[Tony Gill Carpet Smart]

CAN I USE ULTIMATE MASTER IN A PROCHEM STEAMPRO 2000 WITH HEAT EXCHANGER THAT RUNS AT 68 deg ALLTEC SAY MAX 60 deg ANYONE USED IT IN PROCHEM AT HIGHER TEMP AND HOW DID IT PERFORM CHEERS TONY

[Graeme@Access]

Tony,

Please. please please dont use ALL CAPS because its like shouting.  Whenever i read it, it kind of offends me.

I have used a steempro with the heatexchanger and UM.  It seemed do perform as well as fibresafe gold, but with a bit less foam and a nicer smell.

From what i have read about heatexchangers, they will run much below stated temp.  Unless you were putting in very hot water (rarely get household water above 60) then i imagin it wouldnt sustain >68°C for long.

Im not entirely sure why alltec state such an exact figure of impending doom.  Above 60°C the product will decompose faster (2 times faster for every increase of 10°C), but the timescale of heat to floor to waste is very short.  Running it at 68°C at the heat exchanger then <60°C very shortly after shouldnt be a problem.  It would be surprising to learn otherwise.

Hope this helps

Graeme Thurston
Access Cleaning Solutions

[Ken Wainwright]

Ultimate Master is, or certainly was, self neutralising. Elevated temperatures will kill this ability.

When I used it many years ago, I found it to be quite corrosive to my heater element and thermostat probe. But I don't know if the formulation has changed since.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

[stevegunn]

The liquid ultimate master is formulated to be used at higher temps I believe

[the red carpet]

It is but you loose the self neutralising with the liqued, and my tub of um says dont exceed 65 degrees not 60

[paul wright]

i used a tub of this once stuffed up  my machines up daily

[Tony Gill Carpet Smart]

Thanks for your replys have cut the capitals i am new to the carpet cleaning industry painting and decorating for nearly 24 years and always passed the carpet cleaning on but have decided to offer it as an added service but we have a lot to learn Cheers Tony

[Ian Gourlay]

In my opinion always ask on here  but also check with supplier.

Unlike Paul or is it    I have not had problems with Ultimate Master. I find it a good product.

I am not an Alltec Chair Leader just happy with the product.

[Mike Halliday]

whats an Alltec chair leader?

I bought 2x20kg tubs the last time i was down at there place and it lasted about 6months.

i mixed it staight in my cold freshwater tank and never had any problems.

Mike

[Graeme@Access]

Ultimate Master is, or certainly was, self neutralising. Elevated temperatures will kill this ability.

When I used it many years ago, I found it to be quite corrosive to my heater element and thermostat probe. But I don't know if the formulation has changed since.

Ken, do you think running it marginally over the recommened temp will insta kill the self neutralising ability.  I figured that you would probably loose some, but only a minor amount by the time it hits the floor.

Interesting your note about the corrosivness of UM.  I have seen a similar scenario with prochems Fibresafe gold.  If you leave it in the lines overnight, it looks allmost brown when you first turn the pump on.  God knows what its doing to the guts of our prochem.

Graeme
Access Cleaning Solutions

[Ian Gourlay]

  A Chair Leader is the leading Cheer Leader   You know I cant spell

Cheer Leaders is Marketing Stratergy Number............

[stuart_clark]

i used to use ultimate master for years and thought it was a great all rounder chemical,I never had any problem with corosion as far as i am aware ! It smells nice it disolves easily and cleans a treat and is very reasonably priced unlike some chemical suppliers who put the cost of there chemicals up every year or sooner ! i will not mention there name but I am sure we all know who they are!

[Ken Wainwright]

Hi Graeme

I wouldn't know about the temperature. Could you be sure your guage is accurate?
Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

[Geoff Jewkes]

When I used it many years ago, I found it to be quite corrosive to my heater element and thermostat probe. But I don't know if the formulation has changed since.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

Its now call NEW ultimate master. It`s been re formulated but what they`ve done I don`t know.

[Graeme@Access]

Hi,

I guess any gauge (although our prochem doesnt have one) would contain a marginal error.

I think the inline heater that carpetsmart says runs @ 68°c, would definately run a bit higher.  I still wonder wherether it would make a big difference.

Eg: Liquid woolsafe (although not a self neutralising product) states that it cannot be used above 60°C.  If you look at the bottom of a 5litre drum that has been in your unit for any length of time it has quite a lot of junk floating around in it.  However, they dont give it a shelf life.

The kinetics of decomposition (asumming first order rate constant) at room temp would be X.
At 60°C they would be 16-32 X.  So say 30times faster.

Residence time in a machine thats running @ 60 with an inline heater would be....15 seconds from heater to floor.  Thats being generous.

Scaling that to room temp, the bottle would go off in 30x15sec....7.5minutes.

Surely, the manufacturer is just saying... dont use this too hot.  Not, @ 60°C this product will self destruct.

Food for thought at least

Graeme
Access Cleaning Solutions

[Steve Dudley]

Prochem have got a new high temp one called Heatwave (www.prochem.co.uk) and Ashbys have a new one which I have used called Supreme Powder Extra (www.ashbys-uk.com). It's got a scale inhibitor built in too, so it's be good for your heating system.