2nd clean and i got rid of 3 more because i couldn't be a$$ed to explain again and again before they dropped me.
After doing what tony suggests i have not lost 1 new customer to date.

Re: what will i need
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2007, 06:45:58 am »
Alex's answer should be a sticky.

I want a thermo pure now. Can you get them smaller- my vans a Scudo- and can you get them without the water purifying bits?

LWC

  • Posts: 6824
Re: what will i need
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2007, 09:09:07 am »
what would you do to maxamise what you have i have enough work then some to keep them going 40hrs a week trad and two vans

did i hear maximsing a days work. the only way is this mate


Dean Aspects

  • Posts: 1786
Re: what will i need
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2007, 09:13:17 am »
LWC you know you are only going to start the silly comments about safety with that pic ::)

 ;D ;D ;D

Dean

LWC

  • Posts: 6824
Re: what will i need
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2007, 05:42:39 pm »
LWC you know you are only going to start the silly comments about safety with that pic ::)

 ;D ;D ;D

Dean

its the onnly way to optimise a days work though  ;D

shammy davis jnr

  • Posts: 543
Re: what will i need
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2007, 06:10:45 pm »
 ;D ;D lwc has took wfp to the next level and fitted it in a tardis  rock and roll big boy pmpl ;D ;D

shammy davis jnr

  • Posts: 543
Re: what will i need
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2007, 01:54:54 pm »
so is this the best way to say 30 houses in a row some times fifty with closes ,gardens etc  how many say council type houses could you do of one trolley -our back pack  surley this will still be quicker with two mun one up one down working of ladders plz prove me wrong and as to how wfp will be quicker i dare say on lovely big glass fronts yes ,but when it comes to doing 100 houses a day how does it perform pros and cons plz
much obliged shammy  ???