[Les]

Hi all,

Looking for some advice regarding what is thankfully an unusual situation for us.

Had an elderly customer who I've worked for several times previously contact me to say that she had an embarrassing stain on her hallway carpet.
An elderly visitor had been caught short en route to the toilet and to cut a long story short, she now had an excrement stain on her light coloured carpet which was apparently only a few weeks old.
She had tried the dreaded vanish but surprise surprise, without the desired result.

I went along a few days later and attended to the stain incorporating some extraction. I showed her what had been removed and explained that despite her immediate effort there had been rather a lot left in the carpet. I also cleaned the entire hallway area and a rug to give her value for money and to remove other stains of which there were quite a few.

A few days later she rang to say that the stain was still visible and rather dark. I popped along again and explained that the situation hadn't been helped by her initial rubbing of the stain which had stripped the pile making it stand out. I also thought that due to the amount of residue in the carpet there may have been some wicking.

I agreed to treat the stain again if she wanted it to be lighter with a weak mix of de browning solution. She agreed to this on the friday that the work was carried out. Upon completion she then said she thought the stain was now rather lighter than the rest of the carpet. I agreed that it was, however this was also made more obvious due to the pile damage I mentioned earlier. I also said that as the mark was right next to her kitchen floor, (hard floor) and toilet, (hard floor) that it would darken slightly over time.

On monday morning I picked up a message to say that she was very unhappy with her carpet and I needed to go round, which I did first thing. I explained that she was hardly likely to see a change over a weekend but she said I hadn't told her that. My partner who had been with me on the friday heard me tell her but she was having nothing of it.

I suggested that she then consider using her insurance but she refused point blank saying it was down to me and I needed to replace it at my expense only being a  few weeks old.

I contacted the company she purchased it from and it had in fact been installed in November last year. The replacement cost for her hallway even without underlay....£850 !!

I feel really disappointed and annoyed that having completed the initial job at a giveaway price to help her out she is now trying to take advantage of the situation.
I have run the business here for now 16 years with only one previous incident of any kind and that was in the early days so it's not like I go round doing this all the time.

Your advice will be gratefully received.

Les

[Jonathan Evans]

Hi Les sounds a nightmare plus she sounds very unreasonable..... You can't reason with the unreasonable  contact your insurance with the above info and let them sort it out. I do not think you will get any joy from her as she has set her sight on a new carpet and has most likely been told by someone that you are liable.

Did you do a survey and get it signed?

Best wishes
Andrew

[Mike Gwilliam]

A few days later she rang to say that the stain was still visible and rather dark. I popped along again and explained that the situation hadn't been helped by her initial rubbing of the stain which had stripped the pile making it stand out. I agreed to treat the stain again if she wanted it to be lighter with a weak mix of de browning solution. She agreed to this on the friday that the work was carried out. Upon completion she then said she thought the stain was now rather lighter than the rest of the carpet. I agreed that it was, however this was also made more obvious due to the pile damage I mentioned earlier. I also said that as the mark was right next to her kitchen floor, (hard floor) and toilet, (hard floor) that it would darken slightly over time.

Easy for me to say but I would say to her that she was aware that the carpet had already been possibly damaged and to invite her to take legal action.

The fact that she had already tried to remedy the stain could also have damaged the carpet so she is in the position of taking the first action.

Many insurance companies will not cover a claim where the customer has used something on the carpet before trying to make a claim.

[Ian Harper]

Les

old saying about as you was last person to work on area you own the problem. unless as already said you have survey signed or declaimer. and now come the really bad news your insurance requires the survey or they will not pay out. best way out bribe here with a few hundred if she then signs to say she have agreed that you are not reasonable and the money is a gift of good will.

it sucks when people do this, I feel your pain.

[JandS]

If you have gone to rectify an existing problem and failed does not mean you now own that problem.
Return the money paid and walk...the carpet was already damaged.

[Steve Chapman]

In a situation like this I would sit & do nothing.....

They have damaged the carpet, you have tried to remove the stain and been partially successful..... she would have hard time proving you have damaged it if you have used professional products.

You also wouldnt be there in the first place if they hadnt already made the stain, so from that point the carpet is already damaged and doesnt warrant you  paying for a new one.

I would stand your ground, you cant set a precedent where you pay people whenever a stain isnt fully removed or there is colour change.

The only thing that might be possible is to add some colour back with dye sticks or a carpet dye.....?  Dye sticks are quite quick and easy to use and can be removed if not right before you heat set them........ just a thought.

Its always worth getting a picture of the stain before you do anything as people do tend to have selective memory when it comes  to what it looked like previously.

Steve

I wouldnt think your insurance would pay out & I wouldnt want to involve them as its admitting you were neglegent.

[John Kelly]

First of all do not involve your insurance comany, keep them at arms length and use them as a last resort.
The carpet was already stained and damaged by the customers removal attempt. I would state these facts in writing and leave the ball in her court. Even if she did pursue it she doen't have a leg to stand on.

[Dennis]

I agree with John.
If any body should put their hand in their pocket it should be the person who dumped on it in the first place.

[Hilton]

DO NOT OFFER HER ANY MONEY

This would be construed as an admission of guilt on your part and your insurance, should you go down that route, would not look on this favorably.

This is a straight forward case of best intentions gone bad,
I would write out on headed paper the details starting with the loose bowels call out and attempted remedy on her part which no doubt caused irreparable damage, Vanish should not be used on a wool carpet and this should be part of the letter followed by your  attempts (not guarantees) at removal and should also include that you have in all probability removed any contaminants and that's all you could be expected to achieve given the circumstances.

Then as John says pass it over to them to deal with as they see fit, I doubt you will hear any more but if you do then stand your ground ,If they decide to take it further get an independent report carried out before involving your insurance, they (your insurance) will then see you have done all you can to set it right and should back you against any claim.

I doubt it will get this far though.

[John Kelly]

This a common occurance and highlights the need to have a written survey form and terms and conditions. Then these issues can be nipped in the bud at the survey stage.

[neil 47]

You don't feel liable in anyway , the only way to resolve it is say .

Fair enough take me to court . Time to put the onus on her .

[davep]

Tell her to claim off the person that dumped on it.  Odds are it was her all along.   

[josephus]

I suspect that she is an insurance chaser. Had that once when window cleaning. Asked me to clean one window then claimed I scratched it. It was entirely a coincidence that he was fitting (What he told me was) the biggest triple glazed window in domestic home in Ireland.

I had insurance and I don't know the law, perhaps i'm obliged to give them the details but honesty, screw them!

I sent them I polite letter telling them I refused to take the blame and gave them the name of my solicitor as they would be defending me.

I never heard from them again.

[Stoots]

Is there any proof you were ever there?

If everything was done over the phone deny everything.

[CleanerCarpets]

She is probably being fuelled by someone else

You know what old duckies are like for chit chat, she has probably mentioned it to someone else but bent the truth of the whole thing to say it how she wants to and the other person has said i would claim against his insurance if he did that to my carpet.

Stand fast - put your opinion in writing and send by recorded - tell her you have no responsibility and you can never guarantee complete removal of marks etc especially when its been DIY cleaned first.