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Oliver @ GrippaTank

  • Posts: 356
Re: Hydro heat Grippa?
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2014, 10:53:44 am »
Good Morning,

I hope the following answers your questions with regard to the GrippaPower smart charge relay system.

Obviously the following information is in connection with our systems and the specific kit we use, and may not apply to the batteries or systems you have installed, if they are not a GrippaTank supplied kit.

All of our systems are fitted with the Lucas/ Numax range of batteries which are sealed. These days, this range of the car and leisure batteries are all basicly exactly the same – I.e they are sealed.  The difference being the plate design.

The car battery is designed to withstand a massive and sudden draw of power on start up (I.e vehicle startup) and then be recharged by the alternator. This is where Robert's question comes to mind – the battery you have is designed for a very high rate of sudden draw when called upon (ie to start a vehicle).

A leisure battery is deep cycle – which means the plate design allows for a slow and prelonged draw of power over a long period of time. This means a leisure battery is better suited and indeed designed for the continuous drain / recharge / drain / recharge etc. Thus the leisure battery is the recommended for use in our industry, as most of the systems require relatively little power in comparision to a vehicle battery – it just needs to be drawing pretty much continuously over the course of a day / night.

A bench charger will also charge at a lower rate to an alternator. There are two factors to this – 1/. the quality of the charger (as a very lose guide, the cheaper the charger, the less power it will be able to give the battery), and 2/. most bench chargers are designed to be trickle charge – hence a maximum of 13.9v / 10-15amps. Some bench chargers do however have a boost button, which will give a battery a charge of 30 – 40 amps.

Our split relay is capable of charging upto 100 amps, but obviously is limited by how much power the alternator is capable of giving you (which on older vehicles may only be about 30 – 40 amps). The split relay has a smart trigger which will always 1/. put your vehicle battery and power first, 2/. then once this has been done, will supply the system battery the full charge required. Because of the processor in the split relay – it will then calculate weather a full power charge is required (I.e the full 30 – 40 amps = a boost) or weather a low trickle charge is required (I.e 10amps). So if you upgraded your alternator on your vehicle, and the alternator was kicking out 80 or 100 amps for examplle, which can be found for example in HGV's, larger LCV'S or marine applications, the leisure battery will accept the full charge.

The key being the processor, which is always calculating what is required for the vehicle and what is required for the system.

As Robert says, our split relays really do work. We always have been of the thought, that where possible, the systems should always be a “fit and forget” from a power of view (Not refering to maintenance, as this should always be done of course. However, lifting a battery in and out of a van every day shouldnt be part of a professional system routine). We have had a large amount of customers in the past who were very nervous of split relays, because maybe in the past they have tried them and they do not work etc. However, once changing over to our split relays, they have found this has answered their issues. In fact, our engineers often fit our power packs to competitors systems in order to solve the power issues.

We have one customer, who literally works in the next street from his house, his regular daily journey being about 30 – 40 seconds to work (this has been timed by the customer!). So obviously in this case, the customer is recommended to bench charge at the weekends as well, as the alternator barely kicks in before he arrives at his job!

However this is the first and only customer who has to do this, every other customer we supply, never has to worry about power, even with our HydroHeat kits, because the split relay takes care of the batteries.

I hope that answers the questions!
www.grippatank.co.uk - The home of the GrippaMAX crash tested cleaning system. Contact us on 0800 098 8407 or enquiries@grippatank.co.uk

concept

  • Posts: 1048
Re: Hydro heat Grippa?
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2014, 07:57:50 pm »
A little bump for Grippa.

These responses are an example of why they get our money.

Everything is looked at, studied, studied again, and done for the right reasons, not just a marketing exercise to relieve you of your money.

The tanks are superb. Not like Wydale tanks that are not made for the purpose. These don't suffer leaky lids, you don't suffer from water movement causing excess wear on vehicle components, let alone the driver and passengers feeling like they are on a boat!

I could go on and on, but will refer you to another rambling:

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=174888.0

Spruce

  • Posts: 8431
Re: Hydro heat Grippa?
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2014, 10:04:42 pm »
Good Morning,

I hope the following answers your questions with regard to the GrippaPower smart charge relay system.

Obviously the following information is in connection with our systems and the specific kit we use, and may not apply to the batteries or systems you have installed, if they are not a GrippaTank supplied kit.

All of our systems are fitted with the Lucas/ Numax range of batteries which are sealed. These days, this range of the car and leisure batteries are all basicly exactly the same – I.e they are sealed.  The difference being the plate design.

The car battery is designed to withstand a massive and sudden draw of power on start up (I.e vehicle startup) and then be recharged by the alternator. This is where Robert's question comes to mind – the battery you have is designed for a very high rate of sudden draw when called upon (ie to start a vehicle).

A leisure battery is deep cycle – which means the plate design allows for a slow and prelonged draw of power over a long period of time. This means a leisure battery is better suited and indeed designed for the continuous drain / recharge / drain / recharge etc. Thus the leisure battery is the recommended for use in our industry, as most of the systems require relatively little power in comparision to a vehicle battery – it just needs to be drawing pretty much continuously over the course of a day / night.

A bench charger will also charge at a lower rate to an alternator. There are two factors to this – 1/. the quality of the charger (as a very lose guide, the cheaper the charger, the less power it will be able to give the battery), and 2/. most bench chargers are designed to be trickle charge – hence a maximum of 13.9v / 10-15amps. Some bench chargers do however have a boost button, which will give a battery a charge of 30 – 40 amps.

Our split relay is capable of charging upto 100 amps, but obviously is limited by how much power the alternator is capable of giving you (which on older vehicles may only be about 30 – 40 amps). The split relay has a smart trigger which will always 1/. put your vehicle battery and power first, 2/. then once this has been done, will supply the system battery the full charge required. Because of the processor in the split relay – it will then calculate weather a full power charge is required (I.e the full 30 – 40 amps = a boost) or weather a low trickle charge is required (I.e 10amps). So if you upgraded your alternator on your vehicle, and the alternator was kicking out 80 or 100 amps for examplle, which can be found for example in HGV's, larger LCV'S or marine applications, the leisure battery will accept the full charge.

The key being the processor, which is always calculating what is required for the vehicle and what is required for the system.

As Robert says, our split relays really do work. We always have been of the thought, that where possible, the systems should always be a “fit and forget” from a power of view (Not refering to maintenance, as this should always be done of course. However, lifting a battery in and out of a van every day shouldnt be part of a professional system routine). We have had a large amount of customers in the past who were very nervous of split relays, because maybe in the past they have tried them and they do not work etc. However, once changing over to our split relays, they have found this has answered their issues. In fact, our engineers often fit our power packs to competitors systems in order to solve the power issues.

We have one customer, who literally works in the next street from his house, his regular daily journey being about 30 – 40 seconds to work (this has been timed by the customer!). So obviously in this case, the customer is recommended to bench charge at the weekends as well, as the alternator barely kicks in before he arrives at his job!

However this is the first and only customer who has to do this, every other customer we supply, never has to worry about power, even with our HydroHeat kits, because the split relay takes care of the batteries.

I hope that answers the questions!

Thank you for reply.

I have a Citroen Relay which has a 150 amp alternator. My leisure battery is a 110 amp h CXV31MF. If that is 3/4 fully charged, the best my alternator is doing is charging that battery at is 5.4 amps.

If I now wired up your Samlex BS100 dual, what amperage would I now expect the battery to be charged at. My battery was fully charged this morning having been on charge overnight with my Numax 10 amp motor home intelligent battery charger. I used around 350 litres of water today at a flow of water through the brush's jets at 1.75l per minute. So mathematically I was using the pump for just under 3 and half hours on the glass, which my gut feel tells me is about right.

My pump draws about 4.5 amps at that flow, so I have used about 15 amps of current. Today I have driven 12 and half miles and have been on the road driving/engine idling for 40 minutes.

The battery has stood idle for 4 hours and the volt meter reads 12.5 volts. The numax battery charger reports that the battery is above 75% and below 100% and is charging the battery at 4 amps. The voltage across the battery will read 12.8v tomorrow morning.

Will your battery separator keep my leisure battery fully charged with around 20 to 30 minutes of engine running time each day?

Will a 2nd leisure battery need a second unit, or can both batteries be charged from the sames unit?

Thanks

Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)

Oliver @ GrippaTank

  • Posts: 356
Re: Hydro heat Grippa?
« Reply #23 on: March 03, 2014, 07:28:18 am »
Hi Spruce,

Thanks for your question and patience while awaiting our response.

If you wired up our Grippa SmartCharge relay system, and you were using the correct cabling etc, the relay kit will send through as much as what your leisure battery requires.

If the battery is flat, you will indeed get a high amount of amp through (with our relay kit being capable of supplying 100amps from the vehicle alternator if needed). However as your battery is 3/4 full, the alternator would only need to top up the battery rather than fully charge, therefore it's output would be lower. Therefore the alternator will only send what the battery requires.

The limiting factors are how much current the battery actually needs (ie is it flat or just needs topping up?), the size of cable used in the setup and how much current it can convey, and then the fused rating of the relay kit.

Our kit is indeed perfectly capable of keeping the battery looked after, however as mentioned above - the key is your alternator and what that allows the relay to take.

With regard to the 2nd battery setup, as you only have one charging device on the vehicle (the alternator), there would only be one relay required. The two system batteries would need to be wired in parallel.

I hope that helps!
www.grippatank.co.uk - The home of the GrippaMAX crash tested cleaning system. Contact us on 0800 098 8407 or enquiries@grippatank.co.uk