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maxcarpets

FAKE TAN !!!!
« on: August 08, 2006, 09:03:53 pm »
Anyone had to deal with fake tan stains ( successfully? )

Regards



Justin

the red carpet

  • Posts: 1162
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2006, 09:16:35 pm »
best iv managed is to lighten it with hydrogen poroxide
and that took ages :(

colin thomas

  • Posts: 813
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2006, 10:06:46 pm »
hope that it's water based and it will come out easily, at least it did for me and i looked a proper hero!!!

colin     ;D
colin thomas

Mark Stanley

  • Posts: 237
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2006, 06:56:31 pm »
The oil based fake tan is a pig - on the two occasions I have come across it - I tut and shake my head.  Almost no chance on light carpet - unless some one can tell me otherwise
NCCA

Geoff Jewkes

  • Posts: 654
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #4 on: April 03, 2007, 05:56:53 pm »
Any developments on removing this ???  Have poly prop carpets to do tomorrow with fake tan stains on them, obviously I've told the customer theres slim to no chance of removing this !   Thanks, Geoff

Graeme@Access

  • Posts: 380
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #5 on: April 03, 2007, 08:07:11 pm »
Hi,

I took 21 fake tan stains out of a wool tufted today with premixed peroxide and ammonia.  It was like she had sprayed it all over her bedroom :o

If its a big area or many spots i would suggest 2 visits.  Turn up with a hairdryer and show them that it will come out with heat.  Then put down the basic peroxide on the rest and leave.  Come back the next day and do a clean and protect.  That way it saves you sitting around with a hairdryer for ages.

Its easy to remove from wool and i would imagine this would parallel to synthetics.

test test test  and im sure you wont do any damage.

Besides, its nice to remove stains that the big franchises say will never come out.

Hope this helps

Graeme Thurston
Access Cleaning Solutions

Edit: Do any of you know what the browning compound is in fake tan?  I think its an iron chelate that decomposes to give the brown colour, but have never really done any reading into it.

murky

  • Posts: 627
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2007, 08:18:38 am »
Go on then, can you explain what the hair dryer does and what is the percentage of peroxide/ammonia to do this, as I have had a few of these to do and of course explained  that we cant get them off.

Ken Wainwright

  • Posts: 2107
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2007, 10:43:21 am »
According to a respected Australian source:

 Dihydroxyacetone is the active ingredient that makes you go brown.

Safe and happy cleaning :)
Ken
Veni, vidi vici, Vaxi
I came, I saw, I conquered, I cleaned up!

Graeme@Access

  • Posts: 380
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2007, 03:08:16 pm »
Hi,

To explain a bit further, heat will catalse the reaction, ie make it go faster and you will see an immidiate response from the stain.  Every 10°C increase in temp doubles the reaction rate.  There is a thermodynamic principle that would bore you, but equates to simple statement above.

The ammonia removes the acidic stabilisation of peroxide.  Essentially a peroxide anion has a higher (or lower i cant rem off the top of my head) reduction potential than peroxide.  It is the active species that perfoms the reaction.  When peroxide is alkali, the active species predominates in solution, hence it reacts faster.

Combining heat and alkalinity gives you the potent bleach required for fast colour removal.

I never measure the amount of ammonia i mix with the peroxide because its not important as long as there is enough to make the solution alkai.  Essentially, if you can smell the ammonia, theres enough.  It reacts with the phosphoric acid stabiliser that is present in pharma grade peroxide.

I use peroxide @ 6% that you buy from the chemists.

Thanks for the heads up Ken, ill have a read into it.  I still think its a metal that gives the colour, and the dihydroxyacetone oxidises the metal centre.  But thats a guess, so i will look into it.

Hope this helps

Back to work  8)

Graeme Thurston
Access Cleaning Solutions

Ken Wainwright

  • Posts: 2107
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2007, 03:19:09 pm »
Hi Graeme

Would the application of steam be a suitable use of heat as a catylist?

Looking at your original post Graeme, does it mesn that you applied heat without chemical? If so did the stain "evaporate into thin air" or was it absorbed.

You then go on to say that you .....left the basic peroxide on the rest...  I presume this to be without the ammonia accelerant?

I deduct from all this that your experiences say that the added ammonia would be used if you are staying on the job to complete removal?

Forgive me if I am "nit picking", but I just want to have a clear picture in my mind.

Safe and happy stain removal :)
Ken
Veni, vidi vici, Vaxi
I came, I saw, I conquered, I cleaned up!

Graeme@Access

  • Posts: 380
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2007, 03:47:11 pm »
Hi Ken,

Ok Ill clarify and my posts so far are as clear as mud.  I will probably include this as an article in our site, so come and visit us for better description and pictures.

We got called in to deal with Fake tan carnage that 2 major franchises in our area had knocked back. There were no fewer than 21 individual stains.

The test
This is essential!!!!  Never miss it out if your going to use our method for removing fake tan.
In an area that is hidden from sight, apply a small amount of premixed ammonia and peroxide (see above for quantities and reasoning)  Heat this to dryness with a hairdryer.  If you are going to loose any
colour from the carpet this will show it up.  Some lightening is to be expected, but if its a major colour change then walk away now.

The first spot removal
This will show the customer that its going to work, so pick the darkest and nastiest looking spot.  If you dont hit 22 spots on the same carpet then you could use this to remove all of them.  It would have been too time consuming for me to do this to every spot, so i did it with the first one to prove to the customer that it would come out.  Apply a small amount of premixed peroxide ammonia to the spot using a sponge.  Wear gloves if you dont want white fingers.  I dab the solution on then gently rub with the sponge while applying heat from a hairdryer.  When its nearly dry, evaluate the colour change.  If its nearly gone, continue with the heat and gently rubbing untill its completly gone.

If its still there in its full glory, aplly more peroxide/ammonia mixture and repeat.

I had to undertake 2 applications to get our test spot to budge.

The remaining spots
Apply a larger volume of premixed peroxide/ammonia and gently rub in the mixture with a sponge.  Open a window and ask the client not to walk on the spots for the rest of the day.  Basically, the reaction will still occur, but much slower.  Inform the client that you will return the following day and undertake a full clean and protect of the carpet.

The best bit about this job was that the client was so happy the following day, she offered to pay us the full amount without us undertaking any other work.  All the spots had gone and this was the primary reason for the call.  Alas, i convinced her that the carpet would benefit from it and we would be happy to proceed.   So we cleaned and protected the carpet, blending all of the minor light patches left from the bleaching.  I think she will be reffering us and this was our main objective.

I hope this is a bit clearer.

If anyone has alternative techniques for removing fake tan, i would be very interested to hear them.

Graeme Thurston
Access Cleaning Solutions

Edit:  Kens point about steam >> I prefer to concentrate the peroxide using dry heat, i guess steam would still work, but it might be a bit on the hot side and you could run into problems.  Using a hair dryer gives you 2 effects.  It concentrates the reacive species and also provides heat to catalyse the reaction.



Ken Wainwright

  • Posts: 2107
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2007, 06:40:40 pm »
Thanks for that Graeme.
I've also sent you an email.

Safe and happy cleaning :)
Ken
Veni, vidi vici, Vaxi
I came, I saw, I conquered, I cleaned up!

Geoff Jewkes

  • Posts: 654
Re: FAKE TAN !!!!
« Reply #12 on: April 04, 2007, 07:12:11 pm »
Thanks Graeme, printed off the post and put it in the " spot cleaning hints file" !  Used Red RX allowed to dwell for 20 mins ( no heat ) while I did other areas of the house, rinsed it then used sodium metabisulphate to finish ! Barely visible and custermer said WOW   ;D . She had priced up a new carpet and she now says doesn`t need one !  :) ;D