[dazmond]

i hate swivels for WFP.it feels like im working with a pole and brush with a broken neck!

[Slacky]

I use a Gardiners swivel. Love it.

[Don Kee]

i hate swivels for WFP.it feels like im working with a pole and brush with a broken neck!

Buying one next year then?

[P @ F]

Didnt a member on here by the name of Gaz sell a shed load of brushes to members some years ago with these ball sockets on ?
Everybody loved them as I remember , then he just vanished !!
Anybody know what happened to him and his brushes ?

[H MAN]

Here's video did with the swivel movement on brush heads.
And how we us it vertical on the glass.
We just using it on a straight pole with quick-lock connection to it.
But it is even more versatile if you have a angle adapter on it.
We are using our first prototypes they are bit different to look at now.
But this gives you some idea how it works.
 1/  https://youtu.be/8PNfqj6ODUs
2/  https://youtu.be/vDZ4EJfNGs0

[Spruce]

Didnt a member on here by the name of Gaz sell a shed load of brushes to members some years ago with these ball sockets on ?
Everybody loved them as I remember , then he just vanished !!
Anybody know what happened to him and his brushes ?

Gary Hollins was his name and his address was in Newcastle under Lyme.

He took a floor brush with a swivel that worked similar to a U joint on a propshaft, cut the mechanism off the floor brush, cut the molded screw in brush holder off the Salmon brushes he was using and screwed the swivel mechanism to the brush.

With the brush horizontal on the glass, the swivel worked fully left to right. He screwed in screws as a stop to restrict the mechanism working in the other direction (up and down). This was to stop the brush falling or flopping foward when offering it up to the glass.

There were a number of us who ordered these swivel brushes from Gaz. Unbeknown to us and probably to him as well, the manufacturers of the floor brush replaced the brush and used a different swivel design. Gaz couldn't adapt this new design to work as a wfp brush swivel. I think he tried to send out his orders using these ball swivels.   

I was one who, in 2007, sent off a cheque for 3 brushes and 2 swivel adaptors. The cheque was banked and despite numerous telephone calls there was no brushes and no refund. He kept saying that all orders would be shipped by that Friday. He was shocked when he was told that no brushes had been received the following week. He blamed the postal service, he promised proof of dispatch, but it was all lies. He left the forum and disappeared.

I learnt a lesson from my experience never to buy product from a window cleaner other than through a bonified internet site such as Ebay where I have some sort of redress.

.



This brush was the replacement floor brush and you can see the swivel is totally different.
https://www.hillbrush.com/uk/hygiene/floor-brushes/professional-extra-stiff-197mm-swivel-scrub-with-universal-joint/

[P @ F]

My other half just looked up Gary Hollins on Facebook and found one who just happens to be a W/C  !
I will say no more 

[H MAN]

Using the brush vertical like in the video.

There's no need to use spray bars, booster pumps to get more water on the glass, etc.

Just use a normal brush with pencil jets.

Because you are cleaning with bush vertical it's flushing the glass as you scrub.
So there is no need to rinse it over again. 

[H MAN]

Here is the swivels on other brushes, doodlebug ,microfiber mop heads.

Can replace any type of swivel movement on broom, brushes as seen in this video.
https://youtu.be/vaPR71UKZPw

[Spruce]

Using the brush vertical like in the video.

There's no need to use spray bars, booster pumps to get more water on the glass, etc.

Just use a normal brush with pencil jets.

Because you are cleaning with bush vertical it's flushing the glass as you scrub.
So there is no need to rinse it over again.

Booster pumps???

As I mentioned on your last advertising/promotion post, its neigh on impossible to clean a window at height with a vertical brush. I tried it. You can do it in Australia because your house that you practise on is a single story (barr the one window that's slightly higher due to the slope of your garden.)
The method of cleaning at height is to rock your arms back and forth whilst standing infront of the glass with the brush horizontal. For larger or should I say longer panes of glass we include a step forward and backwards to give the brush a longer stroke.
The only time a swivel is useful is to get into the upper far corner of the glass /frame with your brush flat on the glass if you are standing to the side; eg., cleaning the window above a conservatory roof. I found a swivel a hinderance if I was trying to clean downstairs window cills to the side because of limited space.

You are trying to promote a dead idea. The world of window cleaning has evolved, at least here in the UK.

Willie doesn't like you and you him, so the only other options are the main squeegee manufacturers, Unger, Ettore, etc.

Its pointless trying to sell a fleet of company cars by promting your product to the night porter or office cleaner. You need to speak to the right people. Your swivel idea isn't going to make Gardiners add it to their Quicklok portfolio. If they haven't jumped at it yet then there is every possibility they won't do it in the future. (They have a brush holder that angled slightly which was added because of their clients requests for that.)
https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/all-products/water-fed-poles/goosenecks-pole-fittings/gooseneck-parts/quick-loqr-angled-swivel-brush-socket-adapter.html

Sorry, but frankly speaking, my advice to you is to put this swivel to bed and look for another game changer that will assure you an income stream into your looming retirement years. The swivel concept isn't going to do this.

As a young man my desire was to own and drive a stockcar. I drove a stock car but I didn't have the financial resources or the skills to make that happen even although I believe I had the ability to succeed as a driver. As I didn't have financial backing any driving talent I had or thought I had wasn't enough. Now I know at this late stage in my life that this was a desire and a dream that will never happen. I'm long since over that disappointment. I've moved on from it.

[H MAN]

So because you have tried all the swivels on the market and can not get on with them.
There is nothing that will??

Far as I've seen all swivels on the market made up of something that's already out there one way or another.

Regarding the bigger companies really do not expect them to take it up.

WHY This would obsolete what they  already have.

You said yourself you can't emulate  the way I use the swivel on our pole.
 
And the only thing different to the others is the actual swivel movement.

Here is one did at height  30 feet   https://youtu.be/OCkuBvZOFME
Here we are using  white scrubbing pad on the pole.




 


 

[H MAN]

OH must of missed this.
https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/all-products/water-fed-poles/goosenecks-pole-fittings/gooseneck-parts/quick-loqr-angled-swivel-brush-socket-adapter.html
Is this the latest swivel

[Alex Gardiner]

So can you tell why it will not work on WFP brush without even trying it?? 
As said if the are any manufactures or companies that wait a licence  to make these PM me.
Alex  Gardiner would you be interested.? You  know our E-Mail address.

Hi Herman

I have had a look at your latest videos and this probably is not something that we would be interested in spending the tooling costs on producing. We very much focus on the WFP market and have purposely stayed away from the Traditional Tool market – there are plenty of firms who produce very good trad tools already - Unger, Ettore, Moerman, Wagtail, etc.
It may be worth taking your concept and Patent directly to one of these firms and seeing if they would be interested in working with you 

The downside for you (and manufacturers) with the square connector system (Quick-LoQ) was that it was something that could not be patented as there were already other companies making similar systems for other industries and the fact that you had already publicly posted videos of your ideas - this is why it took some time for me to be interested originally and to be honest I only took a real interest after a direct request from you 

Since answering your forum request to look at making a square brush connection system we then had to spend about £18,000 on initial tooling, testing and refining and have since spent at least another £14,000 on various tooling for Quick-LoQ items.

We are glad that we did follow this idea through as it has advantages, however most of these goosenecks are ‘given away’ with poles so the payback on the tooling does take a long time. I know that you enjoyed having production versions to work with and you were able to work with and test our first versions as we made them – it may have only been a ‘bowl of soup’ for you, but for us it was an expensive and potentially risky bowl! There were many production challenges with these items and producing a marketable, finished product took a long time designing, testing and refining by us before I was able to send you a finished and workable product for your own use.

We do already produce several different swivel options for the Quick-LoQ range and could probably produce many more different variants, but there is a limit to what will make a commercial return on the tooling costs. Many of these swivels have been produced directly in response to client requests or ideas – one very handy client even sent us a fully working and handmade prototype of a swivel with a request for us to make it – it did take a few years, but we eventually worked our way to it! There are also many more requests and ideas that we have not pursued as I feel that they would have even more narrow market appeal.

I know that you have subsequently been working with Mark Russo of WWWCS in Australia on your own brush connector & gooseneck products which are even named after you! – the ‘Wiel-Loc’ connector range. Is Mark not interested in working with you in the Australian market on this idea – could you not incorporate it into the products that you already make/sell with him? This would perhaps be your fastest way to market with your new product.

[M & C Window Cleaning]

OH must of missed this.
https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/all-products/water-fed-poles/goosenecks-pole-fittings/gooseneck-parts/quick-loqr-angled-swivel-brush-socket-adapter.html
Is this the latest swivel

I’ve used the Gardiner swivels for several years now and get on with them really well. This more recent Q-Lock version has been great as the swivel action is closer to the brush and it also is now easy to swap brushes over quickly when needed.

[Spruce]

So can you tell why it will not work on WFP brush without even trying it?? 
As said if the are any manufactures or companies that wait a licence  to make these PM me.
Alex  Gardiner would you be interested.? You  know our E-Mail address.

Hi Herman

I have had a look at your latest videos and this probably is not something that we would be interested in spending the tooling costs on producing. We very much focus on the WFP market and have purposely stayed away from the Traditional Tool market – there are plenty of firms who produce very good trad tools already - Unger, Ettore, Moerman, Wagtail, etc.
It may be worth taking your concept and Patent directly to one of these firms and seeing if they would be interested in working with you 

The downside for you (and manufacturers) with the square connector system (Quick-LoQ) was that it was something that could not be patented as there were already other companies making similar systems for other industries and the fact that you had already publicly posted videos of your ideas - this is why it took some time for me to be interested originally and to be honest I only took a real interest after a direct request from you 

Since answering your forum request to look at making a square brush connection system we then had to spend about £18,000 on initial tooling, testing and refining and have since spent at least another £14,000 on various tooling for Quick-LoQ items.

We are glad that we did follow this idea through as it has advantages, however most of these goosenecks are ‘given away’ with poles so the payback on the tooling does take a long time. I know that you enjoyed having production versions to work with and you were able to work with and test our first versions as we made them – it may have only been a ‘bowl of soup’ for you, but for us it was an expensive and potentially risky bowl! There were many production challenges with these items and producing a marketable, finished product took a long time designing, testing and refining by us before I was able to send you a finished and workable product for your own use.

We do already produce several different swivel options for the Quick-LoQ range and could probably produce many more different variants, but there is a limit to what will make a commercial return on the tooling costs. Many of these swivels have been produced directly in response to client requests or ideas – one very handy client even sent us a fully working and handmade prototype of a swivel with a request for us to make it – it did take a few years, but we eventually worked our way to it! There are also many more requests and ideas that we have not pursued as I feel that they would have even more narrow market appeal.

I know that you have subsequently been working with Mark Russo of WWWCS in Australia on your own brush connector & gooseneck products which are even named after you! – the ‘Wiel-Loc’ connector range. Is Mark not interested in working with you in the Australian market on this idea – could you not incorporate it into the products that you already make/sell with him? This would perhaps be your fastest way to market with your new product.

And here's a man with his finger on the pulse and still has enough time to read my drivel.

Interesting expansion on the basics facts of Quick-Loq (I better get this spelling right in future) production. I'm surprised but would have expected tooling costs to be a lot higher tbh.  Now we can understand in a little more depth why Herman is beating this drum so often.

[Spruce]

This is interesting

https://windowcleaningsupplies.com.au/wwwcs/angle-adapters-pole-connectors/wiel-loc-angle-adapter-and-parts/

So maybe Herman is going to have something to top up his pension with.

[H MAN]

So can you tell why it will not work on WFP brush without even trying it?? 
As said if the are any manufactures or companies that wait a licence  to make these PM me.
Alex  Gardiner would you be interested.? You  know our E-Mail address.

Hi Herman

I have had a look at your latest videos and this probably is not something that we would be interested in spending the tooling costs on producing. We very much focus on the WFP market and have purposely stayed away from the Traditional Tool market – there are plenty of firms who produce very good trad tools already - Unger, Ettore, Moerman, Wagtail, etc.
It may be worth taking your concept and Patent directly to one of these firms and seeing if they would be interested in working with you 

The downside for you (and manufacturers) with the square connector system (Quick-LoQ) was that it was something that could not be patented as there were already other companies making similar systems for other industries and the fact that you had already publicly posted videos of your ideas - this is why it took some time for me to be interested originally and to be honest I only took a real interest after a direct request from you 

Since answering your forum request to look at making a square brush connection system we then had to spend about £18,000 on initial tooling, testing and refining and have since spent at least another £14,000 on various tooling for Quick-LoQ items.

We are glad that we did follow this idea through as it has advantages, however most of these goosenecks are ‘given away’ with poles so the payback on the tooling does take a long time. I know that you enjoyed having production versions to work with and you were able to work with and test our first versions as we made them – it may have only been a ‘bowl of soup’ for you, but for us it was an expensive and potentially risky bowl! There were many production challenges with these items and producing a marketable, finished product took a long time designing, testing and refining by us before I was able to send you a finished and workable product for your own use.

We do already produce several different swivel options for the Quick-LoQ range and could probably produce many more different variants, but there is a limit to what will make a commercial return on the tooling costs. Many of these swivels have been produced directly in response to client requests or ideas – one very handy client even sent us a fully working and handmade prototype of a swivel with a request for us to make it – it did take a few years, but we eventually worked our way to it! There are also many more requests and ideas that we have not pursued as I feel that they would have even more narrow market appeal.

I know that you have subsequently been working with Mark Russo of WWWCS in Australia on your own brush connector & gooseneck products which are even named after you! – the ‘Wiel-Loc’ connector range. Is Mark not interested in working with you in the Australian market on this idea – could you not incorporate it into the products that you already make/sell with him? This would perhaps be your fastest way to market with your new product.

And here's a man with his finger on the pulse and still has enough time to read my drivel.

Interesting expansion on the basics facts of Quick-Loq (I better get this spelling right in future) production. I'm surprised but would have expected tooling costs to be a lot higher tbh.  Now we can understand in a little more depth why Herman is beating this drum so often.

Hi Alex,
Could you E-Mail me ,
Can give more then just videos.
Oh the quick lock we have on it is only so we can  fit our quick locks connections on it..
And it will have a euro thread connection as it is more universal then Quick lock. type connections
And if the people that have quick lock type connection can get one of these.

 

[H MAN]

i hate swivels for WFP.it feels like im working with a pole and brush with a broken neck!

Can see why you would think that.
You talking about these swivel movements??